[SM] Super Metroid Impossible

2007-09-06 12:38:05 pm

Super Metroid Impossible TAS WIP 2
This is probably my finest work ever in TASing, really. In Gauntlet there are easily improvable spots but I didn't test all the possible strategies, and in many places it was faster to take damage from acid for 1-2 frames. This run stops 1 room before Red Brinstar. Spore Spawn is one great fight, another TAS fight I'm kinda proud of. This has some good entertainment stuff too. ;) Enjoy.

Lance Uppercut

2007-09-06 01:31:11 pm

Quote from MASTER-88:

This was cool hack. This guy in Finland complete that sub 2.30. This is probably fastest completion what i see.

EDIT:
Yeah you can find that video in youtube! Wink

I guess my cover is blown. I am "this guy". Terve vaan :P

And no, I am not really 38, that just evens out the 69 in my nick there.

MASTER-88

2007-09-06 01:38:22 pm

Speedrunner

News to me Shocked

Lance home country is Finland. Anyway. Welcome to finmetroid forum too.

http://s15.invisionfree.com/Metroid_Suomi/index.php?s=d2112d2c537739bb54c803b07ea0bf91&act=idx

Well anyway. It was very nice video.

Lance Uppercut

2007-09-06 01:48:52 pm

Thanks for the invitation (I kind of expected that one), but I think one forum registration is enough distraction for my normal life already :) (this is the reason I have not registered to Tasvideos as well, but I have followed the development of that site from the very beginning)

Also, I kinda dont like finnish as the language to discuss Super Metroid, or any games that have words that are really not translatable.

Anyway, Tonski I like your WIP, that gauntlet really looked fine to me. Maybe it is improvable, but entertainment is the key here. Spore Spawn fight was very good, not much to improve there since 2 rounds seems to be the absolute minimum =)
Looking forward to seeing how you will handle the Kraid battle.

Tonski

2007-09-06 02:28:18 pm

WHAT?!?! Lance is finnish?! Ahahahah what the hell. grin new

This was a so happy pleasant surprise for me, Lance is without doubt one of my favorite members on this whole messageboard and he's sharing nationality with me. Damn Lance, your cover is blown ahaha. Really this is just awesome, you must come to chat with us over at the FinMetroid, there's been a lot of discussion about Super Metroid tricks and such that I think might interest you. I'm really glad you liked the WIP, I worked a lot on it. :)

Sun on aivan pakko tulla piipahtamaan FinMetroidilla, siellä on muutenkin memberien lukumäärä todella alhainen ja aina kaivataan uusia metroid-faneja sinne, kun niitä ei Suomessa ole mitenkään älyttömästi. ;)

Lance Uppercut

2007-09-06 03:17:41 pm

Sure, I will stop by sometime, I cant refuse since you both really seem to want me register there. Maybe I will start playing Metroid more eagerly after a week so I might as well chat over there too. Remember to remind me if you dont see me there in a couple of weeks :)

So far I have only played Super Metroid and the biggest attraction for me has been this Impossible, but I am thinking about starting to play 0-mission or fusion too. Both of those are still virgins in my hands, so I know it is going to be fun.

P.JMan

2007-09-06 03:52:28 pm

I like Big Butts and I can not lie

I just thought you might get some ideas from this movie I'm currently making as a 100% route. (not full blown tool-assisted, save-stated and slowed down however)

EDIT: Actually uploaded the file Embarassed

attachment:

Metroid Impossible 1.5.smv

Spoo

2007-09-06 07:07:20 pm

Nice run, Tonski! You're making the "impossible" look easy.

JaggerG

2007-09-07 04:27:04 am

Shifty Leader

That M2k2 guy

The main thing about most good speedrun videos is that they make them look so easy because as far as you can tell, they never die. It's all successes played consecutively.

I suppose that's not ENTIRELY true, though. I suppose some parts do look hard, like if you check out a 1%ss Fusion run. Maybe Bio's gonna make that one look easy though, since it's for speed this time.

Cpadolf

2007-09-07 12:58:30 pm

Almost happy

Really great work so far Tonski I had no idea that you could walljump up to gauntlet. This long into the run I must say that this is eons past the orginal Super Metroid in terms of entertainment (Although that might be because it is completely new) just things such as the refilling from enemies adds much entertainment.

No way lance is finish Shocked

I would never have guessed that.

Lance Uppercut

2007-09-07 04:17:33 pm

Quote from Cpadolf:

I had no idea that you could walljump up to gauntlet.

I have always jumped there (in my playthrough too), the cliff is shaped exactly like in the original. It is frustrating sometimes though. It looks so good in a TAS.

Quote from Cpadolf:

No way lance is finish Shocked

I would never have guessed that.

What country would have been your guess then? :D

Cpadolf

2007-09-07 04:32:48 pm

Almost happy

Quote from Lance Uppercut:

I have always jumped there (in my playthrough too)

Weird, I guess that I have not been paying so much attention to this.

