So, who else is extremely disappointed?

2010-09-13 04:24:34 pm

Not impossible

just highly unlikely

My mission statement from the very start of the MHQ forum was to create an environment where people would not get attacked for stating simple opinions. Basically the anti-Gamefaqs.

sabata2

2010-09-13 04:56:40 pm

ANKOKU

Quote from Opium:

Let the shitstorm begin! That may be my last post in MDb, I see a ban in my future. I'm just stating my mind, so at least my conscience is clear about it.

Looks to me like damn near the entire forum is on your side Opi.
Looks like they just have a retard Admin.

KingBroly

2010-09-13 05:21:43 pm

Like I said earlier, people will remember this game better in a few years than they do now. People remember Corruption better now than they did.

mazerski

2010-09-13 05:44:09 pm

Extremely disappointed? How so? I have to believe that most would say the game is fun to play, the environments and various rooms are awesome and the boss fights are truly spectacular (that fight against the the Octo-Squid in Sector 3 was amazing). The added voices and scenes - while childish sounding at times, adds a lot to the game. Of course it is not perfect but what is? I hope Ninja makes a 2nd game.

I know nothing about Fusion so that may affect the stated opinions.

Recall after Super Metroid when MP1 came out... scan? Why in the world would I do that? Of course tons of players went for 100% scans as it really adds to the game. If MP2 would have been a continuation of MP1, people would have complained of lack of creativity. As for MP3 -- I really like the game a lot. The use of the ship was a good idea.

That said, Other M is really well done (for me at least) though I find one thing unfair - and that is if falling into lava, Samus can almost never jump out. I have to say that I have died a staggering amount of times - I can't believe how hard some of these fights are.

Finally, I am much older than all of you (proof = I met Arkarian a couple of years ago) and this may very well be why I am (overall) much more forgiving of the games (example: in some respects MP2 is my favorite) and all of you have played many more games than I.

Extremely disappointed? How so? I have to believe that most would say the game is fun to play, the environments and various rooms are awesome and the boss fights are truly spectacular (that fight against the the Octo-Squid in Sector 3 was amazing). The added voices and scenes - while childish sounding at times, adds a lot to the game. Of course it is not perfect but what is? I hope Ninja makes a 2nd game.

I know nothing about Fusion so that may affect the stated opinions.

Recall after Super Metroid when MP1 came out... scan? Why in the world would I do that? Of course tons of players went for 100% scans as it really adds to the game. If MP2 would have been a continuation of MP1, people would have complained of lack of creativity. As for MP3 -- I really like the game a lot. The use of the ship was a good idea.

That said, Other M is really well done (for me at least) though I find one thing unfair - and that is if falling into lava, Samus can almost never jump out. I have to say that I have died a staggering amount of times - I can't believe how hard some of these fights are.

Finally, I am much older than [u]all[/u] of you (proof = I met Arkarian a couple of years ago) and this may very well be why I am (overall) much more forgiving of the games (example: in some respects MP2 is my favorite) and all of you have played many more games than I.

sabata2

2010-09-13 06:19:06 pm

ANKOKU

That's horrible proof of age, and why even bring up age in this discussion?

Opium

2010-09-13 06:20:52 pm

I'm totally older than you, and I am very disappointed with Other M.

arkarian

Edit history:

arkarian: 2010-09-13 06:27:41 pm

2010-09-13 06:22:56 pm

red chamber dream

in this community in particular i think it has a lot to do with the general expected "metroid" paradigm. probably most m2k2 users began with either super or prime, the games that mainly constitute that paradigm, so there's a general attitude of disappoint when a new metroid game doesn't fit that bill.

the problem (if you want to call it that) with this is that now most metroid games aren't like prime and super and in fact are very different from all the other games in the series -- so this "metroid" paradigm doesn't actually exist except in m2k2 users' minds. and the whole sequence breaking obsession of this community certainly doesn't help anyone break that paradigm.

