Metroid Prime Hunters V.S. Metroid Series [locked]

(user is banned)

Edit history:

IUniverse: 2008-04-09 09:30:28 pm

2008-04-09 09:27:25 pm

[BANNED]

Lets play this game then. You want to play, then I'll play. Time to just see just how great your favorite Metroid games are compared to my own. This is MPH vs. Metroid Series (excluding MPH).

Metroid Prime Hunters deserves the Metroid name just as much as any other Metroid game does: Super Metroid, Metroid, Metroid Zero Mission, Metroid II: Return of Samus, Metroid Fusion, Metroid Prime Pinball, Metroid Prime, Metroid Prime 2: Echoes, and Metroid Prime 3: Corruption. The beauty and detail of Metroid Prime Hunters seems to be overlooked through all the harsh critism it has faced from the overall Metroid community, through out the many forums. The environments are a sight to behold on the Nintendo DS. They give the game plenty of layers of atmosphere to the whole Tetra Galaxy experience. The Stronghold Void's organic design and eerie music contribute to the ancient and mysterious air of the Alimbic Cluster, with the glowing orbs being produced on either side of the bridge leading toward the Biodefense Chamber. The decay of the Tetra Vista, goes to show just how much neglect and ruin that has come to the Alimbic's territories since the time the Alimbics disappeared. The environments were made to fit the story of Metroid Prime Hunters nicely.

Metroid Prime 3: Corruption has been influenced by Metroid Prime Hunters. Metroid Prime Hunters was the first of the Prime games to allow players to see the inside of Samus's Hunter Class Gunship while in actual gameplay. Players were able to perform various functions with Metroid Prime Hunters' ship concept such as: viewing scans, changing weapons, launching the ship, landing the ship, adjusting sensitivity levels, and viewing rival hunters on ship scanners. Metroid Prime 3: Corruption did improve on the ship gameplay with the introduction of the Command Visor and the inclusion of new ship features. Even so, a finger print of Metroid Prime Hunters has been put into Metroid Prime 3: Corruption.

Metroid usually has the same beams and such through out the whole series; however, Metroid Prime Hunters shakes things up. Metroid Prime Hunters only contained one of the traditional beams of the series: The Power Beam. The Power Beam was modified though for the gameplay of Metroid Prime Hunters, it had a faster charge rate compared to previous Prime titles. The game allowed players to switch through and collect 6 sub-weapons as well. No other Metroid Prime game has had 6 sub-weapons as in Metroid Prime Hunters. Odder still, most of the weapons within Metroid Prime Hunters weren't collected as rewards for beating a group of enemies or a particular boss. The game instead made them obtainable through the completion of puzzles, rather than conflict. This is one thing that makes Metroid Prime Hunters unique from the other Prime games mostly.

Metroid Prime Hunters has several bonus features. One thing, is the inclusion of an Audio feature in the Options menu. This option allowed players to hear all the various sound effects and music used throughout the Metroid Prime Hunters universe. The music tracks are home to some great remixed, new and classic Metroid tunes. Another thing was the ability to view all cinematic scenes in Metroid Prime Hunters via an option off of the story file selection screen. These are some of the best quality 3-D scenes on the Nintendo DS, they are dazzling and detailed. They also add important elements to the story experience of Metroid Prime Hunters. The final game scene itself displays that there are plenty of ways for this game to continue, whether it be sequals or individual hunter series. The Gorea 1 scene displays how the other hunters evolved since Samus took them on the first time, as they each are seen using a weapon that strays from their respective affinity weapons. These cutscenes, like the environments, contribute greatly to the atmosphere and the story elements of the game. The other feature is the Records section of the main menu. With this, players can view their story achievements: fastest completion times, fastest Gorea 1 times, fastest Gorea 2 times, and total enemy kills.

Metroid Prime Hunters did lack in visors; however, it brought a whole new element to them: a 2in1 visor. The Scan Visor of Metroid Prime Hunters represents two traditional visors, the Scan Visor and the X-ray Visor. It alows players to scan various objects in the four main regions of the Alimbic Cluster as is normal for the Scan Visor. The abnormal aspect of the Metroid Prime Hunters' Scan Visor, which relates it to the X-ray Visor, is its ability to see otherwise invisible switches. In the Cortex CPU room in the V.D.O, when obtaining the BattleHammer, players can look around with the Combat Visor but will not see any switches. Once a player activates the Scan Visor, they can see the four switches that need to be activated to obtain the BattleHammer. These switches beforehand were completely invisible; however, the Scan Visor allowed players to view and activate the switches.

The sound and lighting effects in Metroid Prime Hunters were decent. The sounds and music gave off a deeper atmosphere to the game. Zoomers never sounded so real before. The Alimbic voices made the atmosphere creepier, giving off some anxiety to Samus as even though she had the Octolith things weren't over for her. The sounds also add mystery to the game, as some sounds are faint in the game. One example of this is the cannon sounds coming from the Frost Labyrinth, with the morph ball positioned under the cracked hole location in the ice (where players obtained the shield key of the area). The unknown of the disturbance gives off a sense of fear in Metroid Prime Hunters. The way the different lighting of the worlds affects your arm cannon's look is awesome. Its cool to see the green change to purple, then to a redish shade, then back to the shiny green. Also when looking for a region to land at, players can sweep their ship to look at or away from the Alimbic sun. As players get closer to viewing the sun, the ship gets brighter eventually filling the ship. While the farther you look away the darker it becomes. Both lighting and sound play a key role in the atmosphere of Metroid Prime Hunters.

Going back to environments again, people have complained about various things with them. The areas actaul fit the game almost perfectly. The blast shields and the timer clocks aren't there to annoy players, they're there to relate players back to the story of the Alimbic's past when they were mass producers of defensive and offensive combat systems. The Piston Caves, a hated area, was there to show the network of machinary that powered Processor Core's two Lava Processors. Each environment connents to one thing or another in the game of Metroid Prime Hunters. Same thing goes for Metroid Prime Hunters' gameplay, it relates back to the past influences of the Alimbic Culture.

Thread title:

Lets play this game then. You want to play, then I'll play. Time to just see just how great your favorite Metroid games are compared to my own. This is MPH vs. Metroid Series (excluding MPH).

Metroid Prime Hunters deserves the Metroid name just as much as any other Metroid game does: Super Metroid, Metroid, Metroid Zero Mission, Metroid II: Return of Samus, Metroid Fusion, Metroid Prime Pinball, Metroid Prime, Metroid Prime 2: Echoes, and Metroid Prime 3: Corruption. The beauty and detail of Metroid Prime Hunters seems to be overlooked through all the harsh critism it has faced from the overall Metroid community, through out the many forums. The environments are a sight to behold on the Nintendo DS. They give the game plenty of layers of atmosphere to the whole Tetra Galaxy experience. The Stronghold Void's organic design and eerie music contribute to the ancient and mysterious air of the Alimbic Cluster, with the glowing orbs being produced on either side of the bridge leading toward the Biodefense Chamber. The decay of the Tetra Vista, goes to show just how much neglect and ruin that has come to the Alimbic's territories since the time the Alimbics disappeared. The environments were made to fit the story of Metroid Prime Hunters nicely.

Metroid Prime 3: Corruption has been influenced by Metroid Prime Hunters. Metroid Prime Hunters was the first of the Prime games to allow players to see the inside of Samus's Hunter Class Gunship while in actual gameplay. Players were able to perform various functions with Metroid Prime Hunters' ship concept such as: viewing scans, changing weapons, launching the ship, landing the ship, adjusting sensitivity levels, and viewing rival hunters on ship scanners. Metroid Prime 3: Corruption did improve on the ship gameplay with the introduction of the Command Visor and the inclusion of new ship features. Even so, a finger print of Metroid Prime Hunters has been put into Metroid Prime 3: Corruption.

Metroid usually has the same beams and such through out the whole series; however, Metroid Prime Hunters shakes things up. Metroid Prime Hunters only contained one of the traditional beams of the series: The Power Beam. The Power Beam was modified though for the gameplay of Metroid Prime Hunters, it had a faster charge rate compared to previous Prime titles. The game allowed players to switch through and collect 6 sub-weapons as well. No other Metroid Prime game has had 6 sub-weapons as in Metroid Prime Hunters. Odder still, most of the weapons within Metroid Prime Hunters weren't collected as rewards for beating a group of enemies or a particular boss. The game instead made them obtainable through the completion of puzzles, rather than conflict. This is one thing that makes Metroid Prime Hunters unique from the other Prime games mostly.

Metroid Prime Hunters has several bonus features. One thing, is the inclusion of an Audio feature in the Options menu. This option allowed players to hear all the various sound effects and music used throughout the Metroid Prime Hunters universe. The music tracks are home to some great remixed, new and classic Metroid tunes. Another thing was the ability to view all cinematic scenes in Metroid Prime Hunters via an option off of the story file selection screen. These are some of the best quality 3-D scenes on the Nintendo DS, they are dazzling and detailed. They also add important elements to the story experience of Metroid Prime Hunters. The final game scene itself displays that there are plenty of ways for this game to continue, whether it be sequals or individual hunter series. The Gorea 1 scene displays how the other hunters evolved since Samus took them on the first time, as they each are seen using a weapon that strays from their respective affinity weapons. These cutscenes, like the environments, contribute greatly to the atmosphere and the story elements of the game. The other feature is the Records section of the main menu. With this, players can view their story achievements: fastest completion times, fastest Gorea 1 times, fastest Gorea 2 times, and total enemy kills.

Metroid Prime Hunters did lack in visors; however, it brought a whole new element to them: a 2in1 visor. The Scan Visor of Metroid Prime Hunters represents two traditional visors, the Scan Visor and the X-ray Visor. It alows players to scan various objects in the four main regions of the Alimbic Cluster as is normal for the Scan Visor. The abnormal aspect of the Metroid Prime Hunters' Scan Visor, which relates it to the X-ray Visor, is its ability to see otherwise invisible switches. In the Cortex CPU room in the V.D.O, when obtaining the BattleHammer, players can look around with the Combat Visor but will not see any switches. Once a player activates the Scan Visor, they can see the four switches that need to be activated to obtain the BattleHammer. These switches beforehand were completely invisible; however, the Scan Visor allowed players to view and activate the switches.

The sound and lighting effects in Metroid Prime Hunters were decent. The sounds and music gave off a deeper atmosphere to the game. Zoomers never sounded so real before. The Alimbic voices made the atmosphere creepier, giving off some anxiety to Samus as even though she had the Octolith things weren't over for her. The sounds also add mystery to the game, as some sounds are faint in the game. One example of this is the cannon sounds coming from the Frost Labyrinth, with the morph ball positioned under the cracked hole location in the ice (where players obtained the shield key of the area). The unknown of the disturbance gives off a sense of fear in Metroid Prime Hunters. The way the different lighting of the worlds affects your arm cannon's look is awesome. Its cool to see the green change to purple, then to a redish shade, then back to the shiny green. Also when looking for a region to land at, players can sweep their ship to look at or away from the Alimbic sun. As players get closer to viewing the sun, the ship gets brighter eventually filling the ship. While the farther you look away the darker it becomes. Both lighting and sound play a key role in the atmosphere of Metroid Prime Hunters.

Going back to environments again, people have complained about various things with them. The areas actaul fit the game almost perfectly. The blast shields and the timer clocks aren't there to annoy players, they're there to relate players back to the story of the Alimbic's past when they were mass producers of defensive and offensive combat systems. The Piston Caves, a hated area, was there to show the network of machinary that powered Processor Core's two Lava Processors. Each environment connents to one thing or another in the game of Metroid Prime Hunters. Same thing goes for Metroid Prime Hunters' gameplay, it relates back to the past influences of the Alimbic Culture.

