The X-COM Topic

2012-11-09 08:25:17 pm

One shall stand, one shall ball.

I'm on Normal, might try Classic eventually but for now there's just too much to get used to to jump in like that.

2012-11-09 08:57:43 pm

I figured as much. I think I tried it on Classic 3-4 times before I finally bumped it down to Normal. My experiences with Classic and the things I started to pick up on certainly helped make my Normal game go a lot smoother, but I probably would've enjoyed the game better from the beginning by starting there in the first place. Seeing as I've only completed the game twice now over the month the game's been out despite starting a ton of games it was definitely the right call in the end.

You'll run into the old X-COM feeling before long even on Normal once the game gets rolling, so you're not missing anything by doing yourself a favor and avoiding Classic for the time being.

tomatobob

2012-11-10 03:32:03 am

One shall stand, one shall ball.

Fuck Chryssalids, fuck Mutons.

tomatobob

2012-11-10 03:51:29 am

One shall stand, one shall ball.

Got my first Terror Mission over with and also took down my first Cyberdisc! The Disc was on a crash site mission way later and I killed it before it got to attack thanks to high level snipers being hilarious and able to crit anything from across the map at will. A high level Assault with a laser shotgun also helps. I'm gonna be pretty sad when those two eventually eat it, total bad asses.

The craziest thing about this game is how you basically can't afford anything, I've got a Support and a couple rookies carrying Light Plasmas that I captured from stunned aliens and everyone else is trying to scrape together resources for lasers. An X-COM game that doesn't drown you in Alien Alloys is terrifying. I have two people in Skeleton Suits and that's it for armor, my tank broke on its first mission and I can't replace it, I'm trying to expand my base so I can get satellites up to stave off panic, when I finally do get the Uplink in I can't afford a satellite anyway, I'm already down three countries, and a bunch more are freaking the fuck out because there are Chryssies everywhere and Mutons and Oh God we're so fucked; stop getting hit you assholes it's hard to train up rookies when all the experienced guys are in sick bay knock it off!

This game owns.

Got my first Terror Mission over with and also took down my first Cyberdisc! The Disc was on a crash site mission way later and I killed it before it got to attack thanks to high level snipers being hilarious and able to crit anything from across the map at will. A high level Assault with a laser shotgun also helps. I'm gonna be pretty sad when those two eventually eat it, total bad asses.

The craziest thing about this game is how you basically can't afford anything, I've got a Support and a couple rookies carrying Light Plasmas that I captured from stunned aliens and everyone else is trying to scrape together resources for lasers. An X-COM game that doesn't drown you in Alien Alloys is terrifying. I have two people in Skeleton Suits and that's it for armor, my tank broke on its first mission and I can't replace it, I'm trying to expand my base so I can get satellites up to stave off panic, when I finally [i]do[/i] get the Uplink in I can't afford a satellite anyway, I'm already down three countries, and a bunch more are freaking the fuck out because there are Chryssies everywhere and Mutons and Oh God we're so fucked; stop getting hit you assholes it's hard to train up rookies when all the experienced guys are in sick bay knock it off!

This game owns.

Prime Hunter

2012-11-10 10:37:05 am

Haha, that's awesome! Glad to hear you're enjoying it as much as I do from the sound of things. I'm fearing when the end-game units start showing up for you under these conditions. That's going to be fun, right?

But yeah that's the biggest change I've noticed over everything else: I never have enough resources to get everything I want at the same time in those earlier months. The only time I can afford everything is if I get lucky and can get a ton of satellites up early on and can keep them up for the foreseeable future, which has only happened 2-3 times I think. (Basically the two games I've completed and a handful of others that died off later on for one reason or another.) Even then I always seem to be out of Alloys and Weapon Fragments later on when I need them the most, which means I can't make higher end equipment for everybody, which means I can't survive later UFO missions to get more supplies, which means I get so far behind and lose so many guys it's not funny, etc... If you screw up too many times where it counts it becomes incredibly easy to fall behind and never recover with the way things work now. When the original games were more forgiving in terms of how much you could fail and still come back to pull off a win, it's a frightening thing.

But that's one reason I love EU so much. It makes every battle and every choice you make have more weight behind it, meaning you'd better play at your best at all times if you want to survive.

