The one in the four way cavern if I recall.
I don't know you are keeping the way to avoid permastuck in a spoiler tag. Seems like the one thing you'd want to let everyone see even if they haven't yet started Hero song part of the main story.
Archived M2K2 Forum
I did the Desert crap which I want to skip from now on first, then I tried to do the Forest, but figured it was blocked because we already knew who the dragon was or something, and then found out I have to fight Mister Imprisoned Fish again. And then I did the last, stupid swimming portion.
Anyways, started on Hero Mode, and I'm planning to do it 100% first (Because I didn't do 100% on the normal mode), and then a minimal challenge.
Anyways, started on Hero Mode, and I'm planning to do it 100% first (Because I didn't do 100% on the normal mode), and then a minimal challenge.
Quote from TheOthin:
I don't think it's a matter of quality so much as content. With all the forced fetch quests and unskippable dialogue, I found myself not yet wanting to go through it a second time, despite regarding it as an amazing game.
yeah to be honest my second run's not that great anymore as well. i'm really glad when i'm done with it soon and can go on to playing oot.
red chamber dream
Quote:
i also love how much effort they put into the instruction manuel. it's more than 100 pages big!
damn dude, the american one isn't nearly that large, just the three common north american languages. but i do appreciate how nintendo has always included full-color manuals with every game. they and capcom are like the last of the big companies to do so.
Quote from TheOthin:
With all the forced fetch quests and unskippable dialogue...
Just over the weekend a code to increase dialog speed was released 160x which makes it instant (thought there is still a minor delay between pages). Unfortunately there still isn't a code to skip
the collection of the stupid notes when faron woods are flooded. Easily the worst part of the game.
red chamber dream
finished with 100% today. wall of text final thoughts with possible spoilers of the whole game ...
i loved:
i have mixed opinions on:
i hated:
overall a pretty good game. i'd rate it a 7/10 and would sum it up as a large game that felt too small.
i loved:
- the art. for the most part, extremely well done. the character models are the best they've been since wind waker. zelda in particular looked great. also thought the "watercolor" blur they use to hide the shitty draw distance was used to good effect, and the animation and artwork in dungeons was top-notch. i always love seeing how nintendo draws fire - it was amazing in tww and almost equally amazing, albeit different, in this one. the overall graphic style was a very nice mix of tww and other zeldas and was the perfect choice for this game. it's just a shame there's so many jaggies and the game still looks like relative shit on my big tv. fuck sd.
- the characters, especially skyloft's. was fucking awesome to see them return to the more silly style of wind waker. in general the skyloft characters were all pretty funny, some of them among the best characters ever in a zelda game. the fortune teller in particular was flat out hilarious, and the little touches like rupin the item seller getting all frustrated when you walked away from his counter without buying anything. i loved groose as well, both in the beginning and when he redeemed himself by the end. was also really funny to see stuff like rupin's personality totally change when you visit his house at night. i also couldn't get enough of the little sounds the characters make, like the item check girl, bertie, and, of course, beedle.
but by far my favorite character in the game is mother fucking stritch: his extremely fucking creepiness when you visit his room at night coupled with what he says and the sounds he makes were my favorite part of the whole game. that's the kind of japanese weirdness of dialogue and characterization i love in a zelda title. felt very majora's mask which is among the highest of compliments i can give to a game.
- the item check girl. i already mentioned i love the characters, but dear god the item check girl is awesome. totally got her to love me and we're probably gonna get married. <3
speaking of which ...
- the sidequests. though they're nowhere close to being as involved as those in majora's mask, but that's not a bad thing. they fit the game rather well, and many of them were rather funny, albeit usually not very substantial.
- the shield system. it took me a while to warm up to, but shields were implemented fairly well. i found myself using the shield more and more as i learned when it was effective, which was great. in previous zeldas i never really used the shield during combat, while ss got me to whip it out fairly often. that's kind of cool for a series that includes largely useless shields in every fucking game.
- the upgrade system. it wasn't perfect, and it would've been nice to be able to upgrade more items, but it was a step in a cool direction for zelda games and actually provided a use for all the random shit you pick up during the game.