Dragonfangs

2008-04-09 09:53:21 pm

Okay, I would love to try and really blow up major holes in your "arguments". But most of it is you just seeing more than there is, claiming average, or even outright bad, things are awesome. So I decided you're just not worth it. Bring back Dai Grepher, at least his points seemed proper at first glance.

tl;dr on anything you write on Hunters from now on, have a nice day.

tomatobob

2008-04-09 10:02:09 pm

One shall stand, one shall ball.

Look, we get it, you like Hunters. No one cares, we just want you to shut up about it.Your theories consist primarily of assumptions and stuff you made up to make the game seem better than it is, go write some fanfiction and stop posting walls of text. I don't like to read them, nobody likes to read them.

Just. Let it. Go.

IUniverse

(user is banned)

2008-04-09 10:09:56 pm

[BANNED]

This is just what I expected, when push comes to shove no one can stand up to me. You guys make my opponents on another forum look like badasses, at least they tried and tied me in the debate in doing so. This is a debate, so lets get to debating. Or is everyone here justifying that they can't back their favorite games of the Metroid Series? Seems like that is the case.

tomatobob

2008-04-09 10:22:18 pm

One shall stand, one shall ball.

There's nothing to debate, anything we say will be pointless unless we pull bullshit out our asses to support our point.

You've already said you like Hunters because of its potential and people dislike it because of that same fact. It's all unrealized potential, while other games in the series deliver, Hunters does not.

Like I've said many time, you can like Hunters all you want, but you're not going to change anyones mind. If they don't like the gameplay, the single most important part of the game, fanfiction won't convince them otherwise. Leave it.

Acheron

2008-04-10 12:00:00 am

Acclaimed Threshold

Constant Sorrows

Quote from IUniverse:

Lets play this game then. You want to play, then I'll play. Time to just see just how great your favorite Metroid games are compared to my own. This is MPH vs. Metroid Series (excluding MPH).

Man, why is this like a fight? You're upset that people don't believe Hunters is as great as you do? It's just taste, it's subjective. You can't expect to sell a game as objectively awesome. There's no such thing. And the fact you try so hard to sell it anyway is why you're bringing ridicule upon yourself.

Quote:

Metroid Prime Hunters deserves the Metroid name just as much as any other Metroid game does: Super Metroid, Metroid, Metroid Zero Mission, Metroid II: Return of Samus, Metroid Fusion, Metroid Prime Pinball, Metroid Prime, Metroid Prime 2: Echoes, and Metroid Prime 3: Corruption. The beauty and detail of Metroid Prime Hunters seems to be overlooked through all the harsh critism it has faced from the overall Metroid community, through out the many forums. The environments are a sight to behold on the Nintendo DS. They give the game plenty of layers of atmosphere to the whole Tetra Galaxy experience. The Stronghold Void's organic design and eerie music contribute to the ancient and mysterious air of the Alimbic Cluster, with the glowing orbs being produced on either side of the bridge leading toward the Biodefense Chamber. The decay of the Tetra Vista, goes to show just how much neglect and ruin that has come to the Alimbic's territories since the time the Alimbics disappeared. The environments were made to fit the story of Metroid Prime Hunters nicely.

So that's how you feel, fine. I play it and I think "ice planet, fire planet, space station, other space station." Again, you're having to work to convince others a game is immersive. Doesn't that tell you something?

Quote:

Metroid Prime 3: Corruption has been influenced by Metroid Prime Hunters. Metroid Prime Hunters was the first of the Prime games to allow players to see the inside of Samus's Hunter Class Gunship while in actual gameplay. Players were able to perform various functions with Metroid Prime Hunters' ship concept such as: viewing scans, changing weapons, launching the ship, landing the ship, adjusting sensitivity levels, and viewing rival hunters on ship scanners. Metroid Prime 3: Corruption did improve on the ship gameplay with the introduction of the Command Visor and the inclusion of new ship features. Even so, a finger print of Metroid Prime Hunters has been put into Metroid Prime 3: Corruption.

I didn't care for these influences. They should have realized after Echoes that one awesome planet is good enough. No switching between different colored versions of the same world, no travel between planets. If most planets in the game wasn't so one-dimensional

(think Corruption's "federation base planet, sky city planet, red pirate city planet", compared to the beauty and variety of Bryyo/Phaaze)

it might've been a lot more interesting. The ship use for travel was just a time-waster for story reasons; we could have just as soon had

one rich and varied planet, like Prime 1, with multiple seeds to destroy

instead, and it would have been more fun and more immersive. Getting in my ship every twenty minutes just felt like a waste of time. And the ship bombing runs were gimmicky, and I'm still annoyed that I can't fly my ship around when it's carrying cargo. Artificial walls to force you down a certain path is just lame. This is the influence you're talking about, and I say nuts to that. This is Metroid, sir!

Quote:

Metroid usually has the same beams and such through out the whole series; however, Metroid Prime Hunters shakes things up. Metroid Prime Hunters only contained one of the traditional beams of the series: The Power Beam. The Power Beam was modified though for the gameplay of Metroid Prime Hunters, it had a faster charge rate compared to previous Prime titles. The game allowed players to switch through and collect 6 sub-weapons as well. No other Metroid Prime game has had 6 sub-weapons as in Metroid Prime Hunters. Odder still, most of the weapons within Metroid Prime Hunters weren't collected as rewards for beating a group of enemies or a particular boss. The game instead made them obtainable through the completion of puzzles, rather than conflict. This is one thing that makes Metroid Prime Hunters unique from the other Prime games mostly.

Echoes had cool beams, but the ammo system was lame. Prime obviously had the classic beams... and Corruption's beams all felt the same. I'll agree that Hunters had a neat beam system, though I still prefer being able to mix and match beam styles, like SM did. Good beam system isn't really going to make or break a Metroid game, though.

Quote:

Metroid Prime Hunters has several bonus features. One thing, is the inclusion of an Audio feature in the Options menu. This option allowed players to hear all the various sound effects and music used throughout the Metroid Prime Hunters universe. The music tracks are home to some great remixed, new and classic Metroid tunes. Another thing was the ability to view all cinematic scenes in Metroid Prime Hunters via an option off of the story file selection screen. These are some of the best quality 3-D scenes on the Nintendo DS, they are dazzling and detailed. They also add important elements to the story experience of Metroid Prime Hunters. The final game scene itself displays that there are plenty of ways for this game to continue, whether it be sequals or individual hunter series. The Gorea 1 scene displays how the other hunters evolved since Samus took them on the first time, as they each are seen using a weapon that strays from their respective affinity weapons. These cutscenes, like the environments, contribute greatly to the atmosphere and the story elements of the game. The other feature is the Records section of the main menu. With this, players can view their story achievements: fastest completion times, fastest Gorea 1 times, fastest Gorea 2 times, and total enemy kills.

Only music I liked was Arcterra's second theme. Everything else was just sort of weak, even for mood music. That's all taste anyway.

Being able to watch "high quality DS scenes" over and over doesn't even factor into gameplay; I feel bad for anyone who buys a game for that.

Again you've pointed out that MPH offers potential in a sequel, but that doesn't make the game itself any better. I'm confident in saying you're reading too much into a cutscene--I doubt that interpretation was what the game makers themselves intended. That scene's meant to say "dude, Gorea owned the Hunters" not "look how these guys who you beat easily throughout the game have changed!"

An achievement screen doesn't factor into anything. No one buys a game for that. That doesn't make Hunters any more or less a Metroid game.

Quote:

Metroid Prime Hunters did lack in visors; however, it brought a whole new element to them: a 2in1 visor. The Scan Visor of Metroid Prime Hunters represents two traditional visors, the Scan Visor and the X-ray Visor. It alows players to scan various objects in the four main regions of the Alimbic Cluster as is normal for the Scan Visor. The abnormal aspect of the Metroid Prime Hunters' Scan Visor, which relates it to the X-ray Visor, is its ability to see otherwise invisible switches. In the Cortex CPU room in the V.D.O, when obtaining the BattleHammer, players can look around with the Combat Visor but will not see any switches. Once a player activates the Scan Visor, they can see the four switches that need to be activated to obtain the BattleHammer. These switches beforehand were completely invisible; however, the Scan Visor allowed players to view and activate the switches.

Translation: the game plays differently than the other Primes because it's on a different system. Clever use of tools available to allow the scan visor to be used. So what? A Prime without a scan visor wouldn't be a Prime. This isn't a bonus feature, it's a bare minimum requirement.

Quote:

The sound and lighting effects in Metroid Prime Hunters were decent. The sounds and music gave off a deeper atmosphere to the game. Zoomers never sounded so real before. The Alimbic voices made the atmosphere creepier, giving off some anxiety to Samus as even though she had the Octolith things weren't over for her. The sounds also add mystery to the game, as some sounds are faint in the game. One example of this is the cannon sounds coming from the Frost Labyrinth, with the morph ball positioned under the cracked hole location in the ice (where players obtained the shield key of the area). The unknown of the disturbance gives off a sense of fear in Metroid Prime Hunters. The way the different lighting of the worlds affects your arm cannon's look is awesome. Its cool to see the green change to purple, then to a redish shade, then back to the shiny green. Also when looking for a region to land at, players can sweep their ship to look at or away from the Alimbic sun. As players get closer to viewing the sun, the ship gets brighter eventually filling the ship. While the farther you look away the darker it becomes. Both lighting and sound play a key role in the atmosphere of Metroid Prime Hunters.

You need to play the Prime games with a decent sound system if you think

Quote:

Zoomers never sounded so real before

, or whatever you think sells a Metroid game. Again, the sound effects created atmosphere, but that doesn't mean it's amazing. That's the requirement, not a selling point.

And this:

Quote:

The way the different lighting of the worlds affects your arm cannon's look is awesome. Its cool to see the green change to purple, then to a redish shade, then back to the shiny green. Also when looking for a region to land at, players can sweep their ship to look at or away from the Alimbic sun. As players get closer to viewing the sun, the ship gets brighter eventually filling the ship. While the farther you look away the darker it becomes. Both lighting and sound play a key role in the atmosphere of Metroid Prime Hunters

Seriously? This doesn't seem at all like you're grasping for something here? You cite sunlight and arm cannon lighting as proof for... anything? Sorry dude, that's not what makes a game "Metroid" to me. Usually Metroids do that.

Quote:

Going back to environments again, people have complained about various things with them. The areas actaul fit the game almost perfectly. The blast shields and the timer clocks aren't there to annoy players, they're there to relate players back to the story of the Alimbic's past when they were mass producers of defensive and offensive combat systems.

You're missing the point. So what if they're there to create a feel? They ARE annoying to most players. Lore and atmosphere should never detract from gameplay. If most people are frustrated, there's something wrong here. That "Alimbic past" could have been conveyed in far more interesting ways, but it wasn't. Again, potential that was not realized.

Quote:

The Piston Caves, a hated area, was there to show the network of machinary that powered Processor Core's two Lava Processors. Each environment connents to one thing or another in the game of Metroid Prime Hunters. Same thing goes for Metroid Prime Hunters' gameplay, it relates back to the past influences of the Alimbic Culture.

Annoying areas are still annoying. No changing that. It all could be better, but it wasn't, and so the game gets mediocre reception. I could try to tell you how great Daikatana (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daikatana) was but it still sucks ass as a game. And I'd look like an ass if I was trying to convince others it's great because of what it CAN be if you try real hard, and then get upset with people for not telling me I'm right.

You have a chance here to scrounge up some dignity. If I were you'd I'd apologize for the undue fervor and aggression you've displayed and just agree to disagree. Show some civility and you'll come out of this a better person for it. My 2c.