Haha, that's awesome! Glad to hear you're enjoying it as much as I do from the sound of things. I'm fearing when the end-game units start showing up for you under these conditions. [i]That's[/i] going to be fun, right?

But yeah that's the biggest change I've noticed over everything else: I [i]never[/i] have enough resources to get everything I want at the same time in those earlier months. The only time I can afford everything is if I get lucky and can get a ton of satellites up early on and can keep them up for the foreseeable future, which has only happened 2-3 times I think. (Basically the two games I've completed and a handful of others that died off later on for one reason or another.) Even then I always seem to be out of Alloys and Weapon Fragments later on when I need them the most, which means I can't make higher end equipment for everybody, which means I can't survive later UFO missions to get more supplies, which means I get so far behind and lose so many guys it's not funny, etc... If you screw up too many times where it counts it becomes incredibly easy to fall behind and never recover with the way things work now. When the original games were [i]more[/i] forgiving in terms of how much you could fail and still come back to pull off a win, it's a frightening thing.

But that's one reason I love EU so much. It makes every battle and every choice you make have more weight behind it, meaning you'd better play at your best at all times if you want to survive.

tomatobob

2012-11-11 07:44:47 am

One shall stand, one shall ball.

My favorite moment so far has been a request from a country for like four or five Laser Rifles and I went, sure I can just go make some right now! And then I went over to engineering and learned I couldn't build anything.

Oh so that's how it's gonna be, is it XCOM?

Then I ran into Mutons for the first time and wound up with an entire squad, including my two best soldiers, in sickbay.

Yup. That's how it's gonna be, me.

Prime Hunter

2012-11-11 12:44:45 pm

Those requests are the only way you can get rid of your weapons and equipment this time around too. Only the artifacts and corpses sell on the Grey Market, no more making and selling Laser Cannons, for instance. So if you get lucky and one pops up for laser rifles and your squad is completely outfitted with Light Plasma or something it's a win-win. I've seen some incredible returns off of those deals. 3 Heavy Plasmas, which arguably don't come cheap, for 1.3k or more? Absolutely... IF I have enough to go to my best Heavies and have enough materials to make some more.

But yeah, it can catch you off guard the first time when you realize how valuable Engineers and Satellites are over everything else.

Prime Hunter

2012-11-11 06:35:59 pm

Here's a scenario for you that just happened to me a minute ago: 1st terror mission of a new game on Classic.

Team had taken out everything but a pair of Chryssalids that were hunting around the rooftops. Had an Assault rush up there only to stupidly realize I couldn't get them with just her, so I pealed back, shot the closest one with a shotgun, and got a few other people into position for the next turn. Assault goes down to the wounded Chryssalid. Next turn, it's still in visible range of my Heavy on the ground, who fires a rocket up and takes it out, leaving 1 final Chryssalid on the roof. My 2 soldiers up there burst through a door onto the roof to try and take it down, only to leave it with a little HP left. Chryssalid pulls back and zombies a civilian, while a zombied civilian it must have gotten on the previous turn staggers over to my 2nd Assault and takes her out. I somehow get that other soldier down with my 2 other guys on the road and wait for them to come down to our level so we can finish them off once they all become Chryssalids. Not going to send my squad up there when I know they'll just swarm me.

This works for the 1st one, except now we're low on ammo when the 2nd arrives, meaning I have my Heavy use his grenade to try and kill it since he was out of ammo. Guess it was left with a sliver of HP as well since it's still alive and proceeds to take out my Support, the one who ran from the roof in the first place. Cue my Lt Sniper panicking and running away, leaving him exposed and my Heavy without anything to take out the Chryssalid. Chryssalid zombies my Sniper while my zombified Support walks over to take down my Heavy...

Mission failed, Brazil leaves the council (1st of the game), Argentina panics and threatens to leave. I've got 1 soldier left in the barracks when an Abduction hits right after this with about 3 days left in April. Since he can't handle things alone I have to let all 3 sites slide by, meaning the world goes nuts and I lose 3 more nations once the month ends, meaning I've lost 1/2 of what I can already.

All of this because of two Chryssalids... Brick wall

Here's a scenario for you that just happened to me a minute ago: 1st terror mission of a new game on Classic.