also it seems if you ask a random person who plays metroid games they would have no idea what i'm talking about here. they just play metroid games and don't even think or care about whether it's a "real" metroid game or not. that's typical of any community of avid fans versus the "normal" people though so it's not surprising to me.

people like to say fusion is "a good game, but not really a metroid game", and maybe that was true when fusion was released. but now i think it's pretty clear that nintendo had planned on expanding the series in different directions from the very beginning. you can trace these intentions all the way back to metroid ii, which focuses on exterminating a fixed number of metroids. there's nothing like that in any other metroid game but for some reason people don't complain about it. maybe because it's so old and largely unplayed by metroid fans?
there's also prime, which was radically different from previous games with the first-person view and other mechanics like scanning, which you mentioned.

so yes, fusion is definitely a metroid game. it's just that "metroid game" means something different now -- or perhaps always has with each new release.

of course, "metroid game" still means the same thing to m2k2 users which is why threads like this are created. i'm guilty of this too -- sure, i'd love another metroid game that's "like metroid prime" because metroid prime is my favorite video game. but over the past few years i've realized that change is a very good thing and i've enjoyed what i've played of other m so far. who cares if it's different and you can't sequence break it? certainly not me. let the old paradigm die, and if you're into sequence breaking, move on to other games. there are tons of them out there.

opium: you're not older than mazerski :P afaik his assertion that he's the oldest on this forum is correct. i don't think he was trying to hold anything over anyone though but rather the opposite -- he realizes he's outside the normal crowd this community attracts so that might be why he doesn't see metroid games in the same way.

in this community in particular i think it has a lot to do with the general expected "metroid" paradigm. probably most m2k2 users began with either super or prime, the games that mainly constitute that paradigm, so there's a general attitude of disappoint when a new metroid game doesn't fit that bill.

the problem (if you want to call it that) with this is that now most metroid games [i]aren't[/i] like prime and super and in fact are very different from all the other games in the series -- so this "metroid" paradigm doesn't actually exist except in m2k2 users' minds. and the whole sequence breaking obsession of this community certainly doesn't help anyone break that paradigm.

also it seems if you ask a random person who plays metroid games they would have no idea what i'm talking about here. they just play metroid games and don't even think or care about whether it's a "real" metroid game or not. that's typical of any community of avid fans versus the "normal" people though so it's not surprising to me.

people like to say fusion is "a good game, but not really a metroid game", and maybe that was true when fusion was released. but now i think it's pretty clear that nintendo had planned on expanding the series in different directions from the very beginning. you can trace these intentions all the way back to metroid ii, which focuses on exterminating a fixed number of metroids. there's nothing like that in any other metroid game but for some reason people don't complain about it. maybe because it's so old and largely unplayed by metroid fans?
there's also prime, which was radically different from previous games with the first-person view and other mechanics like scanning, which you mentioned.

so yes, fusion is definitely a metroid game. it's just that "metroid game" means something different now -- or perhaps always has with each new release.

of course, "metroid game" still means the same thing to m2k2 users which is why threads like this are created. i'm guilty of this too -- sure, i'd love another metroid game that's "like metroid prime" because metroid prime is my favorite video game. but over the past few years i've realized that change is a very good thing and i've enjoyed what i've played of other m so far. who cares if it's different and you can't sequence break it? certainly not me. let the old paradigm die, and if you're into sequence breaking, move on to other games. there are tons of them out there.

opium: you're not older than mazerski :P  afaik his assertion that he's the oldest on this forum is correct. i don't think he was trying to hold anything over anyone though but rather the opposite -- he realizes he's outside the normal crowd this community attracts so that might be why he doesn't see metroid games in the same way.

Opium

Edit history:

Opium: 2010-09-13 06:31:24 pm

2010-09-13 06:26:22 pm

I was going by what it says in his profile.