[quote="IUniverse"]
Lets play this game then. You want to play, then I'll play. Time to just see just how great your favorite Metroid games are compared to my own. This is MPH vs. Metroid Series (excluding MPH). 
[/quote]

Man, why is this like a fight? You're upset that people don't believe Hunters is as great as you do? It's just taste, it's subjective. You can't expect to sell a game as objectively awesome. There's no such thing. And the fact you try so hard to sell it anyway is why you're bringing ridicule upon yourself.

[quote]
Metroid Prime Hunters deserves the Metroid name just as much as any other Metroid game does: Super Metroid, Metroid, Metroid Zero Mission, Metroid II: Return of Samus, Metroid Fusion, Metroid Prime Pinball, Metroid Prime, Metroid Prime 2: Echoes, and Metroid Prime 3: Corruption. The beauty and detail of Metroid Prime Hunters seems to be overlooked through all the harsh critism it has faced from the overall Metroid community, through out the many forums. The environments are a sight to behold on the Nintendo DS. They give the game plenty of layers of atmosphere to the whole Tetra Galaxy experience. The Stronghold Void's organic design and eerie music contribute to the ancient and mysterious air of the Alimbic Cluster, with the glowing orbs being produced on either side of the bridge leading toward the Biodefense Chamber. The decay of the Tetra Vista, goes to show just how much neglect and ruin that has come to the Alimbic's territories since the time the Alimbics disappeared. The environments were made to fit the story of Metroid Prime Hunters nicely. [/quote]

So that's how you feel, fine. I play it and I think "ice planet, fire planet, space station, other space station." Again, you're having to work to convince others a game is immersive. Doesn't that tell you something?

[quote]Metroid Prime 3: Corruption has been influenced by Metroid Prime Hunters. Metroid Prime Hunters was the first of the Prime games to allow players to see the inside of Samus's Hunter Class Gunship while in actual gameplay. Players were able to perform various functions with Metroid Prime Hunters' ship concept such as: viewing scans, changing weapons, launching the ship, landing the ship, adjusting sensitivity levels, and viewing rival hunters on ship scanners. Metroid Prime 3: Corruption did improve on the ship gameplay with the introduction of the Command Visor and the inclusion of new ship features. Even so, a finger print of Metroid Prime Hunters has been put into Metroid Prime 3: Corruption. 
[/quote]

I didn't care for these influences. They should have realized after Echoes that one awesome planet is good enough. No switching between different colored versions of the same world, no travel between planets. If most planets in the game wasn't so one-dimensional[spoiler](think Corruption's "federation base planet, sky city planet, red pirate city planet", compared to the beauty and variety of Bryyo/Phaaze)[/spoiler] it might've been a lot more interesting. The ship use for travel was just a time-waster for story reasons; we could have just as soon had[spoiler] one rich and varied planet, like Prime 1, with multiple seeds to destroy[/spoiler] instead, and it would have been more fun and more immersive. Getting in my ship every twenty minutes just felt like a waste of time. And the ship bombing runs were gimmicky, and I'm [i]still[/i] annoyed that I can't fly my ship around when it's carrying cargo. Artificial walls to force you down a certain path is just lame. This is the influence you're talking about, and I say nuts to that. This is Metroid, sir!

[quote]Metroid usually has the same beams and such through out the whole series; however, Metroid Prime Hunters shakes things up. Metroid Prime Hunters only contained one of the traditional beams of the series: The Power Beam. The Power Beam was modified though for the gameplay of Metroid Prime Hunters, it had a faster charge rate compared to previous Prime titles. The game allowed players to switch through and collect 6 sub-weapons as well. No other Metroid Prime game has had 6 sub-weapons as in Metroid Prime Hunters. Odder still, most of the weapons within Metroid Prime Hunters weren't collected as rewards for beating a group of enemies or a particular boss. The game instead made them obtainable through the completion of puzzles, rather than conflict. This is one thing that makes Metroid Prime Hunters unique from the other Prime games mostly.[/quote]

Echoes had cool beams, but the ammo system was lame. Prime obviously had the classic beams... and Corruption's beams all felt the same. I'll agree that Hunters had a neat beam system, though I [i]still[/i] prefer being able to mix and match beam styles, like SM did. Good beam system isn't really going to make or break a Metroid game, though.

[quote]Metroid Prime Hunters has several bonus features. One thing, is the inclusion of an Audio feature in the Options menu. This option allowed players to hear all the various sound effects and music used throughout the Metroid Prime Hunters universe. The music tracks are home to some great remixed, new and classic Metroid tunes. Another thing was the ability to view all cinematic scenes in Metroid Prime Hunters via an option off of the story file selection screen. These are some of the best quality 3-D scenes on the Nintendo DS, they are dazzling and detailed. They also add important elements to the story experience of Metroid Prime Hunters. The final game scene itself displays that there are plenty of ways for this game to continue, whether it be sequals or individual hunter series. The Gorea 1 scene displays how the other hunters evolved since Samus took them on the first time, as they each are seen using a weapon that strays from their respective affinity weapons. These cutscenes, like the environments, contribute greatly to the atmosphere and the story elements of the game. The other feature is the Records section of the main menu. With this, players can view their story achievements: fastest completion times, fastest Gorea 1 times, fastest Gorea 2 times, and total enemy kills.[/quote]

Only music I liked was Arcterra's second theme. Everything else was just sort of weak, even for mood music. That's all taste anyway.

Being able to watch "high quality DS scenes" over and over doesn't even factor into gameplay; I feel bad for anyone who buys a game for that.

Again you've pointed out that MPH offers potential in a sequel, but that doesn't make the game itself any better. I'm confident in saying you're reading too much into a cutscene--I doubt that interpretation was what the game makers themselves intended. That scene's meant to say "dude, Gorea owned the Hunters" not "look how these guys who you beat easily throughout the game have changed!"

An achievement screen doesn't factor into anything. No one buys a game for that. That doesn't make Hunters any more or less a Metroid game.

[quote]Metroid Prime Hunters did lack in visors; however, it brought a whole new element to them: a 2in1 visor. The Scan Visor of Metroid Prime Hunters represents two traditional visors, the Scan Visor and the X-ray Visor. It alows players to scan various objects in the four main regions of the Alimbic Cluster as is normal for the Scan Visor. The abnormal aspect of the Metroid Prime Hunters' Scan Visor, which relates it to the X-ray Visor, is its ability to see otherwise invisible switches. In the Cortex CPU room in the V.D.O, when obtaining the BattleHammer, players can look around with the Combat Visor but will not see any switches. Once a player activates the Scan Visor, they can see the four switches that need to be activated to obtain the BattleHammer. These switches beforehand were completely invisible; however, the Scan Visor allowed players to view and activate the switches.[/quote]

Translation: the game plays differently than the other Primes because it's on a different system. Clever use of tools available to allow the scan visor to be used. So what? A Prime without a scan visor wouldn't be a Prime. This isn't a bonus feature, it's a bare minimum requirement.

[quote]The sound and lighting effects in Metroid Prime Hunters were decent. The sounds and music gave off a deeper atmosphere to the game. Zoomers never sounded so real before. The Alimbic voices made the atmosphere creepier, giving off some anxiety to Samus as even though she had the Octolith things weren't over for her. The sounds also add mystery to the game, as some sounds are faint in the game. One example of this is the cannon sounds coming from the Frost Labyrinth, with the morph ball positioned under the cracked hole location in the ice (where players obtained the shield key of the area). The unknown of the disturbance gives off a sense of fear in Metroid Prime Hunters. The way the different lighting of the worlds affects your arm cannon's look is awesome. Its cool to see the green change to purple, then to a redish shade, then back to the shiny green. Also when looking for a region to land at, players can sweep their ship to look at or away from the Alimbic sun. As players get closer to viewing the sun, the ship gets brighter eventually filling the ship. While the farther you look away the darker it becomes. Both lighting and sound play a key role in the atmosphere of Metroid Prime Hunters.[/quote]

You need to play the Prime games with a decent sound system if you think[quote] Zoomers never sounded so real before[/quote], or whatever you think sells a Metroid game. Again, the sound effects created atmosphere, but that doesn't mean it's amazing. That's the requirement, not a selling point.

And this: [quote]The way the different lighting of the worlds affects your arm cannon's look is awesome. Its cool to see the green change to purple, then to a redish shade, then back to the shiny green. Also when looking for a region to land at, players can sweep their ship to look at or away from the Alimbic sun. As players get closer to viewing the sun, the ship gets brighter eventually filling the ship. While the farther you look away the darker it becomes. Both lighting and sound play a key role in the atmosphere of Metroid Prime Hunters[/quote]

Seriously? This doesn't seem at all like you're grasping for something here? You cite sunlight and arm cannon lighting as proof for... anything? Sorry dude, that's not what makes a game "Metroid" to me. Usually Metroids do that.

[quote]Going back to environments again, people have complained about various things with them. The areas actaul fit the game almost perfectly. The blast shields and the timer clocks aren't there to annoy players, they're there to relate players back to the story of the Alimbic's past when they were mass producers of defensive and offensive combat systems.[/quote]

You're missing the point. So what if they're there to create a feel? They ARE annoying to most players. Lore and atmosphere should never detract from gameplay. If most people are frustrated, there's something wrong here. That "Alimbic past" could have been conveyed in far more interesting ways, but it wasn't. Again, potential that was not realized.

[quote]The Piston Caves, a hated area, was there to show the network of machinary that powered Processor Core's two Lava Processors. Each environment connents to one thing or another in the game of Metroid Prime Hunters. Same thing goes for Metroid Prime Hunters' gameplay, it relates back to the past influences of the Alimbic Culture.[/quote]

Annoying areas are still annoying. No changing that. It all could be better, but it wasn't, and so the game gets mediocre reception. I could try to tell you how great Daikatana ([url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daikatana]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daikatana[/url]) was but it still sucks ass as a game. And I'd look like an ass if I was trying to convince others it's great because of what it CAN be if you try real hard, and then get upset with people for not telling me I'm right.

You have a chance here to scrounge up some dignity. If I were you'd I'd apologize for the undue fervor and aggression you've displayed and just agree to disagree. Show some civility and you'll come out of this a better person for it. My 2c.

arkarian

2008-04-10 01:09:32 am

red chamber dream

Quote from IUniverse:

Odder still, most of the weapons within Metroid Prime Hunters weren't collected as rewards for beating a group of enemies or a particular boss. The game instead made them obtainable through the completion of puzzles, rather than conflict. This is one thing that makes Metroid Prime Hunters unique from the other Prime games mostly.

Actually, most of the weapons in Metroid games aren't given as immediate rewards for beating bosses. Neither the Ice Beam nor the Plasma Beam were like that in Prime, and the same is true for Echoze's Dark and Light Beams (I honestly don't remember how you get the Annihilator, but I'm betting it's not from a boss).
That's actually always been something I really like about Metroid: you can just be randomly exploring and stumble upon a really cool item without having to do anything in particular to receive it.

I'm absolutely sure there are tons of examples in the 2D games as well; I just can't think of any in particular right now, as it's difficult for me to remember when/how you get each item. I don't play Metroid too much these days.

[quote="IUniverse"]Odder still, most of the weapons within Metroid Prime Hunters weren't collected as rewards for beating a group of enemies or a particular boss. The game instead made them obtainable through the completion of puzzles, rather than conflict. This is one thing that makes Metroid Prime Hunters unique from the other Prime games mostly.[/quote]

Actually, most of the weapons in Metroid games [i]aren't[/i] given as immediate rewards for beating bosses. Neither the Ice Beam nor the Plasma Beam were like that in Prime, and the same is true for Echoze's Dark and Light Beams (I honestly don't remember how you get the Annihilator, but I'm betting it's not from a boss).
That's actually always been something I really like about Metroid: you can just be randomly exploring and stumble upon a really cool item without having to do anything in particular to receive it.

