I don't care what the purists say.

2010-02-05 12:10:27 pm

I hope Metroid Other M is full of story.

There, I said it.

I love Metroid. I absolutely love the series. And to me, the idea of a more story-based Metroid game just makes me more excited. Metroid's universe is literally and figuratively larger than Mario and Zelda, yet we know so little about it. The thought of finally getting to learn more about the universe and be a part of it just makes me happy about it. I don't care if that means things like cutscenes and a slight linearity. Fusion managed to pull that off well enough. Sure it was a bit restrictive at times but there was still tons of stuff to find even after beating Ridley. If that's not exploration I don't know what is.

I want the story to have me relive the events of K-2L through Samus's eyes, watching as the Space Pirates and Ridley destroy her family and her home.

I want to relive Samus's upbringing by the Chozo, her ascent into what she is today.

I want to relive the final battle of Super Metroid against the Mother Brain in full 3D.

I want the story to overall enter into Samus's past. Sure, her mysteriousness is interesting but I feel like after all these years I want to know exactly what happened to her.

Call me crazy. Call me a non-traditionalist. Go as far as to say that I'm to a true fan and continue your rants that Other M will lead to the destruction of the series because AAAA STORY AND LINEARITY. I don't care, I know I'm the minority. But for those of you who are willing to give a more story based Metroid a chance, I hope they give us a hell of a game.

Thread title:

I hope Metroid Other M is full of story.

There, I said it.

I love Metroid.  I absolutely love the series.  And to me, the idea of a more story-based Metroid game just makes me more excited.  Metroid's universe is literally and figuratively larger than Mario and Zelda, yet we know so little about it.  The thought of finally getting to learn more about the universe and be a part of it just makes me happy about it.  I don't care if that means things like cutscenes and a slight linearity.  Fusion managed to pull that off well enough.  Sure it was a bit restrictive at times but there was still tons of stuff to find even after beating Ridley.  If that's not exploration I don't know what is.

I want the story to have me relive the events of K-2L through Samus's eyes, watching as the Space Pirates and Ridley destroy her family and her home.

I want to relive Samus's upbringing by the Chozo, her ascent into what she is today.

I want to relive the final battle of Super Metroid against the Mother Brain in full 3D.

I want the story to overall enter into Samus's past.  Sure, her mysteriousness is interesting but I feel like after all these years I want to know exactly what happened to her.

Call me crazy. Call me a non-traditionalist.  Go as far as to say that I'm to a true fan and continue your rants that Other M will lead to the destruction of the series because AAAA STORY AND LINEARITY.  I don't care, I know I'm the minority.  But for those of you who are willing to give a more story based Metroid a chance, I hope they give us a hell of a game.

TheGreenManalishi

2010-02-05 12:19:30 pm

I agree with you on wanting a heavier emphasis on story. Metroid Prime is about as good as a game can get with minimal story. Really, it doesn't even have a story, it has a context (the details of which are revealed as the game progresses, if you read the scans), a problem and an eventual resolution. Corruption didn't get the story right, because if you're going to have a progressive plot, it has to be interesting and believeable within the fictional universe it occurs in.

Opium

2010-02-05 02:59:22 pm

Quote from FirePhoenix:

I hope Metroid Other M is full of story.
...

I tend to agree with you. The fact that there hasn't been much story so far has led to alot of speculation, and I think alot of people's feathers may be ruffled when it turns out what they had been thinking all along was wrong because it never really was more than a guess anyways. Then they'll turn around and say: 'They ruined it! That's not how it's supposed to be!' as if the fans were the ones who decided what was what and not nintendo. I'm ready to turn the page, and if nintendo's track record (even while 'overseeing') means anything, then this game shouldn't disappoint.

TheGreenManalishi

2010-02-05 03:10:30 pm

I'm going to take this chance to say that I think, if Other M works well (what with the voice acting and such), I expect Nintendo will take Zelda in a similar direction. When last I was playing Twilight Princess, there seems to be no reason for there not to be voiced characters (especially Zelda).