- the rupee system. finally, they got it (mostly) right. i constantly wished i had more rupees and never had too many until the very end of the game. the only
- the dungeons. this is more of a hesitant "love" because i definitely didn't like them as much as any of the previous games'. it just never felt like the dungeons got much larger or more complicated. as much as i wouldn't have thought i'd be saying this, i think the lack of block/torch puzzles actually makes them less fun. more puzzles, please. maybe i'm remembering wrong, but it felt like it took ages to get through oot's forest temple the first time. that fucker was huge, and fun the entire way. there's absolutely nothing like it in skyward sword, which was kind of disappointing, though i suppose no games after mm have been able to match that. twilight princess came close maybe.
in contrast, most of ss's dungeons were 1 or 2 levels, had only 1 or 2 keys to find, and almost always made it extremely obvious where you needed to go. the only true standout dungeon to me was sky keep, which was totally fucking awesome in every way. i love when environments in games feel totally cohesive like that. but still, the rest of the dungeons were fun while they lasted, and i didn't dislike any of them.
- the characters, especially skyloft's. was fucking awesome to see them return to the more silly style of wind waker. in general the skyloft characters were all pretty funny, some of them among the best characters ever in a zelda game. the fortune teller in particular was flat out hilarious, and the little touches like rupin the item seller getting all frustrated when you walked away from his counter without buying anything. i loved groose as well, both in the beginning and when he redeemed himself by the end. was also really funny to see stuff like rupin's personality totally change when you visit his house at night. i also couldn't get enough of the little sounds the characters make, like the item check girl, bertie, and, of course, beedle.
but by far my favorite character in the game is mother fucking stritch: his extremely fucking creepiness when you visit his room at night coupled with what he says and the sounds he makes were my favorite part of the whole game. that's the kind of japanese weirdness of dialogue and characterization i love in a zelda title. felt very majora's mask which is among the highest of compliments i can give to a game.
- the item check girl. i already mentioned i love the characters, but dear god the item check girl is awesome. totally got her to love me and we're probably gonna get married. <3
speaking of which ...
- the sidequests. though they're nowhere close to being as involved as those in majora's mask, but that's not a bad thing. they fit the game rather well, and many of them were rather funny, albeit usually not very substantial.
- the shield system. it took me a while to warm up to, but shields were implemented fairly well. i found myself using the shield more and more as i learned when it was effective, which was great. in previous zeldas i never really used the shield during combat, while ss got me to whip it out fairly often. that's kind of cool for a series that includes largely useless shields in every fucking game.
- the upgrade system. it wasn't perfect, and it would've been nice to be able to upgrade more items, but it was a step in a cool direction for zelda games and actually provided a use for all the random shit you pick up during the game.
- the rupee system. finally, they got it (mostly) right. i constantly wished i had more rupees and never had too many until the very end of the game. the only
- the dungeons. this is more of a hesitant "love" because i definitely didn't like them as much as any of the previous games'. it just never felt like the dungeons got much larger or more complicated. as much as i wouldn't have thought i'd be saying this, i think the lack of block/torch puzzles actually makes them less fun. more puzzles, please. maybe i'm remembering wrong, but it felt like it took ages to get through oot's forest temple the first time. that fucker was huge, and fun the entire way. there's absolutely nothing like it in skyward sword, which was kind of disappointing, though i suppose no games after mm have been able to match that. twilight princess came close maybe.
in contrast, most of ss's dungeons were 1 or 2 levels, had only 1 or 2 keys to find, and almost always made it extremely obvious where you needed to go. the only true standout dungeon to me was sky keep, which was totally fucking awesome in every way. i love when environments in games feel totally cohesive like that. but still, the rest of the dungeons were fun while they lasted, and i didn't dislike any of them.
i have mixed opinions on:
- the controls. for the most part, i loved them, but a few things just didn't work properly all the time, namely shield bashing and sword thrusts. i'm sure they work if you do the exact correct motion every time, but i don't always do that because i'm a human playing a video game. the controls should work perfectly every time like every other game, and they didn't always in here. but i understand that's an inherent problem with motion controls, and they did work rather well for the most part, and i thoroughly enjoyed playing with them. the bird controls in particular were great - one of the few times i've actually enjoyed using tilt controls rather than a joystick (not saying it's better, but it was a nice change).