I'm absolutely sure there are tons of examples in the 2D games as well; I just can't think of any in particular right now, as it's difficult for me to remember when/how you get each item. I don't play Metroid too much these days.

UchihaSasuke

2008-04-10 02:24:42 am

my umbrella goes directly to Bankai

ark: you get the annihilator when you kill quadraxis.

imo, hunters was a cool concept that was poorly executed. wrong console imo.

tomatobob

2008-04-10 05:05:36 am

One shall stand, one shall ball.

Quote from Arkarian:

I'm absolutely sure there are tons of examples in the 2D games as well; I just can't think of any in particular right now, as it's difficult for me to remember when/how you get each item. I don't play Metroid too much these days.

In Super every beam was acquired from exploration, I think you had to beat Draygon for access to Plasma, but there was no actual boss fight for the item itself.

In Zero Mission the Charge Beam was awarded by a the Cave Worm, but I think the others were just lying around. I haven't gotten that for a long time so it's hard to remember.

I don't know about RoS, but I don't think there are any boss fights except the Queen so it and M1 are probably like Super.

arkarian

2008-04-10 09:44:38 am

red chamber dream

Yeah, NES Metroid is probably the very best example of that, actually.

RT-55J

2008-04-10 01:09:07 pm

Armor Guardian

Quote from tomatobob:

I don't know about RoS, but I don't think there are any boss fights except the Queen so it and M1 are probably like Super.

You get the Spring Ball from defeating a boss whose name escapes me (he's also Fusion's first boss iirc).

KennyMan666

2008-04-10 04:06:55 pm

Viking

Precursor

Arachnus.

IUniverse

(user is banned)

2008-04-10 04:43:17 pm

[BANNED]

Quote from tomatobob:

There's nothing to debate, anything we say will be pointless unless we pull bullshit out our asses to support our point.

How about comparing other Metroid games' gameplay to Hunters, Metroid Bosses to the bosses of Hunters, etc...I didn't think this would be a hard debate to win for this place, but it seems that that is the case.

Quote from tomatobob:

You've already said you like Hunters because of its potential and people dislike it because of that same fact. It's all unrealized potential, while other games in the series deliver, Hunters does not.

The other games deliver to the point that they tell you the whole story, except in the case of the Prime Trilogy. The 2-D games don't even give players any details to wonder about, and that takes away from the mysterious and unknown feeling in the Metroid title. I'm not saying the feeling is completely gone, it will just lack. Prime, just like Metroid, Metroid II, and Super Metroid (I don't know if Zero Mission was released before Prime), has players exploring a planet once inhabited by the Chozo. It's a repetitve area concept found in plenty of the Metroid Titles. Metroid Prime Hunters has us exploring a region of the Tetra Galaxy once under Alimbic control. With that game, it has a new area with a new race once dominating the terrain. It offers a new terrain concept in that regard, since it doesn't continue with the whole "once occupied by the Chozo" theme that is too commonly used in the Metroid Series.

Quote from tomatobob:

Like I've said many time, you can like Hunters all you want, but you're not going to change anyones mind. If they don't like the gameplay, the single most important part of the game, fanfiction won't convince them otherwise. Leave it.

You really don't realize what's going on here do you? This isn't about me liking Hunters, this about me repaying you all for your games that you've been playing like negatively judging me because of Hunters and assuming that I'll do one thing that I had no intention of doing (like your post stated I'd be making a 14 paragraph essay in the other thread when originally I wasn't going to do anything). I'm not planning on changing anyone's mind; however, I am going to make my point in this thread that I'm not to be challenged or messed with when it comes to being a fan of Hunters. Of course, instead of making this easy by addressing points that Hunters may lack from other Metroid games you keep running on about me liking Hunters. Get over it, this is a debate don't change the subject.

Quote from Acheron86:

Man, why is this like a fight? You're upset that people don't believe Hunters is as great as you do?

Not at all, I'm upset that people want to judge me based on Hunters; therefore, I will make it my intention to crush everything that you all dish out based on Hunters from the other Metroid games. This has been waiting to happen ever since I joined this place.

Quote from Acheron86:

So that's how you feel, fine. I play it and I think "ice planet, fire planet, space station, other space station." Again, you're having to work to convince others a game is immersive. Doesn't that tell you something?

Yes it does, Hunters is unfairly judged. If that is what you think of Hunters, then for Prime you should think of it as a "fire region, ice region, mining region, nature region". Otherwise, there is just a thing you have with Hunters. If you think Hunters as that, then I'd hate how you see the areas of Aether in Echoes (dark and light realms).

Quote from Acheron86:

No switching between different colored versions of the same world, no travel between planets.

If you're talking about Arcterra and Alinos being recolored versions of each other, that couldn't be further from the truth. Arcterra features the gateway which doesn't match Alinos' at all, then there's the Ice Hive, Drip Moat having that odd acidic black substance, the Sanctorus area, Sic Transit and many other examples. Meanwhile Alinos has the Combat Hall, Alinos Gateway, Echo Hall, High Ground, Alinos Perch and many other examples to prove it isn't just a "recolored version" of Arcterra. Having planet travel adds gameplay to a Metroid title.

Quote from Acheron86:

If most planets in the game wasn't so one-dimensional

(think Corruption's "federation base planet, sky city planet, red pirate city planet", compared to the beauty and variety of Bryyo/Phaaze)

it might've been a lot more interesting.

Considering how we explored the same region of a planet/station in Hunters for both the first/second visits, the theme is more likely to remain constant. In Corruption, though, we've got different regions linked together only by ship travel. In that case, there should've been much more variety. Hunters only had doors dividing the areas of the first/second visit locations; therefore, it wouldn't have made sense to make major changes to the environment, but there are changes at a lesser scale.

Quote from Acheron86:

The ship use for travel was just a time-waster for story reasons; we could have just as soon had

one rich and varied planet, like Prime 1, with multiple seeds to destroy

instead, and it would have been more fun and more immersive.

It wouldn't have made sense for there to be multiple

Leviathans

on one planet. Dark Samus wouldn't be much of a villain by just sending them all to one planet, and the Federation wouldn't look to bright for depending upon one planet for their resources. Corruption wouldn't have made sense at all, and I believe Metroid games are suppose to make sense unless they're like Metroid Prime Pinball. I'd rather have a time-waster that adds new gameplay elements to the Metroid Series than having one planet of variety that destroys the story.

Quote from Acheron86:

Artificial walls to force you down a certain path is just lame.

Metroid Prime Hunters doesn't have artificial walls that force you to take a certain path. In fact, there's plenty of free-roaming in Hunters. The shields are more of a guiding feature that's only temporary, unlike the nagging of the Aurora Unit and others in Corruption. Also Hunters doesn't have that guiding Hint System of Prime, Echoes and Corruption; which takes away from free-roaming elements.

Quote from Acheron86:

I'm confident in saying you're reading too much into a cutscene--I doubt that interpretation was what the game makers themselves intended.

Each hunter is still seen using a different weapon other than their stated weapon of choice. Just look at the cutscene. Whether it was their intentions or not, the scene still shows each using a different weapon.

Quote from Acheron86:

An achievement screen doesn't factor into anything.

It's a useful tool for those who speed run in the Metroid games. The screen allows them to see their records and helps them to set goals on future runs that may attempt at a better time. Speed Running has become an important aspect of a lot of Metroid titles.

Quote from Acheron86:

This isn't a bonus feature, it's a bare minimum requirement.

It has some features of the X-ray visor within the Scan Visor, however. I already stated why.

Quote from Acheron86:

that's not what makes a game "Metroid" to me. Usually Metroids do that.

That's my point. It has features that other Metroid titles share with it.

Quote from Acheron86:

They ARE annoying to most players.

Oh please, the blast shields are no different from other environmental hazards found in the games.

Quote from Acheron86:

You have a chance here to scrounge up some dignity. If I were you'd I'd apologize for the undue fervor and aggression you've displayed and just agree to disagree. Show some civility and you'll come out of this a better person for it. My 2c.

If gaining dignity means I've got to give up on something that I believe in; it can go to hell. My fervor was not undue, and I will not be saying sorry for it. This is the repayment.

Quote from Arkarian:

Actually, most of the weapons in Metroid games aren't given as immediate rewards for beating bosses. Neither the Ice Beam nor the Plasma Beam were like that in Prime, and the same is true for Echoze's Dark and Light Beams (I honestly don't remember how you get the Annihilator, but I'm betting it's not from a boss).
That's actually always been something I really like about Metroid: you can just be randomly exploring and stumble upon a really cool item without having to do anything in particular to receive it.

I only said something about the Prime games; I didn't say a thing about the 2-D Metroid titles when I was talking about the weapons featured in Hunters except when it came to the sub-weapon concept.

The Nova Beam was acquired by defeating that band of Space Pirates found on the Pirate Homeworld. The Ice Missiles, Grapple Voltage and Plasma Beam were all acquired from defeating the respective hunter. Also each Hyper Mode upgrade was obtained from a boss.

In Prime, we get the Wave Beam by beating a group of Baby Sheegoths then the Sheegoth as like a mini-boss. Also we get the Power Bombs from beating that invisible Sentry Droid. Metroid Prime produces those Phazon puddles, so we get the Phazon Beam from that creature though temporary. We defeat the Hive Mecha (which produces multiple War Wasps for us to kill) for the missile launcher in Prime. For the Morph Ball Bombs, you have to defeat the Incinerator Drone and the War Wasps found within the Burn Dome. My point stands with Prime.

With Echoes, we get the Annihilator Beam from beating Quadraxis at the Hive Temple. You get the Power Bomb from the Power Bomb Guardian. For the Super Missile, you've got to defeat a group of Space Pirates at the Torvus Temple to receive the upgrade. You need to defeat the Bomb Guardian to get your Morph Ball Bombs too. There are plenty of weapons obtained by conflict when it comes to either a boss or a group of enemies in Prime, Echoes and Corruption.

[quote="tomatobob"]
There's nothing to debate, anything we say will be pointless unless we pull bullshit out our asses to support our point. 
[/quote]

How about comparing other Metroid games' gameplay to Hunters, Metroid Bosses to the bosses of Hunters, etc...I didn't think this would be a hard debate to win for this place, but it seems that that is the case.

[quote="tomatobob"]
You've already said you like Hunters because of its potential and people dislike it because of that same fact. It's all unrealized potential, while other games in the series deliver, Hunters does not.
[/quote]

The other games deliver to the point that they tell you the whole story, except in the case of the Prime Trilogy. The 2-D games don't even give players any details to wonder about, and that takes away from the mysterious and unknown feeling in the Metroid title. I'm not saying the feeling is completely gone, it will just lack. Prime, just like Metroid, Metroid II, and Super Metroid (I don't know if Zero Mission was released before Prime), has players exploring a planet once inhabited by the Chozo. It's a repetitve area concept found in plenty of the Metroid Titles. Metroid Prime Hunters has us exploring a region of the Tetra Galaxy once under Alimbic control. With that game, it has a new area with a new race once dominating the terrain. It offers a new terrain concept in that regard, since it doesn't continue with the whole "once occupied by the Chozo" theme that is too commonly used in the Metroid Series.