Initially I'd guess that you where from the states, but once in the best times topic you kind of said that you lived closer and after that I had no idea. A forced guess might have been brittain or something.

Lance Uppercut

2007-09-07 05:10:48 pm

I was prepared to post that quote if you hadnt remembered it, but you did, I am impressed! I also kinda knew you would think I was from the states :)

It must be weird that I have only once tried the PAL-version, but that is because I have never played this game with console. In fact, I only played through the whole game for a couple of dozen times or so (might sound like a lot, but think about people who have played this game on console for years) before I tackled SMI and then I was too thrilled to stop. Awesome game, awesome community!

EDIT:
Just watched your smv PJman, and I liked it, especially the many different solutions to all those normal problems. That at least showed me a couple of things that could be done better even when not slowing down the game. I see you wanted to demonstrate some features only available in the "tas-mode" (e.g. underwater 1-wall walljump when leaving WS), very nice. I also liked your Crocomire fight, that strategy is definitely great when it is refined some more. (abuse the spit to make more missiles available faster)

I might be saying an obvious thing, but Tonski, in the morph ball maze before super missiles, you should not use bombs until it is absolutely necessary (only with 1 block high rise and the crumble blocks).

Also, since you love CWJ so much, you should try that one when leaving the super missile area and re-entering the Crocomire area. Another good place might be the hot room with gravity suit. Well, I just know you will test every single place where that trick could be beneficial.

More follows later perhaps....

EDIT2:

I tried a couple of things out of interest. Here is that mockball-springball -thingy I told would be nice when obtaining the wave beam. It is nowhere near perfect, but you get the idea anyway. It is possible to get completely through, I just did not happen to record my better attempt at that. It is worth to try out different speeds and jump heights to find the ultimate solution.

Also, here is my take on the morphballmaze slowed down. It is not perfect either, but at least it looks a lot better than my not-slowed-down version in my playthrough.

I was prepared to post that quote if you hadnt remembered it, but you did, I am impressed! I also kinda knew you would think I was from the states  :)

It must be weird that I have only once tried the PAL-version, but that is because I have never played this game with console. In fact, I only played through the whole game for a couple of dozen times or so (might sound like a lot, but think about people who have played this game on console for years) before I tackled SMI and then I was too thrilled to stop. Awesome game, awesome community!

EDIT:
Just watched your smv PJman, and I liked it, especially the many different solutions to all those normal problems. That at least showed me a couple of things that could be done better even when not slowing down the game. I see you wanted to demonstrate some features only available in the "tas-mode" (e.g. underwater 1-wall walljump when leaving WS), very nice. I also liked your Crocomire fight, that strategy is definitely great when it is refined some more. (abuse the spit to make more missiles available faster)

I might be saying an obvious thing, but Tonski, in the morph ball maze before super missiles, you should not use bombs until it is absolutely necessary (only with 1 block high rise and the crumble blocks).

Also, since you love CWJ so much, you should try that one when leaving the super missile area and re-entering the Crocomire area. Another good place might be the hot room with gravity suit. Well, I just know you will test every single place where that trick could be beneficial.

More follows later perhaps....

EDIT2:

I tried a couple of things out of interest. Here is that mockball-springball -thingy I told would be nice when obtaining the wave beam. It is nowhere near perfect, but you get the idea anyway. It is possible to get completely through, I just did not happen to record my better attempt at that. It is worth to try out different speeds and jump heights to find the ultimate solution.

Also, here is my take on the morphballmaze slowed down. It is not perfect either, but at least it looks a lot better than my not-slowed-down version in my playthrough.

attachments:

Morph ball maze.smv

Wave beam faster.smv

P.JMan

2007-09-08 05:15:53 pm

I like Big Butts and I can not lie

Here's an update to my little movie.
It goes up to a heat proof room after the Golden Torizo but before Ridley, I have no idea what to do about ammunition though :/

btw. I can underwater wall-jump fluently in real-time as well

As you can see (at least after I do the crystal flash) the Golden Torizo is very easily manipulatable. Jumping above him and then tapping forward causes him to hop backwards. When he hops backwards, he'll either puke or do some sonic booms. If he sonic booms, then shoot a missile at him. After he pukes, he'll walk forward a few tiles, morphing usually makes him hop backwards again. If he ever does that thing when he shoots the ground, unload you regular missiles.

What do you think I should do? Should I go round and get some super missile tanks (and super missiles), backtrack and face Ridley, or do you think I can make it without doing that?

Lance Uppercut

2007-09-08 05:51:43 pm

You can 1-walljump underwater in realtime? I want to see some smv about that, sounds interesting!

I used one strategy with GT and that was to space jump right on top of him when he started walking forward, that way he always jumped back. There really is no spare energy so player cannot afford a single episode of wrong attack patterns. Of course those can be avoided, but it would be best if they dont appear at all.