- the story. most of it was pretty good; i loved the stuff in the knight academy at the beginning, and i liked how the ending was a prelude to the later games. unlike others i don't have a problem with demise's characterization at all: i thought the way he fit into the story was great, and the old lady turning out to be impa genuinely surprised me (throughout the game i was wondering what zelda character she could possibly be, because she just had to be a well-known character. so at least i got that right). i also loved seeing shit like sky keep fitting together with the sealed grounds.
but overall the story didn't do much for me: it never felt like we spent enough time with the characters, and not many of them were interesting enough to make me think about after playing the game. in contrast, several moments in majora's mask still pop up in my mind once in a while - meeting the skull kid at the beginning, putting mikau to rest, etc. skyward sword's scope just felt so small and just wasn't all that interesting.
- the overworld and sky. meh. it was okay. i prefer a more cohesive world to ss's hub + three land areas. skyward sword felt a little too bite-sized for my liking. the sky itself was also sort of disappointing - there just weren't enough interesting islands to visit. it would have been great to see some quasi-wind waker stuff and included larger islands with their own characters and sidequests. it's like, if you're going to divide everything up like that, why not go all the way? it's no secret i fucking love wind waker, and i vastly prefer its sailing/island system to what skyward sword gives you. skyloft felt too small - even though there was a lot to do on it, it never felt like i was exploring anything. i suppose the land sections of the game were supposed to fulfill this purpose, but since they're so sectioned-off it felt more like i was being funneled through them rather than actually doing anything myself.
the warp system was pretty good at least, and i did appreciate how much they changed certain areas when you revisited them. i may be in the minority here, but the tadtone collect-a-thon was one of my favorite parts of the game. fuck yeah banjo-kazooie.
- the bug/potion system. zelda games have always been like this, really. potions are sometimes helpful but largely useless. there's just no reason to use them, and collecting bugs to power them up never felt worth it. i bought like one powered-up revitalizing potion early on, which did end up helping in a boss battle, but that's all i used until i fought demise. for him i just used a powered-up guardian potion which lasted the entire battle and made it really easy. thanks, game! so this leads into ...
- the difficulty. i guess it was supposed to be much harder than the previous games, but i think i only died once. the main reason potions were practically useless. i don't really have a problem with this though; the difficulty was just about where i like it in a zelda game. combat at least was never hideously easy.
- the music in general. it was okay but didn't really seem like anything special. orchestration alone doesn't really do anything for me. groose's brassy music is the only piece that stands out to me as being memorable.
- the lack of voice acting. has never been a big deal for me, but this time around it did feel like the game could have benefitted from npc voice acting. it's 2011, folks.
- the bosses. they were okay, nothing really special. but the series has always been like this ... i've never really cared for zelda boss battles.
- the limited size of your item bag. it never bothered me much - typically i carried two heart medals, three bottles, quiver, bomb bag, and obv. a shield - but i have to wonder, why? limiting your items didn't make the game any harder, nor did it serve to balance anything. the only reason i can think of is to prevent you from carrying all the medals at once, but they could have just given you eg two slots in your inventory for medals instead. so i didn't really dislike the limited bag, i just don't get why it's in the game. also it's lame that your shield takes up a spot in there. i mean, it fits on link's back ...
- the spirit realm challenges. they were certainly a lot better than tp's but felt so disconnected from the rest of the game that they were totally jarring. maybe if there were one fewer of them. another question of "why is this in the game?"
- dousing. meh. didn't use it except when i absolutely had to, and it didn't add much to the game. i guess it helped with gratitude crystals, except when it pointed you in the totally wrong direction or didn't work at all. but had i not had a guide book to refer to when i didn't feel like finding something, i think i would have really appreciated dousing. so i'm glad it's in the game, it's just annoying when fucking fi takes forever explaining each new dousing target to you. god i hate her.
- the story. most of it was pretty good; i loved the stuff in the knight academy at the beginning, and i liked how the ending was a prelude to the later games. unlike others i don't have a problem with demise's characterization at all: i thought the way he fit into the story was great, and the old lady turning out to be impa genuinely surprised me (throughout the game i was wondering what zelda character she could possibly be, because she just had to be a well-known character. so at least i got that right). i also loved seeing shit like sky keep fitting together with the sealed grounds.
but overall the story didn't do much for me: it never felt like we spent enough time with the characters, and not many of them were interesting enough to make me think about after playing the game. in contrast, several moments in majora's mask still pop up in my mind once in a while - meeting the skull kid at the beginning, putting mikau to rest, etc. skyward sword's scope just felt so small and just wasn't all that interesting.