[quote="tomatobob"]
Like I've said many time, you can like Hunters all you want, but you're not going to change anyones mind. If they don't like the gameplay, the single most important part of the game, fanfiction won't convince them otherwise. Leave it.
[/quote]

You really don't realize what's going on here do you? This isn't about me liking Hunters, this about me repaying you all for your games that you've been playing like negatively judging me because of Hunters and assuming that I'll do one thing that I had no intention of doing (like your post stated I'd be making a 14 paragraph essay in the other thread when originally I wasn't going to do anything). I'm not planning on changing anyone's mind; however, I am going to make my point in this thread that I'm not to be challenged or messed with when it comes to being a fan of Hunters. Of course, instead of making this easy by addressing points that Hunters may lack from other Metroid games you keep running on about me liking Hunters. Get over it, this is a debate don't change the subject.

[quote="Acheron86"]
Man, why is this like a fight? You're upset that people don't believe Hunters is as great as you do? 
[/quote]

Not at all, I'm upset that people want to judge me based on Hunters; therefore, I will make it my intention to crush everything that you all dish out based on Hunters from the other Metroid games. This has been waiting to happen ever since I joined this place.

[quote="Acheron86"]
So that's how you feel, fine. I play it and I think "ice planet, fire planet, space station, other space station." Again, you're having to work to convince others a game is immersive. Doesn't that tell you something?
[/quote]

Yes it does, Hunters is unfairly judged. If that is what you think of Hunters, then for Prime you should think of it as a "fire region, ice region, mining region, nature region". Otherwise, there is just a thing you have with Hunters. If you think Hunters as that, then I'd hate how you see the areas of Aether in Echoes (dark and light realms).

[quote="Acheron86"]
No switching between different colored versions of the same world, no travel between planets.
[/quote]

If you're talking about Arcterra and Alinos being recolored versions of each other, that couldn't be further from the truth. Arcterra features the gateway which doesn't match Alinos' at all, then there's the Ice Hive, Drip Moat having that odd acidic black substance, the Sanctorus area, Sic Transit and many other examples. Meanwhile Alinos has the Combat Hall, Alinos Gateway, Echo Hall, High Ground, Alinos Perch and many other examples to prove it isn't just a "recolored version" of Arcterra. Having planet travel adds gameplay to a Metroid title.

[quote="Acheron86"]
 If most planets in the game wasn't so one-dimensional[spoiler](think Corruption's "federation base planet, sky city planet, red pirate city planet", compared to the beauty and variety of Bryyo/Phaaze)[/spoiler] it might've been a lot more interesting. 
[/quote]

Considering how we explored the same region of a planet/station in Hunters for both the first/second visits, the theme is more likely to remain constant. In Corruption, though, we've got different regions linked together only by ship travel. In that case, there should've been much more variety. Hunters only had doors dividing the areas of the first/second visit locations; therefore, it wouldn't have made sense to make major changes to the environment, but there are changes at a lesser scale.

[quote="Acheron86"]
The ship use for travel was just a time-waster for story reasons; we could have just as soon had[spoiler] one rich and varied planet, like Prime 1, with multiple seeds to destroy[/spoiler] instead, and it would have been more fun and more immersive. 
[/quote]

It wouldn't have made sense for there to be multiple [spoiler]Leviathans[/spoiler] on one planet. Dark Samus wouldn't be much of a villain by just sending them all to one planet, and the Federation wouldn't look to bright for depending upon one planet for their resources. Corruption wouldn't have made sense at all, and I believe Metroid games are suppose to make sense unless they're like Metroid Prime Pinball. I'd rather have a time-waster that adds new gameplay elements to the Metroid Series than having one planet of variety that destroys the story.

[quote="Acheron86"]
Artificial walls to force you down a certain path is just lame. 
[/quote]

Metroid Prime Hunters doesn't have artificial walls that force you to take a certain path. In fact, there's plenty of free-roaming in Hunters. The shields are more of a guiding feature that's only temporary, unlike the nagging of the Aurora Unit and others in Corruption. Also Hunters doesn't have that guiding Hint System of Prime, Echoes and Corruption; which takes away from free-roaming elements.

[quote="Acheron86"]
 I'm confident in saying you're reading too much into a cutscene--I doubt that interpretation was what the game makers themselves intended. 
[/quote]

Each hunter is still seen using a different weapon other than their stated weapon of choice. Just look at the cutscene. Whether it was their intentions or not, the scene still shows each using a different weapon.

[url=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D21on4whcT4&feature=related]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D21on4whcT4&feature=related[/url]

[quote="Acheron86"]
An achievement screen doesn't factor into anything.
[/quote]

It's a useful tool for those who speed run in the Metroid games. The screen allows them to see their records and helps them to set goals on future runs that may attempt at a better time. Speed Running has become an important aspect of a lot of Metroid titles.

[quote="Acheron86"]
 This isn't a bonus feature, it's a bare minimum requirement.
[/quote]

It has some features of the X-ray visor within the Scan Visor, however. I already stated why.

[quote="Acheron86"]
that's not what makes a game "Metroid" to me. Usually Metroids do that.
[/quote]

That's my point. It has features that other Metroid titles share with it.

[quote="Acheron86"]
 They ARE annoying to most players. 
[/quote]

Oh please, the blast shields are no different from other environmental hazards found in the games.

[quote="Acheron86"]
You have a chance here to scrounge up some dignity. If I were you'd I'd apologize for the undue fervor and aggression you've displayed and just agree to disagree. Show some civility and you'll come out of this a better person for it. My 2c.
[/quote]

If gaining dignity means I've got to give up on something that I believe in; it can go to hell. My fervor was not undue, and I will not be saying sorry for it. [i]This is the repayment[/i].

[quote="Arkarian"]
Actually, most of the weapons in Metroid games [i]aren't[/i] given as immediate rewards for beating bosses. Neither the Ice Beam nor the Plasma Beam were like that in Prime, and the same is true for Echoze's Dark and Light Beams (I honestly don't remember how you get the Annihilator, but I'm betting it's not from a boss).
That's actually always been something I really like about Metroid: you can just be randomly exploring and stumble upon a really cool item without having to do anything in particular to receive it.
[/quote]

I only said something about the [i]Prime games[/i]; I didn't say a thing about the 2-D Metroid titles when I was talking about the weapons featured in Hunters except when it came to the sub-weapon concept.

The Nova Beam was acquired by defeating that band of Space Pirates found on the Pirate Homeworld. The Ice Missiles, Grapple Voltage and Plasma Beam were all acquired from defeating the respective hunter. Also each Hyper Mode upgrade was obtained from a boss.

In Prime, we get the Wave Beam by beating a group of Baby Sheegoths then the Sheegoth as like a mini-boss. Also we get the Power Bombs from beating that invisible Sentry Droid. Metroid Prime produces those Phazon puddles, so we get the Phazon Beam from that creature though temporary. We defeat the Hive Mecha (which produces multiple War Wasps for us to kill) for the missile launcher in Prime. For the Morph Ball Bombs, you have to defeat the Incinerator Drone and the War Wasps found within the Burn Dome. My point stands with Prime.

With Echoes, we get the Annihilator Beam from beating Quadraxis at the Hive Temple. You get the Power Bomb from the Power Bomb Guardian. For the Super Missile, you've got to defeat a group of Space Pirates at the Torvus Temple to receive the upgrade. You need to defeat the Bomb Guardian to get your Morph Ball Bombs too. There are plenty of weapons obtained by conflict when it comes to either a boss or a group of enemies in Prime, Echoes and Corruption.

KennyMan666

2008-04-10 06:12:45 pm

Viking

Precursor

Quote from IUniverse:

How about comparing other Metroid games' gameplay to Hunters, Metroid Bosses to the bosses of Hunters, etc...I didn't think this would be a hard debate to win for this place, but it seems that that is the case.

Oh, so.

Let's look at the bosses. Let's look at the Echoes bosses, since that's my favourite in the series.

That big Splinter, Bomb Guardian, Jump Guardian, Amorbis, Boost Guardian, Chykka, Alpha Blogg, Dark Federation Trooper or whatever, Grapple Guardian, Spider Guardian, that other Spider Ball-based boss which was in a cylinder but the name escapes me, Power Bomb Guardian, Quadraxis, Emperor Ing, Dark Samus (did I forget any?). In one order or another. Much variation in them, most being really fun bosses to fight, Spider Guardian and Quadraxis in particular - plus several of them have actual challenge. Boost Guardian especially was a beast the first time. Many of them requiring use of certain upgrades.

Now, Hunters bosses?

Cretaphid and Slench. Both were stupid, easy and became repetitive already the second time. All you had to do was change to the weapon that corresponded to the current colour of the boss while running around - in other words, exactly what Metroid Prime did four years earlier. The hunters - little to no challenge at all, insanely repetitive. Gorea, first form - fairly trivial. The only boss that almost approaches a degree of difficulty if you let it. Gorea, true form - a complete and utter joke. Easiest boss in the game.

---

And for another of your points entirely: The hint system in the Prime games is very, very deactivateable. And even if you have it on, it just tells you what room to go to. It doesn't lock out any paths you can take.

[quote="IUniverse"]
How about comparing other Metroid games' gameplay to Hunters, Metroid Bosses to the bosses of Hunters, etc...I didn't think this would be a hard debate to win for this place, but it seems that that is the case.[/quote]
Oh, so.

Let's look at the bosses. Let's look at the Echoes bosses, since that's my favourite in the series.

That big Splinter, Bomb Guardian, Jump Guardian, Amorbis, Boost Guardian, Chykka, Alpha Blogg, Dark Federation Trooper or whatever, Grapple Guardian, Spider Guardian, that other Spider Ball-based boss which was in a cylinder but the name escapes me, Power Bomb Guardian, [i]Quadraxis[/i], Emperor Ing, Dark Samus (did I forget any?). In one order or another. Much variation in them, most being really fun bosses to fight, Spider Guardian and Quadraxis in particular - plus several of them have actual challenge. Boost Guardian especially was a beast the first time. Many of them requiring use of certain upgrades.

Now, Hunters bosses?

Cretaphid and Slench. Both were stupid, easy and became repetitive already the second time. All you had to do was change to the weapon that corresponded to the current colour of the boss while running around - in other words, exactly what Metroid Prime did four years earlier. The hunters - little to no challenge at all, insanely repetitive. Gorea, first form - fairly trivial. The only boss that almost approaches a degree of difficulty if you let it. Gorea, true form - a complete and utter joke. Easiest boss in the game.

---

And for another of your points entirely: The hint system in the Prime games is very, very deactivateable. And even if you have it on, it just tells you what room to go to. It doesn't lock out any paths you can take.

Acheron

2008-04-10 07:00:40 pm

Acclaimed Threshold

Constant Sorrows

Quote from IUniverse:

The other games deliver to the point that they tell you the whole story, except in the case of the Prime Trilogy. The 2-D games don't even give players any details to wonder about, and that takes away from the mysterious and unknown feeling in the Metroid title.

Could not possibly disagree more than I do with this. It's the lack of story forced on me that makes the game so open-ended. You do realize that taste here is subjective, right? You like apples and I like oranges. You can't say apples absolutely are better just because you're of the opinion they are.

Quote:

Not at all, I'm upset that people want to judge me based on Hunters; therefore, I will make it my intention to crush everything that you all dish out based on Hunters from the other Metroid games. This has been waiting to happen ever since I joined this place.

Let's see if I have this straight. You come to a place where the majority of people hold something in poor regard, voluntarily, and make it a point to zealously defend the thing they don't like because you think it's cool. And you think this is reasonable or respectable in any degree?

Quote:

Yes it does, Hunters is unfairly judged. If that is what you think of Hunters, then for Prime you should think of it as a "fire region, ice region, mining region, nature region". Otherwise, there is just a thing you have with Hunters. If you think Hunters as that, then I'd hate how you see the areas of Aether in Echoes (dark and light realms).