I can't say that for me the defining 'metroid' concept is all about sequence breaking, since I really enjoy the prime series and have never even done any sequence breaking in them. I'm more about sequence breaks in Super and ZM. I do enjoy trying to see how low I can get my time, and doing that requires me to play the game over and over again. I don't really enjoy the gameplay in Other M enough to play it repeatedly, so it just becomes like most of other games in my cupboard: fun to play through a few times and then that's it. That's why I'm disappointed, I just don't like it enough to get into it on the level that I have with the other games in the series.

ajbolt89

2010-09-13 06:30:31 pm

lol no way

I just thought you were making a joke, like saying "My dad's tougher than your dad is, and I hate pokemon!" like as if that's how rules are made.

arkarian

2010-09-13 06:33:25 pm

red chamber dream

opium: yeah i can totally understand that. what i think doesn't really matter but i think that's a valid reason. it's those who expect nothing less than metroid prime that puzzle me.

Opium

2010-09-13 06:38:13 pm

Who knows, maybe it's just me. Maybe I've changed and am starting to get sick of metroid, or gaming, etc. Lord knows that there are plenty of things that I really used to be into that I'm really not anymore.

Prime Hunter

2010-09-13 06:44:50 pm

Looking at the series as a whole, I'd say the original, Super, and Prime (maybe ZM depending on how you look at it) are the three that are the farthest from the direction nearly every other game in the series has been pushing us towards. They are the ones that offer the most exploration and sense of discovery in my opinion. As you said Ark, even Metroid 2 is linear in the sense that you can't progress until you kill a certain number of Metroids. You can explore everything behind you and what's in the area you're in at the time, but until you complete the objective and defeat those Metroids you're stuck where you are.

Other M, Fusion, Echoes, Corruption, and Hunters all follow a set path for the most part. (Echoes less than the others, but it's still like ROS where you can't move on until you complete the objective, which in this case is returning the energy and reporting to U-Mos) There are degrees of exploration in each of these, but in the end they push you forward and there's little you can do about it. Metroid/ZM, Super, and Prime are actually unique in the sense that while there is an overall objective, they allow for the most exploration and freedom, which is what seems to be what everyone used to say that the Metroid series was all about. Those are the only ones, other than by using SBs, where you can be in areas you're not supposed to be but can still progress if you're determined enough. In the others, you're either reminded to go back to what you're doing, or else you can't even get there at all because of the blocks that are in place.

Maybe I'm just analyzing things too much. Or maybe I haven't fully realized until now that the games that are typically held up as the best of the series are actually in the minority now.

Looking at the series as a whole, I'd say the original, Super, and Prime (maybe ZM depending on how you look at it) are the three that are the farthest from the direction nearly every other game in the series has been pushing us towards. They are the ones that offer the most exploration and sense of discovery in my opinion. As you said Ark, even Metroid 2 is linear in the sense that you can't progress until you kill a certain number of Metroids. You can explore everything behind you and what's in the area you're in at the time, but until you complete the objective and defeat those Metroids you're stuck where you are.

Other M, Fusion, Echoes, Corruption, and Hunters all follow a set path for the most part. (Echoes less than the others, but it's still like ROS where you can't move on until you complete the objective, which in this case is returning the energy and reporting to U-Mos) There are degrees of exploration in each of these, but in the end they push you forward and there's little you can do about it. Metroid/ZM, Super, and Prime are actually unique in the sense that while there is an overall objective, they allow for the most exploration and freedom, which is what seems to be what everyone [i]used[/i] to say that the Metroid series was all about. Those are the only ones, other than by using SBs, where you can be in areas you're not supposed to be but can still progress if you're determined enough. In the others, you're either reminded to go back to what you're doing, or else you can't even get there at all because of the blocks that are in place.

Maybe I'm just analyzing things too much. Or maybe I haven't fully realized until now that the games that are typically held up as the best of the series are actually in the minority now.

072

2010-09-13 06:49:28 pm

coral to complement blue

I don't dislike Other M because it's "not Prime or Super". I dislike it because it is not very fun and the story is lame.

Muteki

2010-09-13 06:50:56 pm

I like to go fast!