Opium

2010-02-05 03:15:44 pm

My first reaction to that is - NOOOOOO !! Strangely, I seem to be more open to metroid moving in that direction than zelda. I guess I kinda think of putting VA and story into metroid as an effort to save/revive a series that appears to be on the decline. Zelda is doing fine, no need to make any changes that major.

TheGreenManalishi

2010-02-05 03:21:00 pm

Quote from Opium:

Zelda is doing fine, no need to make any changes that major.

Did you play TP? PH? Spirit Tracks? I rest my case.

Prime Hunter

2010-02-05 04:14:27 pm

I didn't see much wrong with Spirit Tracks at all, and I still like Twilight Princess and Phantom Hourglass even if a lot of Zelda fans don't seem to. But I think I understand what you're saying with that, and Nintendo's certainly been listening since the new Wii Zelda is supposedly going to be a huge change from the norm if I remember hearing right back when TP came out. (Something about how TP was going to be the last major Zelda with the same gameplay formula we all know)

Personally, it almost looks like Other M is a kind of experiment on Nintendo's part to see if these kinds of changes are acceptable for one of their core series. I still think that out of all of them, Metroid is the series that feels right moving in this direction first, and the one that seems most comfortable with that kind of drastic change. As FirePhoenix said, there is a wide universe out there for Metroid, both figuratively and literally, and I can see plenty of options for where to take the series as a whole. I don't get that feeling as much with Mario or Zelda.

I didn't see much wrong with Spirit Tracks at all, and I still like Twilight Princess and Phantom Hourglass even if a lot of Zelda fans don't seem to. But I think I understand what you're saying with that, and Nintendo's certainly been listening since the new Wii Zelda is supposedly going to be a huge change from the norm if I remember hearing right back when TP came out. (Something about how TP was going to be the last major Zelda with the same gameplay formula we all know)

Personally, it almost looks like Other M is a kind of experiment on Nintendo's part to see if these kinds of changes are acceptable for one of  their core series. I still think that out of all of them, Metroid is the series that feels right moving in this direction first, and the one that seems most comfortable with that kind of drastic change. As FirePhoenix said, there is a wide universe out there for Metroid, both figuratively and literally, and I can see plenty of options for where to take the series as a whole. I don't get that feeling as much with Mario or Zelda.

Toozin

2010-02-05 04:52:31 pm

Not impossible

just highly unlikely

They already made a story-heavy, action-focused Metroid and it was called Fusion.

This is not an experiment. Look at the Prime series' progression from Prime to Corruption. This is the direction they are taking the series, simple as that.

I remain concerned that the heart of the series will be lost, especially in Team Ninja's hands. But I was thinking the same of Prime pre-release, so I'm willing to reserve judgement until I actually play it.

tomatobob

2010-02-05 06:33:25 pm

One shall stand, one shall ball.

The real trick is going to be presenting the story in a non retarded way. If they rely on long cutscenes to tell their story they will fail. This isn't an RPG where people expect to spend hours scrolling text and watching cutscenes, it's an action game the story is a means to advance the action and give it more meaning to the player. Introducing a large "dead zone" with a cutscene just removes the player form the meat of the game, which can be effective in a case where you want to really emphasize a particular event, but that only works if you do it once or twice at most after that it just becomes annoying as not every event is absolutely huge and deserving of special attention.

Metroid Prime did a good job of this, the story wasn't deep or complex but it gave you a setting, told you why you were on Tallon IV and characterized the world and it's inhabitants without intruding on the gameplay. It's really too bad that the two following games abandoned that approach for text dumps and cutscenes and the atmosphere really suffered for it.

I guess it hurt Corruption and Fusion the least because those two were at least consistent about it, those games were designed around having some asshole yapping about what they want you to do right the hell now no questions no wandering around STOP LOOKING AT THAT DOOR YOU CAN'T HAVE IT. But I wouldn't consider this the ideal.

What I'd really like is a more Half-Life 2 style experience, you got a few "stand around and listen to this guy set things up for you" moments but you could at least dick around with things while they were talking (hey little teleporter thing, lets see just how much crap you can teleport at once!) and those bits were not long at all. They served to set things up for you and details were filled in by things heard in passing as you wander around, old news paper clippings stuck to a board in a lab, things you saw first hand as you progressed through an area. Nonintrusive things that could be mostly ignored or discovered for the first time in later playthroughs that showed you what was happening more than it told you and let you be on your way without any fuss. I mean, I know that ain't happening in this case, but I can dream.