Something about Prime feels very immersive and thematic to me. I think it's just the combination of music and atmosphere. Those are very important to me. Again, it's subjective taste. What I do know is that I'm in the majority of Metroid fans here in saying Hunters doesn't have that. I also think there's something to be said about a game that is generally regarded poorly. To me, if most people don't like a game, that means the developers dropped the ball, because games should be made to be fun for as many players as possible.

I'm a fan of some very poorly-recieved games. I've played through Vagrant Story about twenty times and it's among my favorite games ever. But I know the game is very lackluster in the eyes of most gamers, and I don't have to make a fight out of it when someone says they think it sucks ass. I'm certainly not going to go on a zealous crusade to convince everyone that it's unfairly received. So what if most people don't like one of my favorite games? Not every game is for everyone. Why can't you be okay with the idea that Hunters is a great game for you but uninteresting to most people?

Quote:

If you're talking about Arcterra and Alinos being recolored versions of each other, that couldn't be further from the truth. Arcterra features the gateway which doesn't match Alinos' at all, then there's the Ice Hive, Drip Moat having that odd acidic black substance, the Sanctorus area, Sic Transit and many other examples. Meanwhile Alinos has the Combat Hall, Alinos Gateway, Echo Hall, High Ground, Alinos Perch and many other examples to prove it isn't just a "recolored version" of Arcterra. Having planet travel adds gameplay to a Metroid title.

I was talking about Echoes for the colors. And whether or not planet travel is fun is opinion. I think it sucks.

Quote:

Considering how we explored the same region of a planet/station in Hunters for both the first/second visits, the theme is more likely to remain constant. In Corruption, though, we've got different regions linked together only by ship travel. In that case, there should've been much more variety. Hunters only had doors dividing the areas of the first/second visit locations; therefore, it wouldn't have made sense to make major changes to the environment, but there are changes at a lesser scale.

See, this is why I don't like planet travel. It's an artificial means of making you visit areas in a certain order, and it's far harder to just get lost in the game. Giving me minor flexibility in that aspect isn't gonna cut it either. Prime got it right--one big planet, easy to just wander around and immerse yourself in it. And you can actually SB in it! Good times.

Quote:

It wouldn't have made sense for there to be multiple

Leviathans

on one planet. Dark Samus wouldn't be much of a villain by just sending them all to one planet, and the Federation wouldn't look to bright for depending upon one planet for their resources. Corruption wouldn't have made sense at all, and I believe Metroid games are suppose to make sense unless they're like Metroid Prime Pinball. I'd rather have a time-waster that adds new gameplay elements to the Metroid Series than having one planet of variety that destroys the story.

It made sense with Prime. It could easily be a planet of essential importance to the Federation--or we could lose the whole Federation gimmick altogether. Prime/ZM/SM are my favorite Metroid games. This is because they're so alien, so far away from humanity and civilization. If I wanted to have a futuristic space marine journey I'd play Halo. This is Metroid, and I don't need the Federation. Phaaze could very easily have been the central area on a large and varied planet, and entering it would require disabling Leviathans being developed elsewhere on the planet. I'd even be okay with keeping the space gimmick for the Valhalla, since that area was actually fun.

Quote:

It's a useful tool for those who speed run in the Metroid games. The screen allows them to see their records and helps them to set goals on future runs that may attempt at a better time. Speed Running has become an important aspect of a lot of Metroid titles.

Yeah, but that's a given for a Metroid game. We've had that since the first game.

Quote:

If gaining dignity means I've got to give up on something that I believe in; it can go to hell. My fervor was not undue, and I will not be saying sorry for it. This is the repayment.

I reiterate my original point: you came here, to a place where Hunters is not generally well-loved, and tried to force others who don't like the game to show it respect anyway. That's ridiculous. Your fervor is undue, because you're violating the basic rules of socialization. Only an idiot or a sociopath intentionally tries to tell people who dislike something that they should like it anyway.

[quote="IUniverse"]
The other games deliver to the point that they tell you the whole story, except in the case of the Prime Trilogy. The 2-D games don't even give players any details to wonder about, and that takes away from the mysterious and unknown feeling in the Metroid title.[/quote]
Could not possibly disagree more than I do with this. It's the lack of story forced on me that makes the game so open-ended. You do realize that taste here is subjective, right? You like apples and I like oranges. You can't say apples absolutely are better just because you're of the opinion they are.

[quote]Not at all, I'm upset that people want to judge me based on Hunters; therefore, I will make it my intention to crush everything that you all dish out based on Hunters from the other Metroid games. This has been waiting to happen ever since I joined this place. [/quote]

Let's see if I have this straight. You come to a place where the majority of people hold something in poor regard, voluntarily, and make it a point to zealously defend the thing they don't like because you think it's cool. And you think this is reasonable or respectable in any degree?

[quote]Yes it does, Hunters is unfairly judged. If that is what you think of Hunters, then for Prime you should think of it as a "fire region, ice region, mining region, nature region". Otherwise, there is just a thing you have with Hunters. If you think Hunters as that, then I'd hate how you see the areas of Aether in Echoes (dark and light realms). [/quote]

Something about Prime feels very immersive and thematic to me. I think it's just the combination of music and atmosphere. Those are very important to me. Again, it's subjective taste. What I do know is that I'm in the majority of Metroid fans here in saying Hunters doesn't have that. I also think there's something to be said about a game that is generally regarded poorly. To me, if most people don't like a game, that means the developers dropped the ball, because games should be made to be fun for as many players as possible.

I'm a fan of some very poorly-recieved games. I've played through Vagrant Story about twenty times and it's among my favorite games ever. But I know the game is very lackluster in the eyes of most gamers, and I don't have to make a fight out of it when someone says they think it sucks ass. I'm certainly not going to go on a zealous crusade to convince everyone that it's unfairly received. So what if most people don't like one of my favorite games? Not every game is for everyone. Why can't you be okay with the idea that Hunters is a great game for you but uninteresting to most people?

[quote]If you're talking about Arcterra and Alinos being recolored versions of each other, that couldn't be further from the truth. Arcterra features the gateway which doesn't match Alinos' at all, then there's the Ice Hive, Drip Moat having that odd acidic black substance, the Sanctorus area, Sic Transit and many other examples. Meanwhile Alinos has the Combat Hall, Alinos Gateway, Echo Hall, High Ground, Alinos Perch and many other examples to prove it isn't just a "recolored version" of Arcterra. Having planet travel adds gameplay to a Metroid title. [/quote]

I was talking about Echoes for the colors. And whether or not planet travel is fun is opinion. I think it sucks.

[quote]Considering how we explored the same region of a planet/station in Hunters for both the first/second visits, the theme is more likely to remain constant. In Corruption, though, we've got different regions linked together only by ship travel. In that case, there should've been much more variety. Hunters only had doors dividing the areas of the first/second visit locations; therefore, it wouldn't have made sense to make major changes to the environment, but there are changes at a lesser scale. [/quote]

See, this is why I don't like planet travel. It's an artificial means of making you visit areas in a certain order, and it's far harder to just get lost in the game. Giving me minor flexibility in that aspect isn't gonna cut it either. Prime got it right--one big planet, easy to just wander around and immerse yourself in it. And you can actually SB in it! Good times.

[quote]It wouldn't have made sense for there to be multiple [spoiler]Leviathans[/spoiler] on one planet. Dark Samus wouldn't be much of a villain by just sending them all to one planet, and the Federation wouldn't look to bright for depending upon one planet for their resources. Corruption wouldn't have made sense at all, and I believe Metroid games are suppose to make sense unless they're like Metroid Prime Pinball. I'd rather have a time-waster that adds new gameplay elements to the Metroid Series than having one planet of variety that destroys the story. [/quote]

[spoiler]It made sense with Prime. It could easily be a planet of essential importance to the Federation--or we could lose the whole Federation gimmick altogether. Prime/ZM/SM are my favorite Metroid games. This is because they're so alien, so far away from humanity and civilization. If I wanted to have a futuristic space marine journey I'd play Halo. This is Metroid, and I don't need the Federation. Phaaze could very easily have been the central area on a large and varied planet, and entering it would require disabling Leviathans being developed elsewhere on the planet. I'd even be okay with keeping the space gimmick for the Valhalla, since that area was actually fun.[/spoiler]

[quote]It's a useful tool for those who speed run in the Metroid games. The screen allows them to see their records and helps them to set goals on future runs that may attempt at a better time. Speed Running has become an important aspect of a lot of Metroid titles.[/quote]

Yeah, but that's a given for a Metroid game. We've had that since the first game.

[quote]If gaining dignity means I've got to give up on something that I believe in; it can go to hell. My fervor was not undue, and I will not be saying sorry for it. [i]This is the repayment[/i]. [/quote]

I reiterate my original point: you came here, to a place where Hunters is not generally well-loved, and tried to force others who don't like the game to show it respect anyway. That's ridiculous. Your fervor is undue, because you're violating the basic rules of socialization. Only an idiot or a sociopath intentionally tries to tell people who dislike something that they should like it anyway.

tomatobob

Edit history:

tomatobob: 2008-04-10 08:02:47 pm

2008-04-10 07:26:20 pm

One shall stand, one shall ball.

Quote:

The other games deliver to the point that they tell you the whole story, except in the case of the Prime Trilogy. The 2-D games don't even give players any details to wonder about, and that takes away from the mysterious and unknown feeling in the Metroid title. I'm not saying the feeling is completely gone, it will just lack.

Metroid games are generally meant to stand on their own merits, you aren't given things to "wonder about" because it's unnecessary for the purpose of the game. The mystery comes from being in a strange place full of strange creature, the story in the games is secondary to the overall gameplay and atmosphere, there is supposed to be a feeling of isolation while exploring a hostile alien environment.

Quote:

You really don't realize what's going on here do you? This isn't about me liking Hunters, this about me repaying you all for your games that you've been playing like negatively judging me because of Hunters and assuming that I'll do one thing that I had no intention of doing (like your post stated I'd be making a 14 paragraph essay in the other thread when originally I wasn't going to do anything). I'm not planning on changing anyone's mind; however, I am going to make my point in this thread that I'm not to be challenged or messed with when it comes to being a fan of Hunters. Of course, instead of making this easy by addressing points that Hunters may lack from other Metroid games you keep running on about me liking Hunters.

No, you do not realize what's going on. You're not being judged because you like Hunters, you are being judged because you seem think we want to hear about it in walls of text. My "14 paragraph" post was a joke, not an invitation, much like people joke about Biospark and Fusion.

You're not repaying anyone for anything, stop acting like you're some kind of victim, stop taking a video game so seriously and enjoy it for what it is.

Quote:

Hunters only had doors dividing the areas of the first/second visit locations; therefore, it wouldn't have made sense to make major changes to the environment, but there are changes at a lesser scale

Fusion took place on a space station and it managed to vary things nicely, ARC in particular had some pretty big environmental changes.

Quote:

It wouldn't have made sense for there to be multiple

Leviathans

on one planet. Dark Samus wouldn't be much of a villain by just sending them all to one planet, and the Federation wouldn't look to bright for depending upon one planet for their resources.

Dark Samus wasn't much of a villain anyway and sending multiple seeds to a planet would certainly make the takeover quicker. Also, the Federation seems pretty dependent on Bryyo's fuel gel.

Quote:

Metroid Prime Hunters doesn't have artificial walls that force you to take a certain path. In fact, there's plenty of free-roaming in Hunters. The shields are more of a guiding feature that's only temporary,Also Hunters doesn't have that guiding Hint System of Prime, Echoes and Corruption; which takes away from free-roaming elements.