I personally agree with mazerski. I think the game is awesome. I give it a 4.5 out of 5. I really enjoyed the challenge and the story. Even though it was lacking in some areas.

Prime Hunter

Edit history:

Prime Hunter: 2010-09-13 07:07:17 pm

2010-09-13 07:07:02 pm

Quote from 072:

I don't dislike Other M because it's "not Prime or Super". I dislike it because it is not very fun and the story is lame.

Well no, I'm not saying we shouldn't like 75% of the series because the games aren't like Super or Prime. It's just something I noticed as far as the core gameplay is concerned. I have my own reasons for why I like/don't like each game, and while those opinions are definitely impacted by my feelings for those two games, I won't lie, it doesn't mean that's the only thing I use as an indicator for how I feel about each game in the series.

dreadedfear91

2010-09-13 07:18:28 pm

I liked Metroid Other M, I agree will all who say it's a nice challenge. Sense moving is fun, so are the simple controls. BUT
What if . . . . The next metroid game was an RPG!!!!!!!!

Muteki

2010-09-13 07:32:25 pm

I like to go fast!

I say the more times you can replay a game, the better. Ther're too many games out there that you play thur once and you beat it and your done with it. Ther're are SO many different ways to play thur the Metroid series. I have noticed that the more the game is "unbreakable" the worst some people rate it. I liked MP2 and 3. I think the more they try to make it unbreakable, the harder we should try and break it. Just sayin.

Chozoid

2010-09-13 07:47:12 pm

Well, my first Metroid (or video game for that matter) was Fusion. So when I first played Super, I was a little turned off, but I eventually began to like the nonlinearity. Maybe the reason I didnt hate Super was because I was used to getting stuck: I only beat Fusion over the course of a few years.

mazerski

2010-09-13 08:07:44 pm

Sabata2: I say it to point out a perspective, as Ark well stated. Maybe what I should have explicitly said is that all of you grew up on video games - they didn't exist when I was a kid; and I think because of this (maybe) I look at it differently.

Opium: Nice try - I didn't know my profile said anything
Ark: well written piece
Muteki: I haven't finished the game but I may be getting close.

Let me illustrate and I hope this helps:
I still can't get over the amount of players that dislike or even hate MP2. Why? It looks great, has some cool boss fights (even in morph mode) and the Fortress rivals Phandrana Drifts and the music in lower Torvus is similar to Super... the one flaw of the game is getting the dark and light beam within a few minutes of each other. No doubt Nintendo and Retro had arguments over this. Maybe this flaw is severe enough that many dismiss the game - if this is true, fine but I don't see it like that because the game is great in so many other ways.

To me, it is very likely that because you guys have played hundreds of games and racked up 1000s of hours, your expectations are different than mine. Other M is a fast paced action packed game with a different twist and a story thrown in. I don't know what else you can expect. Ninja has my vote to work on a 2nd game.

Sabata2: I say it to point out a perspective, as Ark well stated. Maybe what I should have explicitly said is that all of you grew up on video games - they didn't exist when I was a kid; and I think because of this (maybe) I look at it differently.

Opium: Nice try - I didn't know my profile said anything
Ark: well written piece
Muteki: I haven't finished the game but I may be getting close.

Let me illustrate and I hope this helps:
I still can't get over the amount of players that dislike or even hate MP2. Why? It looks great, has some cool boss fights (even in morph mode) and the Fortress rivals Phandrana Drifts and the music in lower Torvus is similar to Super... the one flaw of the game is getting the dark and light beam within a few minutes of each other. No doubt Nintendo and Retro had arguments over this. Maybe this flaw is severe enough that many dismiss the game - if this is true, fine but I don't see it like that because the game is great in so many other ways.

To me, it is very likely that because you guys have played hundreds of games and racked up 1000s of hours, your expectations are different than mine. Other M is a fast paced action packed game with a different twist and a story thrown in. I don't know what else you can expect. Ninja has my vote to work on a 2nd game.