- the overworld and sky. meh. it was okay. i prefer a more cohesive world to ss's hub + three land areas. skyward sword felt a little too bite-sized for my liking. the sky itself was also sort of disappointing - there just weren't enough interesting islands to visit. it would have been great to see some quasi-wind waker stuff and included larger islands with their own characters and sidequests. it's like, if you're going to divide everything up like that, why not go all the way? it's no secret i fucking love wind waker, and i vastly prefer its sailing/island system to what skyward sword gives you. skyloft felt too small - even though there was a lot to do on it, it never felt like i was exploring anything. i suppose the land sections of the game were supposed to fulfill this purpose, but since they're so sectioned-off it felt more like i was being funneled through them rather than actually doing anything myself.
the warp system was pretty good at least, and i did appreciate how much they changed certain areas when you revisited them. i may be in the minority here, but the tadtone collect-a-thon was one of my favorite parts of the game. fuck yeah banjo-kazooie.
- the bug/potion system. zelda games have always been like this, really. potions are sometimes helpful but largely useless. there's just no reason to use them, and collecting bugs to power them up never felt worth it. i bought like one powered-up revitalizing potion early on, which did end up helping in a boss battle, but that's all i used until i fought demise. for him i just used a powered-up guardian potion which lasted the entire battle and made it really easy. thanks, game! so this leads into ...
- the difficulty. i guess it was supposed to be much harder than the previous games, but i think i only died once. the main reason potions were practically useless. i don't really have a problem with this though; the difficulty was just about where i like it in a zelda game. combat at least was never hideously easy.
- the music in general. it was okay but didn't really seem like anything special. orchestration alone doesn't really do anything for me. groose's brassy music is the only piece that stands out to me as being memorable.
- the lack of voice acting. has never been a big deal for me, but this time around it did feel like the game could have benefitted from npc voice acting. it's 2011, folks.
- the bosses. they were okay, nothing really special. but the series has always been like this ... i've never really cared for zelda boss battles.
- the limited size of your item bag. it never bothered me much - typically i carried two heart medals, three bottles, quiver, bomb bag, and obv. a shield - but i have to wonder, why? limiting your items didn't make the game any harder, nor did it serve to balance anything. the only reason i can think of is to prevent you from carrying all the medals at once, but they could have just given you eg two slots in your inventory for medals instead. so i didn't really dislike the limited bag, i just don't get why it's in the game. also it's lame that your shield takes up a spot in there. i mean, it fits on link's back ...
- the spirit realm challenges. they were certainly a lot better than tp's but felt so disconnected from the rest of the game that they were totally jarring. maybe if there were one fewer of them. another question of "why is this in the game?"
- dousing. meh. didn't use it except when i absolutely had to, and it didn't add much to the game. i guess it helped with gratitude crystals, except when it pointed you in the totally wrong direction or didn't work at all. but had i not had a guide book to refer to when i didn't feel like finding something, i think i would have really appreciated dousing. so i'm glad it's in the game, it's just annoying when fucking fi takes forever explaining each new dousing target to you. god i hate her.
i hated:
- the constant gameplay interruptions, eg alerts describing the items you get that you've already gotten before, being forced to go through the same dialogue over and over when you fail a minigame, anything fi says, etc.
- fi.
- the constant babying, eg practically explaining many puzzle solutions, anything fi says, etc. like, rather than fi popping out to describe shit such as "oh you can add goddess cubes as a new dousing target", why not just add the fucking dousing target automatically, and have a little message pop up in the corner saying "goddess cubes have been added as a dousing target"? there's absolutely no reason to interrupt the game all the damn time for shit like this, and it got really, really old to the point where i was hating the game for it.
- fi.