What? A guiding feature is a guiding feature, if the hint system is a negative in Prime, Echoes, and Corruption, the guiding shields are a negative in Hunters. Furthermore, the hint system can be turned off or outright ignored, far less limiting than a blast shield.

Quote:

Metroid Prime produces those Phazon puddles, so we get the Phazon Beam from that creature though temporary.

Techincally, Phazon Beam capability was gained from Omega Pirate along with the Phazon Suit.

[quote]The other games deliver to the point that they tell you the whole story, except in the case of the Prime Trilogy. The 2-D games don't even give players any details to wonder about, and that takes away from the mysterious and unknown feeling in the Metroid title. I'm not saying the feeling is completely gone, it will just lack. [/quote]

Metroid games are generally meant to stand on their own merits, you aren't given things to "wonder about" because it's unnecessary for the purpose of the game. The mystery comes from being in a strange place full of strange creature, the story in the games is secondary to the overall gameplay and atmosphere, there is supposed to be a feeling of isolation while exploring a hostile alien environment.

[quote]You really don't realize what's going on here do you? This isn't about me liking Hunters, this about me repaying you all for your games that you've been playing like negatively judging me because of Hunters and assuming that I'll do one thing that I had no intention of doing (like your post stated I'd be making a 14 paragraph essay in the other thread when originally I wasn't going to do anything). I'm not planning on changing anyone's mind; however, I am going to make my point in this thread that I'm not to be challenged or messed with when it comes to being a fan of Hunters. Of course, instead of making this easy by addressing points that Hunters may lack from other Metroid games you keep running on about me liking Hunters.
[/quote]

No, you do not realize what's going on. You're not being judged because you like Hunters, you are being judged because you seem think we want to hear about it in walls of text. My "14 paragraph" post was a joke, not an invitation, much like people joke about Biospark and Fusion.

You're not repaying anyone for anything, stop acting like you're some kind of victim, stop taking a video game so seriously and enjoy it for what it is. 
 
[quote]Hunters only had doors dividing the areas of the first/second visit locations; therefore, it wouldn't have made sense to make major changes to the environment, but there are changes at a lesser scale[/quote]

Fusion took place on a space station and it managed to vary things nicely, ARC in particular had some pretty big environmental changes.

[quote]It wouldn't have made sense for there to be multiple [spoiler]Leviathans[/spoiler] on one planet. Dark Samus wouldn't be much of a villain by just sending them all to one planet, and the Federation wouldn't look to bright for depending upon one planet for their resources.[/quote]

Dark Samus wasn't much of a villain anyway and sending multiple seeds to a planet would certainly make the takeover quicker. Also, the Federation seems pretty dependent on Bryyo's fuel gel.

[quote]Metroid Prime Hunters doesn't have artificial walls that force you to take a certain path. In fact, there's plenty of free-roaming in Hunters. The shields are more of a [b]guiding feature[/b] that's only temporary,Also Hunters [b]doesn't have that guiding Hint System[/b] of Prime, Echoes and Corruption; which takes away from free-roaming elements. [/quote]

What? A guiding feature is a guiding feature, if the hint system is a negative in Prime, Echoes, and Corruption, the guiding shields are a negative in Hunters. Furthermore, the hint system can be turned off or outright ignored, far less limiting than a blast shield.

[quote]Metroid Prime produces those Phazon puddles, so we get the Phazon Beam from that creature though temporary. 
[/quote]

Techincally, Phazon Beam capability was gained from Omega Pirate along with the Phazon Suit.

KennyMan666

2008-04-10 07:49:23 pm

Viking

Precursor

Quote from tomatobob:

Your

* KennyMan666 glares

Repeat after me: "You are" is abbreviated to "you're"

tomatobob

2008-04-10 08:02:25 pm

One shall stand, one shall ball.

Dammit! I fixed like three of those before posting!

arkarian

2008-04-10 09:22:50 pm

red chamber dream

Quote from IUniverse:

Get over it, this is a debate don't change the subject.

THIS IS NOT A FUCKING DEBATE. NO ONE IS ARGUING ANYTHING BUT YOU. THAT MAKES IT NOT A DEBATE.

It's not your job to convince others to like the games you like, nor is it our job to argue our own likes and dislikes. Post your fanfiction somewhere else.

Acheron

2008-04-10 10:15:05 pm

Acclaimed Threshold

Constant Sorrows

Quote from Arkarian:

Quote from IUniverse:

Get over it, this is a debate don't change the subject.

THIS IS NOT A FUCKING DEBATE. NO ONE IS ARGUING ANYTHING BUT YOU. THAT MAKES IT NOT A DEBATE.

It's not your job to convince others to like the games you like, nor is it our job to argue our own likes and dislikes. Post your fanfiction somewhere else.

Actually, I've been arguing/debating, but I'm throwing in the hat here. If I can't reach this guy with the last post I'm just feeding trolls.

Hejira

2008-04-11 04:47:17 am

Look...I'm all for crazy Hunters theories as much as the next person, but...it just wasn't fun to play, IMO. That's...that's all. A game's supposed to be fun, right?

Cpadolf

2008-04-11 12:33:11 pm

Almost happy

No, it's obviously supposed to be so god damn boring that you have to think up a bunch of background stuff that isn't really there to make it fun. The best games even forces it's fans to post very long and unresonable posts about how great they are, even though others fail to realize it.

So MPH is clearly a huge hit Very Happy

tomatobob

2008-04-11 05:40:08 pm

One shall stand, one shall ball.

If it don't need really long borein' fanfiction to be interestin' it ain't worth playin'. Ayup.

IUniverse

(user is banned)

2008-04-12 11:33:33 am

[BANNED]

Quote from KennyMan666:

That big Splinter, Bomb Guardian, Jump Guardian, Amorbis, Boost Guardian, Chykka, Alpha Blogg, Dark Federation Trooper or whatever, Grapple Guardian, Spider Guardian, that other Spider Ball-based boss which was in a cylinder but the name escapes me, Power Bomb Guardian, Quadraxis, Emperor Ing, Dark Samus (did I forget any?).

Bosses:
Dark Alpha Splinter
Bomb Guardian
Jump Guardian
Dark Samus 1
Amorbis
Boost Guardian
Alpha Blogg
Grapple Guardian
Chykka
Spider Guardian
Power Bomb Guardian
Dark Samus 2
Quadraxis
Emperor Ing
Dark Samus 3 (and 4)

In Echoes, we face Dark Samus 4 times. That's just as repetitive as the bosses Slench and Cretaphid. Though Dark Samus may have gained new techniques, it still doesn't excuse it from being repetitive (as is the case for the Cretaphid and Slench). Also, most of the bosses give Samus Aran an upgrade for beating them instead of letting players explore the regions of Aether for them. The concept of exploration in Echoes is overused especially with the game having the constant theme of light and dark the whole time. Also it never stated how exactly the Ing were able to extract the power-ups from Samus Aran, that these "Guardians" later use in boss fights. The game wouldn't have been so boring to me if it had more mystery laid out in a less dull scene...every area is either all dark or all sunny it seems.

At least in Hunters, it doesn't have the same look to it all the time. The Slench also is more than that; you've got to shoot those three tongue-like things that are being used to hold the shield around the stationary Slench and to provide the energy for the energy blasters to fire at Samus Aran. Then once it is disconnected from the wall, it starts to hover around shooting down upon you. The Cretaphid has the player destroying the dot structures covering the mechanism, and only then will its true weakspot be revealed. I will admit though, they are repetitive.

Saying the Hunters are repetitive is like saying Metroids, Phazon creatures, the X and other things of that nature are repetitive. They are the key focus of their respective games, so it's reasonable to have them encountered time and time again. As for Gorea Phase 1, it's actually one of the easiest when speed running and Gorea 2 is one of the hardest when speed running. If you get hit by that laser of Gorea 2 and have no energy tanks obtained due to speed running, you're screwed. That laser does a heck of a lot more damage to Samus when you only have 99hp.

Quote from KennyMan666:

The hint system in the Prime games is very, very deactivateable. And even if you have it on, it just tells you what room to go to. It doesn't lock out any paths you can take.

Yes, I know. Still having the hint system tells generally where to go, it's kind of hand-holding to an extent.

Quote from Acheron86:

Let's see if I have this straight. You come to a place where the majority of people hold something in poor regard, voluntarily, and make it a point to zealously defend the thing they don't like because you think it's cool. And you think this is reasonable or respectable in any degree?

I stated in my last post why I'm doing this, it has nothing to do with who likes what at all. I'm sending a message that I don't like to be fucked with, and when I am I can be quite a jerk to those who mess with me. I, for one, don't like coming to a forum then getting criticised on my views. Until my Metroid Prime Hunters threads are restored on that respective board, this thread isn't going to calm anytime soon.

Quote from Acheron86:

Something about Prime feels very immersive and thematic to me. I think it's just the combination of music and atmosphere. Those are very important to me. Again, it's subjective taste.

Here's more on how I see Hunters, mix of subjective and objective details. I cannot change anyone's views though, but I can defend mine and define my standing with Hunters.

Metroid Prime: Hunters is not only my favorite Metroid game, but it is also my favorite game all together. I enjoy Hunters because it dares to deify the boundaries of the Metroid Series along with its formula. The bases of Metroid are all about the brainwork of exploration, Hunters is the polar opposite from this with a linear story mode. I’ve also noticed that the other Metroid games excluding Hunters tend to give you all the information on the story in the game; however, in Hunters, I believe it wanted us to raise questions and to find the answers to them using the limited tools we were given. See I like to think of MPH as a jig-saw puzzle with all its pieces piled up to form a straight line, but in order to get the full picture you have to move these pieces around and connect them together only then will one receive all that is and could be Hunters.

The multiplayer was clearly the main focus for the NDS adventure of Metroid Prime: Hunters. I may be a little crazy for liking MPH above all other Metroid games I’ve played; however, I know a main focus when I see it. The arenas in MPH offer a variety of different level designs; however, they only show 3 main themes: Dry/Lava, Technological and Ice. Even though they only show a few themes, doesn’t mean the environments are repetitive. The clone stages offer even more legroom then their processors while not being entirely the same. Actually they shouldn’t even be referred to as “clone” stages, reason being is that they express their own uniqueness through upgrade layouts and structural design.

The Hunters are unbalanced; however, this is a blessing not a curse. The unbalance offers more originality to each of the seven hunters, it wouldn’t be right to allow the StingLarva to boost to balance it with the Morph Ball or give it the same amount of power. This offers a broader range of choice to Hunters and also provides the challenge some veterans usually crave. It wouldn’t be fun to keep playing a Spire User that you know you could be even with if you used Samus; instead, they may choose Noxus to keep things challenging and entertaining. Like I said earlier, its all about choices: which hunter should I use, which hunter would be best against the opposing hunter, which weapon should I use, how much ammo do I really need, at what health amount should I decide to run at, where is the nearest health, what are some short cuts in the level, etc.

The customization with hunters is endless. It has 7 modes, 30+ arenas, 10 weapons (including alternate forms), 7 hunters, 5 rankings, and a ton more of other features in one little NDS card. I can at least see 73,500 combinations for multiplayer matches with the above stats, that is a mother load of replay value perhaps the main reason why MPH is so addicting to gamers. That many combinations actually makes this great game sound more like a tactical shooter than a first-person shooter even though it is first-person. The weapons add uniqueness to this game with the inclusion of the affinity system. Each of the seven hunters each respectively have an affinity for a particular weapon this affinity gives them a certain ability that can only be linked through the use of their prized weapon. Lets see so we had 73,500 possible match settings before, but lets see how many we would have if we added the affinities into the equation. The total comes to about 514,500 combinations; however, this does not include all the match settings in MPH such as time, objective goals, and advanced rules. This game clearly has a ton of overlooked play value, which offers hours of hunts for the gaming community.