The real trick is going to be presenting the story in a non retarded way. If they rely on long cutscenes to tell their story they will fail. This isn't an RPG where people expect to spend hours scrolling text and watching cutscenes, it's an action game the story is a means to advance the action and give it more meaning to the player. Introducing a large "dead zone" with a cutscene just removes the player form the meat of the game, which can be effective in a case where you want to really emphasize a particular event, but that only works if you do it once or twice at most after that it just becomes annoying as not every event is absolutely huge and deserving of special attention.

Metroid Prime did a good job of this, the story wasn't deep or complex but it gave you a setting, told you why you were on Tallon IV and characterized the world and it's inhabitants without intruding on the gameplay. It's really too bad that the two following games abandoned that approach for text dumps and cutscenes and the atmosphere really suffered for it.

I guess it hurt Corruption and Fusion the least because those two were at least consistent about it, those games were designed around having some asshole yapping about what they want you to do [i]right the hell now no questions no wandering around STOP LOOKING AT THAT DOOR YOU CAN'T HAVE IT[/i]. But I wouldn't consider this the ideal.

What I'd really like is a more Half-Life 2 style experience, you got a few "stand around and listen to this guy set things up for you" moments but you could at least dick around with things while they were talking (hey little teleporter thing, lets see just how much crap you can teleport at once!) and those bits were not long at all. They served to set things up for you and details were filled in by things heard in passing as you wander around, old news paper clippings stuck to a board in a lab, things you saw first hand as you progressed through an area. Nonintrusive things that could be mostly ignored or discovered for the first time in later playthroughs that showed you what was happening more than it told you and let you be on your way without any fuss. I mean, I know that ain't happening in this case, but I can dream.

Prime Hunter

2010-02-05 08:39:28 pm

What I mainly meant was what tomatobob described as far as the experiment part goes. Heavy storytelling/cutscenes with everything having a voiceover to the point where it becomes a main focus of the game. (You know, like a Metal Gear/RPG kind of game) You are right in that the Metroid series has been headed down this road for some time now, though, especially when you take Corruption into account. Heck, like you said, it's practically already happened if you look solely at what that game offers to us.

While I have no problem with games that are like that, seeing as Metal Gear, Mass Effect, and such are among my favorites, the main thing I'm hoping is that we'll also have a good amount of the story being told through the environment and atmosphere like Super and Prime were great at doing. (So in the end, basically a mix of the two is what I want) And of course, if the action and exploration elements aren't up to par, a good story will only get us so far before things end up going south quickly.

Either way, my opinion still stands regarding the fact that I want Metroid to expand our knowledge of its universe. But that will mean nothing if the gameplay that surrounds the story is worthless.

What I mainly meant was what tomatobob described as far as the experiment part goes. Heavy storytelling/cutscenes with everything having a voiceover to the point where it becomes a main focus of the game. (You know, like a Metal Gear/RPG kind of game) You are right in that the Metroid series has been headed down this road for some time now, though, especially when you take Corruption into account. Heck, like you said, it's practically already happened if you look solely at what that game offers to us.

While I have no problem with games that are like that, seeing as Metal Gear, Mass Effect, and such are among my favorites, the main thing I'm hoping is that we'll also have a good amount of the story being told through the environment and atmosphere like Super and Prime were great at doing. (So in the end, basically a mix of the two is what I want) And of course, if the action and exploration elements aren't up to par, a good story will only get us so far before things end up going south quickly.

Either way, my opinion still stands regarding the fact that I [i]want[/i] Metroid to expand our knowledge of its universe. But that will mean nothing if the gameplay that surrounds the story is worthless.

Opium

2010-02-05 08:45:11 pm

Quote from TheGreenManalishi:

Quote from Opium:

Zelda is doing fine, no need to make any changes that major.

Did you play TP? PH? Spirit Tracks? I rest my case.

I was really measuring the success of the franchise in game sales. Zelda is selling plenty.

