Early Elysia!

2011-07-25 01:25:19 pm

So... if it's that painful to deal with what are two highly annoying to enter/use Secret Worlds, can't you just bite the bullet and add in a save point between the two and split that part into two segments? That will only add in so much time and will save speed runners the hassle of trying to get both of these done in one go. Single Segment runs are a different story, obviously, but for anyone who does it in segments it will be a little less of a burden to get through there and I think it would save time in the long run. (Anyone who can manage to pull off both in one go though shouldn't be discouraged from doing so if they wish, obviously.)

Although, where is Concourse Ventilation again? It's been so long that just hearing the names of rooms isn't enough for me to remember where most of them are anymore.

rekameohs

2011-07-25 01:26:07 pm

Anywhere, everywhere

Quote from Prime Hunter:

So... if it's that painful to deal with what are two highly annoying to enter/use Secret Worlds, can't you just bite the bullet and add in a save point between the two and split that part into two segments?

No save rooms

Prime Hunter

Edit history:

Prime Hunter: 2011-07-25 01:37:52 pm

2011-07-25 01:37:41 pm

Ah, I see where I messed up. Both landing sites in West Elysia have Secret Worlds in them and I got Landing Site A and the Main Landing Site mixed up. (Seeing as the Main Landing Site SW isn't exactly the easiest thing in the world either thanks to those flying drones) I understand now.

Dang, that's gotta be rough then.

Aruki

2011-07-25 01:39:18 pm

Yeah what reka said. There's simply nowhere to save. Actually, you'd save before the AU your first trip through Elysia - after that, there's nowhere to save without losing time, but I think it's probably worth it to take a small detour after Boost. I mean otherwise you have to go get Boost then backtrack to the AU then these two wallcrawls, and frankly, fuck that.

Anyway, Concourse Ventilation is the first room you go through after Concourse (the first real room in East Elysia, with the second bomb component). To get to Turbine Chamber from there you go Concourse Ventilation --> Maintenance Shaft 08 --> Chozo Observatory --> Botanica --> Broken Lift --> Turbine Chamber.

MilesSMB

2011-07-25 05:14:23 pm

So, random fact: Completing Bryyo after a later seed will revert you back to the post-Bryyo suit, and will get rid of the Hazard Shield if you have it. >_> Oops...

Hazel

Edit history:

Hazel: 2011-07-26 10:22:47 pm

2011-07-26 07:10:04 pm

rocks, locks, and invisible blocks

Quote from MilesSMB:

So, random fact: Completing Bryyo after a later seed will revert you back to the post-Bryyo suit, and will get rid of the Hazard Shield if you have it. >_> Oops...

do you still get the % or do we have DS from echoes all over again?

MilesSMB

2011-07-26 09:37:56 pm

...What?

Hazel

2011-07-26 10:25:33 pm

rocks, locks, and invisible blocks

do you still get the % from hazard shield once its goon? or is this like dark samus in echoes when you do ILS then come back and lose everything and go back to 0%

MilesSMB

2011-07-26 10:59:25 pm

No, you keep the percent... The game giving you the Hazard Shield after Omega Ridley doesn't add to the percent, why would taking it from you subtract from it?

Jerry9

2011-07-26 11:18:59 pm

not evil,just hungry

maybe he though you meant picking up the actual hazard suit, beating ridley, then doing bryyo.

rekameohs

2011-07-26 11:34:49 pm

Anywhere, everywhere

Don't know exactly where I'd ask this...

Does anyone know if the MP3 infinite speed bug can trigger cutscenes like in the other two? It can do some insane things, like open locked doors, but I haven't been able to get it to do that. Using an incredibly convoluted series of wallcrawls/IS-ing, I've been able to bring IS into Transit Station Leviathan. If we could get it to trigger the ship landing cutscene, ship missiles would be skipped.

MilesSMB

2011-07-27 01:24:38 am

Quote from Jerry9:

maybe he though you meant picking up the actual hazard suit, beating ridley, then doing bryyo.

That's exactly what I did. >_>

Aruki

2011-07-27 05:04:27 am

reka: as far as I know you can only make it work like it does in prime 1 and 2 when you first get it in Lift Hub. Anywhere else, you unmorph, fire a missile, then remorph, and it'll set off everything in the room that reacts to being shot. In Primes 1/2 it touches every trigger in the room. IS doesn't set off cutscenes that there are no triggers in the room for, so I don't think it'll help you here.