- the relative lack of sidequests/reasons to explore. i know there's a lot of sidequests, but there were way fewer pieces of heart and other desirable items than in previous games, and the ways you could get them weren't very varied. i would have liked to see more loose pieces of heart lying around in the environment that you had to be clever to reach. there was only like one or two in each province, which was a damn shame. the optional parts of the game in general weren't very varied: you can help someone in skyloft (but only if you've unlocked their quest!), you can gather gratitude crystals (but these are only in the sky and there aren't many of them at all!), or you can find goddess cubes (sometimes tough to find, but their chests are always braindead easy to reach).
it just feels like a lot of the ideas in the game were fairly half-baked, the previously mentioned gratitude crystals in particular. why not expand that quest more? there were only 15 loose crystals to find. why not 35 to bring the total to 100? had there been more interesting islands to visit, there would have been more places to hide them. it's like nintendo knew they had to keep some stuff from previous games and also had a bunch of new ideas, but they couldn't quite execute all of them to their furthest extent. so everything seems a little half-assed as a result, even though the game somehow took 5+ years to develop.
- fi.
- the sound. in all the zelda games up through wind waker, the songs were amazing. i'm not talking about the game score, which i suppose is as decent as ever in ss, i mean more like the songs you play on your instruments. in oot, mm, and tww, these were always extremely recognizable, memorable, and easy to distinguish. i could hum every song from oot and would at least be able to recognize the ones you play in tww. when you "learn" a harp song in ss though, it just sounds like a bunch of garbage being spewed out by various instruments. it's not memorable, it doesn't really sound like anything. can anyone hum the song of the hero? does anyone even remember what the song of the hero sounded like at all? does this bother anyone else? i guess maybe you're not supposed to "remember" these songs, but that was one of the things i loved most about the other games, even the handheld ones. sheik teaching you a song in ocarina was one of the coolest things ever, and there's just nothing like that here. hell, when fi and the dragons sing their songs, it sounds plain bad. i think moving to orchestration may have actually done more harm than good for those songs
- fi.
- the harp. playing it sucks. might have been better to actually play it a la oot/mm/tww or just axed it entirely. the controls suck, sometimes you mess up for seemingly no reason, and dear god fuck the lumpy pumpkin challenge. there's no reason it should be that tough to get the hang of something so "simple".
- fi.
- fi.
- the constant babying, eg practically explaining many puzzle solutions, anything fi says, etc. like, rather than fi popping out to describe shit such as "oh you can add goddess cubes as a new dousing target", why not just add the fucking dousing target automatically, and have a little message pop up in the corner saying "goddess cubes have been added as a dousing target"? there's absolutely no reason to interrupt the game all the damn time for shit like this, and it got really, really old to the point where i was hating the game for it.
- fi.
- the relative lack of sidequests/reasons to explore. i know there's a lot of sidequests, but there were way fewer pieces of heart and other desirable items than in previous games, and the ways you could get them weren't very varied. i would have liked to see more loose pieces of heart lying around in the environment that you had to be clever to reach. there was only like one or two in each province, which was a damn shame. the optional parts of the game in general weren't very varied: you can help someone in skyloft (but only if you've unlocked their quest!), you can gather gratitude crystals (but these are only in the sky and there aren't many of them at all!), or you can find goddess cubes (sometimes tough to find, but their chests are always braindead easy to reach).
it just feels like a lot of the ideas in the game were fairly half-baked, the previously mentioned gratitude crystals in particular. why not expand that quest more? there were only 15 loose crystals to find. why not 35 to bring the total to 100? had there been more interesting islands to visit, there would have been more places to hide them. it's like nintendo knew they had to keep some stuff from previous games and also had a bunch of new ideas, but they couldn't quite execute all of them to their furthest extent. so everything seems a little half-assed as a result, even though the game somehow took 5+ years to develop.
- fi.
- the sound. in all the zelda games up through wind waker, the songs were amazing. i'm not talking about the game score, which i suppose is as decent as ever in ss, i mean more like the songs you play on your instruments. in oot, mm, and tww, these were always extremely recognizable, memorable, and easy to distinguish. i could hum every song from oot and would at least be able to recognize the ones you play in tww. when you "learn" a harp song in ss though, it just sounds like a bunch of garbage being spewed out by various instruments. it's not memorable, it doesn't really sound like anything. can anyone hum the song of the hero? does anyone even remember what the song of the hero sounded like at all? does this bother anyone else? i guess maybe you're not supposed to "remember" these songs, but that was one of the things i loved most about the other games, even the handheld ones. sheik teaching you a song in ocarina was one of the coolest things ever, and there's just nothing like that here. hell, when fi and the dragons sing their songs, it sounds plain bad. i think moving to orchestration may have actually done more harm than good for those songs
- fi.