Chozoid

2010-02-05 09:20:08 pm

I know everyone will get pissed at me for saying this, but I actually enjoyed Corruption. Loved it. It's my favorite game in the franchise.

Yeah, story sounds really cool. I hope they give the Space Pirates VA. I honestly have mixed feelings on giving Samus VA, though. I did thing it felt weird in Corruption when something odd happened and Samus showed little to no reaction. However, from what I heard of Samus' VA from the trailer, her actress sucks.

Another thing: SCANS! The thing I hated most about Corruption was that the text of all of the scans, with the exception of the lore, were reduced to a singular text block. In Metroid Prime & Echoes, when I scanned a boss or enemy, I would would learn what it was, how it came about, etc., as well as tips to defeating it. In Corruption, all you get is the weak spot.

Toozin

2010-02-06 12:15:33 am

Not impossible

just highly unlikely

Quote from Chozoid:

I honestly have mixed feelings on giving Samus VA, though.

Why is everyone so resistant to Samus talking? She hasn't been a silent protagonist like Link or Crono since she narrated the intro to Super Metroid. Is having someone speak out loud all that different from reading text that is representative of what the character is speaking out loud?

And I'll bet dollars to doughnuts the trailer's VA is a placeholder and she'll be voiced by Jennifer Hale in the final build.

Chozoid

2010-02-06 12:56:34 am

I sure hope so.

Also, nvm about my last comment, it turs out that you have to go to the lobook to get the full scan :)
But still, I hope they keep the scanning.

FirePhoenix

2010-02-06 01:49:11 am

I guess the general opinion boils down to "As long as it feels like Metroid, I don't care how much story is added." I know that's how I feel.

TheGreenManalishi

2010-02-06 06:30:12 am

Quote from Toozin:

she'll be voiced by Jennifer Hale in the final build.

Someone make this happen.

Quote from Opium:

I was really measuring the success of the franchise in game sales. Zelda is selling plenty.

But does that mean that the devs are satisfied with what they produced? I get the feeling (mostly from interviews with people like Aonuma and Miyamoto) that a Zelda game is something they try their best to make into a masterpiece, but that TP (which is the lastest Zelda game I care about) had a lot of unfulfilled potential, something I don't think they felt with Ocarina, Majora's or WindWaker

Toozin

2010-02-07 02:28:19 am

Not impossible

just highly unlikely

Quote from TheGreenManalishi:

Quote from Toozin:

she'll be voiced by Jennifer Hale in the final build.

Someone make this happen.

Dude, it already happened. I believe Ms. Hale has been grunting and screaming for Samus for the entire Prime trilogy, but at the very least it was definately her in Corruption.
Also, I believe she was the "Evaccuate immediately" computer voice in Prime 1. Dunno why they needed a high-profile VA just to garble up het voice, but whatever. This is just what I hear.

TheGreenManalishi

2010-02-07 04:38:21 am

I know she did Prime, I want her to do Other M, too.

Chozoid

2010-02-07 08:53:34 am

Holy shit GreenManalishi how the hell do you have different avatars for each post?

TheGreenManalishi

2010-02-07 09:01:51 am

It's a good idea to follow this thread

Idkbutlike2

2010-02-07 03:47:39 pm

If they're gonna include cutscenes in the game, they must be short and include some form of dramatic emphasis, like a huge explosion, a boss pouncing you, or a startling revelation in a dialogue.

UchihaSasuke

2010-02-18 05:54:54 am

my umbrella goes directly to Bankai

Quote from Opium:

Quote from TheGreenManalishi:

Quote from Opium:

Zelda is doing fine, no need to make any changes that major.

Did you play TP? PH? Spirit Tracks? I rest my case.

I was really measuring the success of the franchise in game sales. Zelda is selling plenty.

ST had a decline in sales from PH. i wouldn't say the series is bulletproof like what most think.
the Zelda team should be more careful with how the games are received. PH's not-so-great impressions were one of the factors that caused the decline of ST's sales imo. had it been better received, i bet ST would have sold about the same. there's also the hype factor which was almost nonexistant since i bet very few people wanted a sequel to PH.
TP wasn't that well received overall but they're letting the hype build itself by taking so long to make its sucessor. not even the gap between TWW and TP was that big.