KingBroly

2010-09-13 08:14:25 pm

I dislike Echoes because of the same reason I don't like Bioshock: Dark Aether makes me feel really chlaustraphobic. I feel trapped almost the entire time I'm there, and I never want to go back. I also hate Spider Guardian with the passion of a thousand suns.

Opium

2010-09-13 08:15:59 pm

Quote from mazerski:

Opium: Nice try - I didn't know my profile said anything

LOL it doesn't say anything. When I looked at it before, I saw your post count which at the time was 33 and I thought I was looking at ur age. Oh well.

mazerski

2010-09-13 08:20:31 pm

King -- would you say then that the developers were effective in making an environment that makes you feel like that? As for the Spider Guardian, come on, this is one of the highlights of the game. Do you hate it because of its difficulty? If so, then you have to hate the Boost Guardian and Omega Pirate in MP1.

Opium: you made me laugh.

mazerski

2010-09-13 08:20:57 pm

Now I'm 35 -- time is flying by....

Chozoid

2010-09-13 08:25:15 pm

I hate the Boost and Spider Guargian but I kinda have a grudging respect for Omega Pirate because its so awesome and the music is sweet. But I hate Meta Ridley. Dont get me wrong, its epic, but its just such a tedious and overly long fight-not what Ridley's supposed to be. I hate that you have like 1/2 half of a second to weaken him so you can damage him, and if you miss, you have to go through five minutes of his annoying attacks. Also hes hideous.

Opium

Edit history:

Opium: 2010-09-13 08:42:39 pm

Opium: 2010-09-13 08:41:44 pm

2010-09-13 08:31:41 pm

Echoes is my favorite game in the Trilogy. The linearity of Fusion doesn't bother me at all and I think it's a totally freakin' awesome game. I find myself liking the less popular games in the metroid series (forget hunters exists for a minute - oh wait you already have) and I'm quick to defend Echoes or Fusion. But....I really am not crazy about Other M. I think it's an OK video game, but falls way short of the standard I set for a metroid title. I'm not bothered by the story and I like the graphics. I just think too many bad decisions made their way into the final product, and I don't believe they would ever let that fly in past titles. Oh what the hell, I've said all of this 10,000 times by now - why the hell do I keep repeating it?!?!?!

- I've been getting WAY too high for the past week and now I know why. I think I have been trying to make myself have a greater appreciation for Other M. It's like I start playing it and think: 'I think I'll do a big toot and see if this gets more exciting.' It does help a little bit, but only up to a point. I've found myself drooling and/or dropping the wiimote on multiple occasions, and then finding the game to be too difficult. I died like 12 times the second time I fought Ridley because I was practically OD'ed. I think I'm going to write to Nintendo and tell them that if they don't make their next metroid game less like Other M then I just might end up in rehab (or dead).

Echoes is my favorite game in the Trilogy.  The linearity of Fusion doesn't bother me at all and I think it's a totally freakin' awesome game.  I find myself liking the less popular games in the metroid series (forget hunters exists for a minute - oh wait you already have) and I'm quick to defend Echoes or Fusion.  But....I really am not crazy about Other M.  I think it's an OK video game, but falls way short of the standard I set for a metroid title.  I'm not bothered by the story and I like the graphics.  I just think too many bad decisions made their way into the final product, and I don't believe they would ever let that fly in past titles.  Oh what the hell, I've said all of this 10,000 times by now - why the hell do I keep repeating it?!?!?!

- I've been getting WAY too high for the past week and now I know why.  I think I have been [i]trying[/i] to make myself have a greater appreciation for Other M. It's like I start playing it and think: 'I think I'll do a big toot and see if this gets more exciting.'  It does help a little bit, but only up to a point.  I've found myself drooling and/or dropping the wiimote on multiple occasions, and then finding the game to be too difficult.  I died like 12 times the second time I fought Ridley because I was practically OD'ed. I think I'm going to write to Nintendo and tell them that if they don't make their next metroid game less like Other M then I just might end up in rehab (or dead).