- the harp. playing it sucks. might have been better to actually play it a la oot/mm/tww or just axed it entirely. the controls suck, sometimes you mess up for seemingly no reason, and dear god fuck the lumpy pumpkin challenge. there's no reason it should be that tough to get the hang of something so "simple".
- fi.
overall a pretty good game. i'd rate it a 7/10 and would sum it up as a large game that felt too small.
There's too much for me to try and comment on everything you said, so I'll tackle some of your story comments.
The music took me a while to find songs that stood out. Some of them caught my attention when I was playing, but it was only after I finished when I went looking for them on Youtube that I found some that flew under the radar when I was playing. So overall SS has just as many great tracks for me as the other Zeldas did. But yeah, with all of the songs that have been made it's harder for newer ones to compete these days because there's that many we consider to be classics.
Yeah, it took me a while to figure out the old woman was Impa as well. She seemed so random and out of place until mid/late game which is when I noticed her hair and made the connection. I think it's cool how many elements of the story they touched upon in this game, to be honest. I still think this and Spirit Tracks have done the best with Zelda herself though. After playing the beginning parts on Skyloft again on Hero mode it reminded me why I feel in love with Zelda's characterization in this game. It gives Link a much more justifiable reason to go after her when she's his childhood friend rather than simply being the princess of Hyrule, and I thought the whole game did a great job at portraying their friendship/relationship.
Oh, and the part where you use the Triforce to slam the Goddess down on The Imprisoned was absolutely hilarious to me, especially after everything that boss puts you through leading up to that point. Payback in the best way possible.
And I hate to ask because he made such an impression on you, but which one was Stritch again? I honestly don't remember.
Oh, and the part where you use the Triforce to slam the Goddess down on The Imprisoned was absolutely hilarious to me, especially after everything that boss puts you through leading up to that point. Payback in the best way possible.
And I hate to ask because he made such an impression on you, but which one was Stritch again? I honestly don't remember.
The music took me a while to find songs that stood out. Some of them caught my attention when I was playing, but it was only after I finished when I went looking for them on Youtube that I found some that flew under the radar when I was playing. So overall SS has just as many great tracks for me as the other Zeldas did. But yeah, with all of the songs that have been made it's harder for newer ones to compete these days because there's that many we consider to be classics.
red chamber dream
Quote from Prime Hunter:
And I hate to ask because he made such an impression on you, but which one was Stritch again? I honestly don't remember.
he's groose's lackey who starts selling you bugs a bit later in the game. way later in the game he goes to "bug island" or whatever it's called.
Quote:
i'd recommend doing the minimal challenge first, so you can enjoy the game first. the optional content is not too great in skyward sword.
You know, if I hadn't been a total derp, I would've just copied the original run, do that 100% and go directly to Minimal Hero Mode, but nope, decided to be an idiot.
So, just to make sure I get everything, how many of everything is there? :K
Items:
Well, I know there's 18 total hearts before the two medals bring you up to 20. You start with 6, and there are 6 dungeons where you get a full heart after the boss, so that would mean 24 heart pieces I think?
I also know there's 5 bottles, 8 item slots, and 80 gratitude crystals. No idea how many goddess cubes/chests there are since I never counted them, but I'm pretty sure it's online somewhere. From what I just found it suggests there are 27 of them altogether.
I also know there's 5 bottles, 8 item slots, and 80 gratitude crystals. No idea how many goddess cubes/chests there are since I never counted them, but I'm pretty sure it's online somewhere. From what I just found it suggests there are 27 of them altogether.
okay i'm done, throughts on the final battles:
the horde was actually kinda easy. i went in with an incinvibility potion, but not because it was difficult in its desigh, but because the damn nunchuck waggle was to unreliable and i'd sometimes get hit when link didn't pull off a whirl attack.
ghirahim was a complete joke. though his third phase can't be beaten without a shield i believe, because he seemed to only be vulnerable after a shield bash.
demise phase 1 is not too bad. easy once you've figured the pattern out, although he sometimes counters in a rather odd fashion that makes it seem as though his pattern was glitched. that took me a while to grasp.