Your refilling problem sounds interesting too, I am wondering how many packs you have collected so far. I will say my opinion after I have actually seen the movie.

P.JMan

2007-09-08 06:16:03 pm

I like Big Butts and I can not lie

Quote from Lance Uppercut:

You can 1-walljump underwater in realtime? I want to see some smv about that, sounds interesting!

The one I do in the snail room was real-time, exept for the very top; that bit's tricky

Lance Uppercut

2007-09-08 06:38:34 pm

Did you update your latest sent file or where is it?

P.JMan

2007-09-08 06:44:38 pm

I like Big Butts and I can not lie

woops

I forget every time

Although, it seems it's now too big to upload to the m2k2 attachment system (Max Size: 512 KB). So it's Here now

Lance Uppercut

2007-09-08 08:26:21 pm

A couple of quickies for starters.

- what happened to etecoon e-tank? Not able to get it without plasma beam and only 10 supers?
- CF during GT fight does not look very good :)
- You could go and collect the super missile in the "upper lower norfair" and surprise by collecting the ace/joker item even before Ridley, though now you would need a couple of super missiles already in your stock
- That underwater walljumping looks like it is definitely not worth it without save states. [yoda]Surprising it is, though.[/yoda]

P.JMan

2007-09-09 04:59:51 am

I like Big Butts and I can not lie

Quote from Lance Uppercut:

- what happened to etecoon e-tank?

err... I forgot, better get that (redo the movie from that point)

Quote from Lance Uppercut:

- CF during GT fight does not look very good :)

How would you do it

Quote from Lance Uppercut:

- You could go and collect the super missile in the "upper lower norfair" and surprise by collecting the ace/joker item even before Ridley

That'd be a bad route

Expect a downdate in a few hours

Lance Uppercut

2007-09-09 05:56:46 am

Quote from P.JMan:

How would you do it

Refine this?

It should be doable even without the plasma beam. Jump right above him when he starts walking, that is a quick way to make him jump back. Also you can manipulate his attack patterns (and super missiles from those projectiles), who wants those ground attacks anyway? Regular missiles are not really needed.

Maybe you should collect some supers after the GT fight and use the energy station. If you can, dont use reserve energy at all, that might come in handy when approaching Ridley.

Dont get me wrong, I liked that very much, but I just wrote a couple of points here before I went to sleep so I wouldnt forget them right away. Whatched it again though. Hope I did not sound too arrogant.

BTW, you could pack the smv next time to make it smaller. My playthrough was 1285KB and I was wondering why it did not upload that :P Though there is nothing wrong with the microstorage either.

EDIT:
Would it be possible to get both of the missile tanks in gauntlet at the same time? I tried to break the first block and then jump to the other side to make it in time to reach the middle before the first blocks re-appear. Came very close, but still did not make it. Maybe it is possible with frame advance and solid movements? Here is an example which is not very close, but it should tell what I mean.

[quote="P.JMan"]
How would [i]you[/i] do it[/quote]

Refine this?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ev8qhFgO1Iw

It should be doable even without the plasma beam. Jump right above him when he starts walking, that is a quick way to make him jump back. Also you can manipulate his attack patterns (and super missiles from those projectiles), who wants those ground attacks anyway? Regular missiles are not really needed.

Maybe you should collect some supers after the GT fight and use the energy station. If you can, dont use reserve energy at all, that might come in handy when approaching Ridley.

Dont get me wrong, I liked that very much, but I just wrote a couple of points here before I went to sleep so I wouldnt forget them right away. Whatched it again though. Hope I did not sound too arrogant.

BTW, you could pack the smv next time to make it smaller. My playthrough was 1285KB and I was wondering why it did not upload that  :P   Though there is nothing wrong with the microstorage either.

EDIT:
Would it be possible to get both of the missile tanks in gauntlet at the same time? I tried to break the first block and then jump to the other side to make it in time to reach the middle before the first blocks re-appear. Came very close, but still did not make it. Maybe it is possible with frame advance and solid movements? Here is an example which is not very close, but it should tell what I mean.

attachment:

Gauntlet attempt.smv

Cpadolf

2007-09-09 07:10:30 am

Almost happy

No there is not enough time, I tested in frame advance without even coming close. Saturn thought that one through.

P.JMan

2007-09-09 09:06:48 am

I like Big Butts and I can not lie

Quote from Lance Uppercut:

Maybe you should collect some supers after the GT fight and use the energy station. If you can, dont use reserve energy at all, that might come in handy when approaching Ridley.

I actually used the reserve energy to manipulate super missiles :p

Also, here's the downdate

attachment:

Metroid Impossible 1.5.zip

Lance Uppercut

2007-09-09 03:00:52 pm

I am not able to unpack that thing... *SIGH*.... Well, I will try something different later to get it to work.

P.JMan

2007-09-10 02:01:08 pm

I like Big Butts and I can not lie

Update of some sort

(Repost edit)

attachment:

Metroid Impossible 1.5.zip