Team had taken out everything but a pair of Chryssalids that were hunting around the rooftops. Had an Assault rush up there only to stupidly realize I couldn't get them with just her, so I pealed back, shot the closest one with a shotgun, and got a few other people into position for the next turn. Assault goes down to the wounded Chryssalid. Next turn, it's still in visible range of my Heavy on the ground, who fires a rocket up and takes it out, leaving 1 final Chryssalid on the roof. My 2 soldiers up there burst through a door onto the roof to try and take it down, only to leave it with a little HP left. Chryssalid pulls back and zombies a civilian, while a zombied civilian it must have gotten on the previous turn staggers over to my 2nd Assault and takes her out. I somehow get that other soldier down with my 2 other guys on the road and wait for them to come down to our level so we can finish them off once they all become Chryssalids. Not going to send my squad up there when I know they'll just swarm me.

This works for the 1st one, except now we're low on ammo when the 2nd arrives, meaning I have my Heavy use his grenade to try and kill it since he was out of ammo. Guess it was left with a sliver of HP as well since it's still alive and proceeds to take out my Support, the one who ran from the roof in the first place. Cue my Lt Sniper panicking and running away, leaving him exposed and my Heavy without anything to take out the Chryssalid. Chryssalid zombies my Sniper while my zombified Support walks over to take down my Heavy...

Mission failed, Brazil leaves the council (1st of the game), Argentina panics and threatens to leave. I've got 1 soldier left in the barracks when an Abduction hits right after this with about 3 days left in April. Since he can't handle things alone I have to let all 3 sites slide by, meaning the world goes nuts and I lose 3 more nations once the month ends, meaning I've lost 1/2 of what I can already.

All of this because of two Chryssalids... :brickwall_orig:

tomatobob

2012-11-11 08:21:18 pm

One shall stand, one shall ball.

Yeah they're surprisingly huge assholes in this game given that they were theoretically toned down.

Still good old game enders!

tomatobob

2012-11-12 08:02:57 am

One shall stand, one shall ball.

I caught a landed Abductor today, slowly worked my way in clearing it out, but the mission didn't end and I was hearing enemies behind me and on the roof. I didn't know about the ladders yet so I sent up my one dude in a Skeleton Suit to go check it out and WHAM three Chryssies. During the running the fuck away process I found the ladders so sort of shamefully I reloaded a save I made just before grappling up and sen all but one soldier up there, leaving my bad ass Asslaut with an Alloy Cannon to catch anyone that hopped down inside.

Then it turned out that the Chryssies didn't sit around after the reload and instead took the initiative came down for my Assault, my mad dash to save her ended with three dead aliens and one of the rescue party one hit point away from being a zombie. It felt way more tense than the result though, fuckers are fast.

Also the Alloy Cannon is incredible, that Assault was one shotting everything but the Berserker, which I captured alive on my first try. Cool

I totally wasn't worried that that thing was gonna get her or anything either. Nope. Shhh

I caught a landed Abductor today, slowly worked my way in clearing it out, but the mission didn't end and I was hearing enemies behind me and on the roof. I didn't know about the ladders yet so I sent up my one dude in a Skeleton Suit to go check it out and WHAM three Chryssies. During the running the fuck away process I found the ladders so sort of shamefully I reloaded a save I made just before grappling up and sen all but one soldier up there, leaving my bad ass Asslaut with an Alloy Cannon to catch anyone that hopped down inside.

Then it turned out that the Chryssies didn't sit around after the reload and instead took the initiative came down for my Assault, my mad dash to save her ended with three dead aliens and one of the rescue party one hit point away from being a zombie. It felt way more tense than the result though, fuckers are [i]fast[/i].

Also the Alloy Cannon is incredible, that Assault was one shotting everything but the Berserker, which I captured alive on my first try. :cool:

I totally wasn't worried that that thing was gonna get her or anything either. Nope. :listenup_orig:

Prime Hunter

2012-11-12 10:01:55 am

A live Berserker on your first attempt? Nice! Reminds me of how I did that on my first encounter with a certain psionic entity... The interrogation scene for that thing is completely worth it if you manage to capture one too.

I haven't been to an Abductor since the latest patch. Were you having any problems with the roof of the ship constantly getting in your way any time you switched to a different soldier while inside? They were supposed to have fixed that. (Even if you had an interior shot with your previous soldier, any time you switched to a different one the roof would pop back up and you'd have to manipulate the camera back down to the cutaway shot of the interior again.)

tomatobob

2012-11-12 04:55:35 pm

One shall stand, one shall ball.