demise phase 2 pretty easy because of the very fixed pattern and easy to read timing for the shield bash. might be possible without a shield, but i didn't bother trying because redoing phase 1 is pretty annoying. also always have to reread fi's talk on how it's the final battle when you decide to continue.
boss rush i'm not even attempting because i wanna play oot asap. might get back to this later though.
ghirahim was a complete joke. though his third phase can't be beaten without a shield i believe, because he seemed to only be vulnerable after a shield bash.
demise phase 1 is not too bad. easy once you've figured the pattern out, although he sometimes counters in a rather odd fashion that makes it seem as though his pattern was glitched. that took me a while to grasp.
demise phase 2 pretty easy because of the very fixed pattern and easy to read timing for the shield bash. might be possible without a shield, but i didn't bother trying because redoing phase 1 is pretty annoying. also always have to reread fi's talk on how it's the final battle when you decide to continue.
boss rush i'm not even attempting because i wanna play oot asap. might get back to this later though.
my first 100% playthrough took me 60 or 62 hours, but i was really taking my time with that.
i think the only shit that took me a while to find was kukiel and later on all those spread-around gratitude crystals.
some trivia: on hero mode you can skip virtually every story related cutscene, but none of those where npcs just talk shit to you like where you've gotta go or whatev. sucks soo much. though it amuses me that i haven't heard zelda say anything at all in the entire run that way - even the kikwi elder had more screentime then her!
anyways i'm dumb. tomorrow i'll be going back to my normal fiel and do some testing on demise 2 to see if he can be done without the use of a shield and without taking damage. it should be possible i think, but it would be damn hard because of how quick that battle's pace is.
some trivia: on hero mode you can skip virtually every story related cutscene, but none of those where npcs just talk shit to you like where you've gotta go or whatev. sucks soo much. though it amuses me that i haven't heard zelda say anything at all in the entire run that way - even the kikwi elder had more screentime then her!
anyways i'm dumb. tomorrow i'll be going back to my normal fiel and do some testing on demise 2 to see if he can be done without the use of a shield and without taking damage. it should be possible i think, but it would be damn hard because of how quick that battle's pace is.
@ryu: Everything in the game can be done without shield.
I barely ever used a shield, and definately not against Ghirahim or Demise.
For Ghirahim's third phase, you simply break the big sword by beating it on the same spot repeatedly, and for Demise second phase you stun him with a skyward strike with lightning. Then beat him up. IMO the fastest way.
One thing I was curious about though. In Lanayru, before you get the map of the past, if you know the spots you won't sink in (Not too hard), is it possible to reach areas early? Mostly interested if you could save time and start getting the 3 stupid nodes without the map.
I barely ever used a shield, and definately not against Ghirahim or Demise.
For Ghirahim's third phase, you simply break the big sword by beating it on the same spot repeatedly, and for Demise second phase you stun him with a skyward strike with lightning. Then beat him up. IMO the fastest way.
One thing I was curious about though. In Lanayru, before you get the map of the past, if you know the spots you won't sink in (Not too hard), is it possible to reach areas early? Mostly interested if you could save time and start getting the 3 stupid nodes without the map.
Oh, so that's what the map update was for. By the time I realized what made some parts of the sand possible to stand on, I had forgotten all about the update.
I think the obstacle is just the fact that you can't get to that part of the desert immediately. I know there's at least one substantial sequence break for that area, but I'm not sure it's any help with this.
As for the final boss:
I think the obstacle is just the fact that you can't get to that part of the desert immediately. I know there's at least one substantial sequence break for that area, but I'm not sure it's any help with this.
As for the final boss:
The fastest clear time I've seen for him, using the time trials, is just over 30 seconds and doesn't use Skyward Strikes at all. Given the time it takes to use them, I'd be surprised if there's a faster way to win the battle using them rather than the shield bashes. But they're definitely an option.
my umbrella goes directly to Bankai
as many have said in other places, future Zelda games should have a "have you played a zelda game before?" optionw hen you begin a new file because this hand holding is killing the series for many people and forcing everyone into that is unfair.
worst is that stuff that really needed proper explaining is badly explained. the few times i actually needed help, Fi's advice was useless.
worst is that stuff that really needed proper explaining is badly explained. the few times i actually needed help, Fi's advice was useless.
Quote from Baron Dante:
@ryu: Everything in the game can be done without shield.