Aruki

Edit history:

Aruki: 2011-07-27 12:02:01 pm

Aruki: 2011-07-27 11:58:39 am

2011-07-27 11:57:06 am

loses 3-4 minutes over going through east elysia inbounds; however, going from aurora chamber to landing site A is two minutes faster than going from aurora chamber to main docking bay, so this route loses probably 3-4 minutes total? which also includes the landing site a wallcrawl, which i haven't timed, so i could be way off there. in any case, if that's right, then this is around 15-20 minutes saved by skipping bryyo. overall there's probably around 25 minutes total of possible improvements over the 2:09, taking into account all new tricks.

BioSpark

2011-07-27 12:50:54 pm

better get workin

Aruki

2011-07-27 02:14:06 pm

lets get norion skip, hyper grapple skip, and an easier sw23 method, then we'll talk :P

Turtle

2011-07-27 02:37:01 pm

I like turtles.

How are you going to skip Norion? Don't you kind of need the PED?

Aruki

2011-07-27 02:37:30 pm

I'm talking about getting to the elevator early.

TheOthin

Edit history:

TheOthin: 2011-07-27 03:52:58 pm

TheOthin: 2011-07-27 03:52:44 pm

TheOthin: 2011-07-27 03:51:43 pm

TheOthin: 2011-07-27 03:50:46 pm

2011-07-27 03:49:24 pm

25 down, 45 more to go.

...What? I can dream, can't I?

Hm. When you were talking about getting off Olympus without the PED, was that just hypothetical, or has a way to do that been found?

Aruki

2011-07-27 03:57:54 pm

That's just something I did while messing around, it's not possible without cheats and even if it was you get screwed pretty fast without Grapple Lasso/the PED.

TheOthin

2011-07-27 04:09:10 pm

Ah, that makes sense.

I was thinking that it might be possible to, rather than skipping them permanently, see if there was a way to get far enough without them to reach Screw Attack or something and find a shortcut in Norion... doesn't seem anywhere close to feasible right now, though.

Aruki

2011-07-27 04:13:48 pm

Another problem is that if you skip going to Norion then you can't go to Norion. Period. The landing sites just plain do not show up on the map if you go straight to the AU. So you won't be able to return later... maybe after you beat one of the seeds, but good luck killing any of the seed bosses without Hypermode.

TheOthin

Edit history:

TheOthin: 2011-07-27 09:43:47 pm

TheOthin: 2011-07-27 09:42:48 pm

TheOthin: 2011-07-27 09:40:37 pm

2011-07-27 09:40:01 pm

That would have been my next question.

Now that you mention it, though... I wonder about those seed events where they set certain things to a specific state. Do we know the extent of what they do, and the extent of possible places where they can be triggered? We know it can be used to gain or lose the Hazard Shield, but could there be anything else? It sounds like there could... if not in items, possibly in event triggers.

Aruki

2011-07-27 10:10:25 pm

No. Hazard Shield is only affected because it's a suit upgrade, and is tied to which suit you currently have for some reason instead of whether you've collected the upgrade or not like every other upgrade in the game. Every time you beat a seed the game gives you a specific suit. The post-PH suit is supposed to be after the player has collected the Hazard Shield, therefore the post-PH suit contains Hazard. The post-Bryyo and post-Elysia suits are supposed to be before the Hazard Shield, therefore those suits do not contain Hazard.

States wise, the only thing that changes is the game updates your available landing sites after you beat the Elysia seed AFAIK. The Valhalla appears on the map after you beat the Elysia seed and Miles said he was able to go to Fiery/Thorn Jungle after beating Elysia despite never picking up the Bryyo map. Presumably the same thing would work with Norion, but again, good luck getting that far without the PED.

Hazel

Edit history:

Hazel: 2011-07-28 11:05:10 pm

2011-07-28 11:04:20 pm

rocks, locks, and invisible blocks

well about the idea I had earlyer, early SA is really really easy, if we find a SW in Warp Site Alpha we have an easy (er) Elysia, I have gotten my view out of bounds by SAing into the corner in some spots...

also about ship missles, we can't/havent skiped them right? and can you use them without the "main" one and just an expansion?