Quote from Acheron86:

What I do know is that I'm in the majority of Metroid fans here in saying Hunters doesn't have that.

So you have pals? Do you think I give a damn if you're a part of a majority? I'll either way. Safety nets can always fail too, that's why I don't depend on them.

Quote from Acheron86:

I also think there's something to be said about a game that is generally regarded poorly.

The game is just as much regarded positively, this place is only one of many forums that has Metroid discussion.

Quote from Acheron86:

because games should be made to be fun for as many players as possible.

The game was made to be fun. A majority of people enjoy the multiplayer, and there are sum that enjoy doing Speed Runs within the story mode. Again, this place is just one of many forums.

Quote from Acheron86:

Why can't you be okay with the idea that Hunters is a great game for you but uninteresting to most people?

I've accepted it, but people can't except that I like Hunters. After what was done to my posts, that's even more proof. Also, all the attacking of my opinions when I didn't do anything.

Quote from Acheron86:

And whether or not planet travel is fun is opinion. I think it sucks.

I didn't even say it was fun or not fun. I said that the ship travel added gameplay to the Metroid game.

Quote from Acheron86:

It made sense with Prime.

Just because something makes sense in Prime, doesn't mean it'll make sense in the other Metroid titles.

Quote from Acheron86:

It could easily be a planet of essential importance to the Federation--or we could lose the whole Federation gimmick altogether.

The Federation was a main part of Corruption, lossing that aspect would destroy the game. After what happened in Echoes, it was quite obvious that the final game would have even more Federation influence. Heck, the PED Suit designs were created from what happened on Aether after Echoes.

Quote from Acheron86:

This is Metroid, and I don't need the Federation.

You need them to even have the beginning to Super Metroid and to have a Metroid Fusion.

Quote from Acheron86:

Yeah, but that's a given for a Metroid game. We've had that since the first game.

The point is that you said "An achievement screen doesn't factor into anything." Which is not the case.

Quote from Acheron86:

Only an idiot or a sociopath intentionally tries to tell people who dislike something that they should like it anyway.

I'm not telling anyone to like the game. I am merely justifying my views since this place can't accept that I like Hunters. I came to this forum to have a place to share my data and talk about Metroid, but it seems this place isn't what I expected. Seems to be more focused on bashing those who differ.

[quote="KennyMan666"]
That big Splinter, Bomb Guardian, Jump Guardian, Amorbis, Boost Guardian, Chykka, Alpha Blogg, Dark Federation Trooper or whatever, Grapple Guardian, Spider Guardian, that other Spider Ball-based boss which was in a cylinder but the name escapes me, Power Bomb Guardian, [i]Quadraxis[/i], Emperor Ing, Dark Samus (did I forget any?). 
[/quote]

Bosses:
Dark Alpha Splinter
Bomb [b]Guardian[/b]
Jump [b]Guardian[/b]
[b]Dark Samus 1[/b]
Amorbis
Boost [b]Guardian[/b]
Alpha Blogg
Grapple [b]Guardian[/b]
Chykka
Spider [b]Guardian[/b]
Power Bomb [b]Guardian[/b]
[b]Dark Samus 2[/b]
Quadraxis
Emperor Ing
[b]Dark Samus 3 (and 4)[/b]

In Echoes, we face Dark Samus 4 times. That's just as repetitive as the bosses Slench and Cretaphid. Though Dark Samus may have gained new techniques, it still doesn't excuse it from being repetitive (as is the case for the Cretaphid and Slench). Also, most of the bosses give Samus Aran an upgrade for beating them instead of letting players explore the regions of Aether for them. The concept of exploration in Echoes is overused especially with the game having the constant theme of light and dark the whole time. Also it never stated how exactly the Ing were able to extract the power-ups from Samus Aran, that these "Guardians" later use in boss fights. The game wouldn't have been so boring to me if it had more mystery laid out in a less dull scene...every area is either all dark or all sunny it seems.

At least in Hunters, it doesn't have the same look to it all the time. The Slench also is more than that; you've got to shoot those three tongue-like things that are being used to hold the shield around the stationary Slench and to provide the energy for the energy blasters to fire at Samus Aran. Then once it is disconnected from the wall, it starts to hover around shooting down upon you. The Cretaphid has the player destroying the dot structures covering the mechanism, and only then will its true weakspot be revealed. I will admit though, they are repetitive.

Saying the Hunters are repetitive is like saying Metroids, Phazon creatures, the X and other things of that nature are repetitive. They are the key focus of their respective games, so it's reasonable to have them encountered time and time again. As for Gorea Phase 1, it's actually one of the easiest when speed running and Gorea 2 is one of the hardest when speed running. If you get hit by that laser of Gorea 2 and have no energy tanks obtained due to speed running, you're screwed. That laser does a heck of a lot more damage to Samus when you only have 99hp.

[quote="KennyMan666"]
 The hint system in the Prime games is very, very deactivateable. And even if you have it on, it just tells you what room to go to. It doesn't lock out any paths you can take.
[/quote]

Yes, I know. Still having the hint system tells generally where to go, it's kind of hand-holding to an extent.

[quote="Acheron86"]
Let's see if I have this straight. You come to a place where the majority of people hold something in poor regard, voluntarily, and make it a point to zealously defend the thing they don't like because you think it's cool. And you think this is reasonable or respectable in any degree?
[/quote]

I stated in my last post why I'm doing this, it has nothing to do with who likes what at all. I'm sending a message that I don't like to be fucked with, and when I am I can be quite a jerk to those who mess with me. I, for one, don't like coming to a forum then getting criticised on my views. Until my Metroid Prime Hunters threads are restored on that respective board, this thread isn't going to calm anytime soon.

[quote="Acheron86"]
Something about Prime feels very immersive and thematic to me. I think it's just the combination of music and atmosphere. Those are very important to me. Again, it's subjective taste. 
[/quote]

Here's more on how I see Hunters, mix of subjective and objective details. I cannot change anyone's views though, but I can defend mine and define my standing with Hunters.

Metroid Prime: Hunters is not only my favorite Metroid game, but it is also my favorite game all together. I enjoy Hunters because it dares to deify the boundaries of the Metroid Series along with its formula. The bases of Metroid are all about the brainwork of exploration, Hunters is the polar opposite from this with a linear story mode. I’ve also noticed that the other Metroid games excluding Hunters tend to give you all the information on the story in the game; however, in Hunters, I believe it wanted us to raise questions and to find the answers to them using the limited tools we were given. See I like to think of MPH as a jig-saw puzzle with all its pieces piled up to form a straight line, but in order to get the full picture you have to move these pieces around and connect them together only then will one receive all that is and could be Hunters.

The multiplayer was clearly the main focus for the NDS adventure of Metroid Prime: Hunters. I may be a little crazy for liking MPH above all other Metroid games I’ve played; however, I know a main focus when I see it. The arenas in MPH offer a variety of different level designs; however, they only show 3 main themes: Dry/Lava, Technological and Ice. Even though they only show a few themes, doesn’t mean the environments are repetitive. The clone stages offer even more legroom then their processors while not being entirely the same. Actually they shouldn’t even be referred to as “clone” stages, reason being is that they express their own uniqueness through upgrade layouts and structural design.

The Hunters are unbalanced; however, this is a blessing not a curse. The unbalance offers more originality to each of the seven hunters, it wouldn’t be right to allow the StingLarva to boost to balance it with the Morph Ball or give it the same amount of power. This offers a broader range of choice to Hunters and also provides the challenge some veterans usually crave. It wouldn’t be fun to keep playing a Spire User that you know you could be even with if you used Samus; instead, they may choose Noxus to keep things challenging and entertaining. Like I said earlier, its all about choices: which hunter should I use, which hunter would be best against the opposing hunter, which weapon should I use, how much ammo do I really need, at what health amount should I decide to run at, where is the nearest health, what are some short cuts in the level, etc.

The customization with hunters is endless. It has 7 modes, 30+ arenas, 10 weapons (including alternate forms), 7 hunters, 5 rankings, and a ton more of other features in one little NDS card. I can at least see 73,500 combinations for multiplayer matches with the above stats, that is a mother load of replay value perhaps the main reason why MPH is so addicting to gamers. That many combinations actually makes this great game sound more like a tactical shooter than a first-person shooter even though it is first-person. The weapons add uniqueness to this game with the inclusion of the affinity system. Each of the seven hunters each respectively have an affinity for a particular weapon this affinity gives them a certain ability that can only be linked through the use of their prized weapon. Lets see so we had 73,500 possible match settings before, but lets see how many we would have if we added the affinities into the equation. The total comes to about 514,500 combinations; however, this does not include all the match settings in MPH such as time, objective goals, and advanced rules. This game clearly has a ton of overlooked play value, which offers hours of hunts for the gaming community.

[quote="Acheron86"]
What I do know is that I'm in the majority of Metroid fans here in saying Hunters doesn't have that.
[/quote]

So you have pals? Do you think I give a damn if you're a part of a majority? I'll either way. Safety nets can always fail too, that's why I don't depend on them.

[quote="Acheron86"]
 I also think there's something to be said about a game that is generally regarded poorly.
 [/quote]

The game is just as much regarded positively, this place is only one of many forums that has Metroid discussion.

[quote="Acheron86"]
 because games should be made to be fun for as many players as possible.
 [/quote]

The game was made to be fun. A majority of people enjoy the multiplayer, and there are sum that enjoy doing Speed Runs within the story mode. Again, this place is just one of many forums.

[quote="Acheron86"]
 Why can't you be okay with the idea that Hunters is a great game for you but uninteresting to most people?
 [/quote]

I've accepted it, but people can't except that I like Hunters. After what was done to my posts, that's even more proof. Also, all the attacking of my opinions when I didn't do anything.

[quote="Acheron86"]
 And whether or not planet travel is fun is opinion. I think it sucks.
 [/quote]

I didn't even say it was fun or not fun. I said that the ship travel added gameplay to the Metroid game.

[quote="Acheron86"]
[spoiler]It made sense with Prime.[/spoiler]
[/quote]

Just because something makes sense in Prime, doesn't mean it'll make sense in the other Metroid titles.

[quote="Acheron86"]
 [spoiler]It could easily be a planet of essential importance to the Federation--or we could lose the whole Federation gimmick altogether.[/spoiler]
[/quote]

[spoiler]
The Federation was a main part of Corruption, lossing that aspect would destroy the game. After what happened in Echoes, it was quite obvious that the final game would have even more Federation influence. Heck, the PED Suit designs were created from what happened on Aether after Echoes.
[/spoiler]

[quote="Acheron86"]
 [spoiler] This is Metroid, and I don't need the Federation.[/spoiler]
[/quote]

You need them to even have the beginning to Super Metroid and to have a Metroid Fusion.

[quote="Acheron86"]
Yeah, but that's a given for a Metroid game. We've had that since the first game.
[/quote]

The point is that you said "An achievement screen doesn't factor into anything." Which is not the case.

[quote="Acheron86"]
 Only an idiot or a sociopath intentionally tries to tell people who dislike something that they should like it anyway.
[/quote]

I'm not telling anyone to like the game. I am merely justifying my views since this place can't accept that I like Hunters. I came to this forum to have a place to share my data and talk about Metroid, but it seems this place isn't what I expected. Seems to be more focused on bashing those who differ.

SABERinBLUE

2008-04-12 12:01:49 pm

Cook of the Sea

Quote from IUniverse:

this place can't accept that I like Hunters.

Of course we can accept that you like Hunters. We just don't care that you like Hunters. And we doubly don't care about your massive tl;dr theories about it.