I barely ever used a shield, and definately not against Ghirahim or Demise.
For Ghirahim's third phase, you simply break the big sword by beating it on the same spot repeatedly, and for Demise second phase you stun him with a skyward strike with lightning. Then beat him up. IMO the fastest way.
One thing I was curious about though. In Lanayru, before you get the map of the past, if you know the spots you won't sink in (Not too hard), is it possible to reach areas early? Mostly interested if you could save time and start getting the 3 stupid nodes without the map.
I barely ever used a shield, and definately not against Ghirahim or Demise.
For Ghirahim's third phase, you simply break the big sword by beating it on the same spot repeatedly, and for Demise second phase you stun him with a skyward strike with lightning. Then beat him up. IMO the fastest way.
One thing I was curious about though. In Lanayru, before you get the map of the past, if you know the spots you won't sink in (Not too hard), is it possible to reach areas early? Mostly interested if you could save time and start getting the 3 stupid nodes without the map.
I was talking about the Ghirahim phase before he takes out the big sword, in which he uses the same sword as in the skyview temple fight. he repels all your attacks and the only time i could get some actual hits in was when i shieldbashed him. the fight after that is of course no problem w/o a shield. if you think that phase is possible without a shield, i'd love to know how that would work.
i know about stunning demise 2 but what i see as a problem is avoiding damage from his skyward strike and rush attack without a shield. but i'm gonna try some things in about an hour when i'm going to whip the game out the last time for now.
i know about stunning demise 2 but what i see as a problem is avoiding damage from his skyward strike and rush attack without a shield. but i'm gonna try some things in about an hour when i'm going to whip the game out the last time for now.
@ryu: I had a feeling you meant the second phase.
@TheOthin: Well, I was just making a point that he is quite doable in a short time without shield nor taking damage really. I figured it'd be the fastest, but again, I don't really use shields.
Yeah, I figured the issue was more about being unable to reach those areas, but IMO, one of the nodes is in an area close by the area you need to take anyways. And, well, if you can get one of them without the map, you can get all others as well.
One thing I wondered was the gate near the starting area (The one with the Cache Vault on the otherside), would it be possible to jump over the wall with one of the Snailmail shells in a good spot?
That reminds me about the whole time travel crap:
Yeah, it's doable. Fi is helpful here. She tells you to parry his hits, which you can do by hitting his sword repeatedly from the same direction in quick succession. It's quite difficult because you need to slash from a direction, then move the Mote back to repeat this a few times, but if you move it too fast, it becomes another slash and screws you up.
@TheOthin: Well, I was just making a point that he is quite doable in a short time without shield nor taking damage really. I figured it'd be the fastest, but again, I don't really use shields.
Yeah, I figured the issue was more about being unable to reach those areas, but IMO, one of the nodes is in an area close by the area you need to take anyways. And, well, if you can get one of them without the map, you can get all others as well.
One thing I wondered was the gate near the starting area (The one with the Cache Vault on the otherside), would it be possible to jump over the wall with one of the Snailmail shells in a good spot?
That reminds me about the whole time travel crap:
Fi is unable to Dowse the Zelda in the Crystal, while she should be able to do so. Not only that, but from the start of the game, there are 2 Zelda's in the Present, until she goes to the past through the Gate of Time in Lanayru. At this point, there is one Zelda in both Past and Present.
Later, she encases herself in a crystal, and is soon released in the Present, then taken back to Past by Ghirahim. At this point, there are 2 Zeldas in the Past.
In the end, we take the one that went from the Present to the Past to Present by sleeping to Past to Present, but that means the Zelda in the Crystal is still there in the Past.
Also, couldn't Ghirahim just have taken the Zelda in the Crystal from the beginning to resurrect Demise? Or take both the Zelda in Present and Past and use both to resurrect Demise with double Goddess's souls?
Later, she encases herself in a crystal, and is soon released in the Present, then taken back to Past by Ghirahim. At this point, there are 2 Zeldas in the Past.
In the end, we take the one that went from the Present to the Past to Present by sleeping to Past to Present, but that means the Zelda in the Crystal is still there in the Past.
Also, couldn't Ghirahim just have taken the Zelda in the Crystal from the beginning to resurrect Demise? Or take both the Zelda in Present and Past and use both to resurrect Demise with double Goddess's souls?