Are these tricks worth anything?

2005-12-24 01:03:43 pm

I've discovered these on my own, but am not sure if someone else has found them (they're not on the site, but may be in a speed-run video; my computer can't download them), or if they're actually useful. Here are three ZM ones:

> 1) When in the suitless Samus mode in ZM, there is a room with three Space Pirates and you going down three seperate Morph-Ball-esque passages (you're in the bottom one). I'm sure most people can't get through this mode with perfect stealth, and this area is often one where the alarms are already lit. However,
due to a glitch, it can be turned off here! Turn around and shoot the Space Pirate chasing you, then continue crawling left. The others will be a bit ahead. Once you reach the exit, DO NOT STAND UP. Only move beyond the end of the passage so that you are crouching. The Space Pirates above will not see you, and
the alarm will shut off. Hurry up after they turn around, though, as if the one following sees you, it's back on. Not as hard as it seems.

2) When getting the Grappling Beam, there is a very long wait in order to allow the statue to rise. You can wall jump up the left wall and all the way to the top to save a good five seconds off of your time.

3) In Kraid, when you are leaving, one Missile tank is in the room withthe "waterfall" of sand. Speed-Boosting through the very top of the two side-pillars can save a second or two.

Any feedback?

Thread title:

I've discovered these on my own, but am not sure if someone else has found them (they're not on the site, but may be in a speed-run video; my computer can't download them), or if they're actually useful. Here are three ZM ones:

> 1) When in the suitless Samus mode in ZM, there is a room with three Space Pirates and you going down three seperate Morph-Ball-esque passages (you're in the bottom one). I'm sure most people can't get through this mode with perfect stealth, and this area is often one where the alarms are already lit. However,
due to a glitch, it can be turned off here! Turn around and shoot the Space Pirate chasing you, then continue crawling left. The others will be a bit ahead. Once you reach the exit, DO NOT STAND UP. Only move beyond the end of the passage so that you are crouching. The Space Pirates above will not see you, and
the alarm will shut off. Hurry up after they turn around, though, as if the one following sees you, it's back on. Not as hard as it seems.

2) When getting the Grappling Beam, there is a very long wait in order to allow the statue to rise. You can wall jump up the left wall and all the way to the top to save a good five seconds off of your time.

3) In Kraid, when you are leaving, one Missile tank is in the room withthe "waterfall" of sand. Speed-Boosting through the very top of the two side-pillars can save a second or two.

Any feedback?

JaggerG

2005-12-24 01:13:05 pm

Shifty Leader

That M2k2 guy

The last one's known (I assume you mean the lavafall where you shine for the escape spark when you don't have the ziplines turned on). For the second one, you can beat the pillar with bomb jumping, and it is used in runs. Wall jumping lets you reach the top of the wall before it's up, but you can already be on the ledge when it's appearing. For the first, it doesn't sound familiar and I don't quite fully get it in my current state, but it kind of sounds a bit interesting. Good luck in improving times and such.

ajbolt89

2005-12-24 01:29:05 pm

lol no way

1: Yeah, you can actually just continually freeze a pirate, and if you time it right the alarms will eventually shut off on their own. That's what's happening here, because when you freeze the pirate behind you and get out of his range, it makes it so the alarm turns off and the above pirates get out of their tunnels not knowing what to do, so they just stand there for a bit.

2: Basically a second to what Jagger said, but an added note that you can actually be out the door if you time the bombjump right, before the platforms appear. Pretty nutso.

3: The current routes don't use this trick to get the missile, and instead get it later, though I will commend you for finding it on your own; I use it often when just running through for fun.

JaggerG

2005-12-24 02:19:16 pm

Shifty Leader

That M2k2 guy

I'm almost certain I'm thinking of the right place, but I have to question it. Maybe I have to see the 100% run to believe it, but I don't see how sparking to the missile and back is slower than anything else you would do later. Sure, it'd most likely save time if you have SA, but how is round-trip sparking slower?

Mr Potter

2005-12-24 02:20:31 pm

Quote from Jaffar7:

2) When getting the Grappling Beam, there is a very long wait in order to allow the statue to rise. You can wall jump up the left wall and all the way to the top to save a good five seconds off of your time.

>_>
<_<

Grappling Beam isn't in ZM.

But back on-topic. 1 sounds interesting, but sounds like it would actually slow down times. 2 can be done, but IBJing is quicker, and 3 is already known.

ajbolt89

2005-12-24 02:23:49 pm

lol no way

Jagger, it's mostly because in the current 100% route you have to come back to the Rio room above that missile tank anyway. In the rio room if you drop into the acid anywhere it puts you in that below room's waterfall. So if you come into the room from the left, drop in, the game brings you over a few screens and then you can just hop over and grab the missile tank. This is the only reason it's faster, because you'll already be in the room this way, whereas when leaving Kraid normally you don't even go into this room but rather just go straight through the Rio room and out.

JaggerG

2005-12-24 02:28:10 pm

Shifty Leader

That M2k2 guy

Okay, sorry, I didn't realize you were EXITING Kraid to the right, not entering. I guess since the only detour there is grabbing the missile, the detour through the entire room twice is more. Good call. I thought it had to do with the rio room, but I guess my post-game round-up route was off. Makes much more sense now.

Glad I asked. Thanks.

Also, how did we not notice the use of the term "grapple beam"? Did our minds just censor it out? I remember reading it, but I didn't think about it at all. Heh....

ajbolt89

2005-12-24 02:37:33 pm

lol no way

Haha, I saw it but saw no reason to critisize, once I knew what it was about.

Jaffar7

2005-12-24 03:00:19 pm

Eh. I think it might have been called the Grapple Beam in beta stages, and not the Power Grip. Or maybe I just zoned out. Whatever.

Now, what I don't understand is why you would re-enter the Rio Room. When I successfully completed my first under-2 hour-100% run, I got every single Kraid item except for the missile tank in the lava. Hm... Perhaps my route isn't as quick?

JaggerG

2005-12-24 03:07:11 pm

Shifty Leader

That M2k2 guy

Correct. One would assume it's best to get every item as soon as possible, but in fact, it's faster to get some items later. You have to go back for that one missile tank, yes, but you also need to go to Norfair. There happens to be a secret passage between the two areas that will take you there. The missile tank you found a spark for is in between the under-lava tank and the shortcut, and it is therefore wise to get that while you're on your way there.

Mr Potter

2005-12-24 03:25:31 pm

An example of this is in Prime 2. You can get the Path of Roots missile expansion the first time you enter the room. However, this requires two underwater 3BJs which are hard and slow. If you simply come back later with Grapple, you'll be able to get it both easier and quicker.

kwinse

2005-12-24 04:21:39 pm

Which is how Retro intended you to get it ;)

rain

2006-01-04 09:18:03 am

For the third one, shine as a ball, save your shine and shoot the missle open, save your shine again grab the missile and shine back over, it lets you do the quick kraid escape.

Dragon Man

2006-01-09 05:24:10 pm

Hmm i never thought of that.

I managed to shinespark acroo the room ABOVE that area. I lost 1.5 E-tanks cus those bugs were all over me when i hit that "unknown" block.

ajbolt89

2006-01-09 06:16:18 pm

lol no way

That's how the room is crossed when you don't activate the zipline, and it's also how Red Scarlet used to cross it in her 1:04 100% hard mzm run, but it's faster now to just spacejump while speedrunning across it.

Zeke

2006-01-10 09:46:56 am

Time bomb set get out fast!

It was faster before, too. We just didn't know. :)