The roof got in the way a couple times, but I think it was mostly when on eof my dudes was like "Yo I hear something over there!" since that thing was above us.

Quote from Prime Hunter:

A live Berserker on your first attempt? Nice!

it was the most amazingly lucky thing in the world, I moved my Assault into the UFO and two Mutons down the long hallway in the middle of the ship scatter back into the fog and this big purple motherfucker comes running right at me. he got close enough to trigger my Assault's Close Combat perk for the automatic reaction shot then I hit him with a rocket from one of my Heavies and a Sniper I was training up shot him and he wandered right up to where my Heavy with an Arc Thrower was sitting with hit point left. Then Zap. Didn't even have to break cover. Cool

Sometimes this game makes you feel really damned good.

Prime Hunter

2012-11-12 05:22:24 pm

That bit about the Mutons pulling back to reveal the Berserker seems like something you'd see out of a movie or a cutscene in an action game. The Mutons are both ready to storm down the hallway to get you and then it's like the Berserker went "leave them to me" or something.

Gotta love moments like that. Makes the aliens seem like they're real rather than restricted by the AI.

tomatobob

2012-11-12 08:09:30 pm

One shall stand, one shall ball.

lol jumped Heavy Floaters and a Berserker at the same time in a tiny train station. That was unpleasant.

Also what the fuck Heavy Floaters.

Prime Hunter

Edit history:

Prime Hunter: 2012-11-12 08:42:41 pm

2012-11-12 08:42:01 pm

Not something you'd expect to hear, is it? Floaters are actually menacing and can be a threat if given the chance, especially once Heavy Floaters come about. You're getting pretty far into the game actually if you just had them show up now, at least timewise.

I really do love what they did with the aliens in EU as a whole though with both their aesthetics and mechanics. Only disappointment I have is that proper Snakemen didn't make the cut. I can understand why Reapers, Silacoids, and Celatids aren't in but Snakemen were one of the five main alien types. I've grown to accept the Thin Men and I've developed a love/hate relationship with them at this point because they still give me the most trouble out of anything bar Sectopods and Ethereals, but I miss Snakemen since they were one of my favorites from UFO.

tomatobob

2012-11-13 08:10:03 am

One shall stand, one shall ball.

Now that I think about it Thin Men are sort of like Snakemen, really flexible all vertebrae skeletal structure, sort of reptilian appearance, really easy to kill. I wouldn't mind seeing a proper Snake but I don't especially miss them, myself.

But yeah vanilla Floaters can actually cause problems thanks to their mobility, real good at disrupting Snipers. (Unless you catch them in a sweet overwatch killbox that kills them before they even get moving Cool

) Then Heavy Floaters show up and ruin everything by being way more resilient. Nice addition though, keeps the threat escalating without dropping a whole shitstorm of Mind Control at you like the original did.

Prime Hunter

Edit history:

Prime Hunter: 2012-11-13 12:51:38 pm

2012-11-13 10:11:26 am

Yeah see, that's part of why I do like the Thin Men. They have a lot of personality (especially if you capture one) and can be a huge pain to deal with if you don't take them out fast. I feel as if they are the ones that get the best shots off at me too, so I've seen a lot of good soldiers be taken down by them during my games.

But I was just thinking of something. Have you captured an Outsider yet? If not I'd highly recommend doing so ASAP because the plot mission you get from following that chain of research scales with the game's progress. If you don't do it soon there will be worse things to deal with than Heavy Floaters once you get there.

Edit: Speaking of Floaters, I got incredibly lucky earlier and barely shot down an Abductor at the start of May, the fastest I've ever taken one of these down. 3 packs of Floaters and an Outsider. The Floaters all wanted to have a party with my squad apparently because they all came flying in right off the bat one turn after another it seemed. It felt great having the majority of the ship to myself once it was only the Outsider remaining, so I could leisurely stroll through the interior until I got to the bridge. Normally I tend to get swarmed in those middle rooms by Mutons or something.

Yeah see, that's part of why I do like the Thin Men. They have a lot of personality (especially if you capture one) and can be a huge pain to deal with if you don't take them out fast. I feel as if they are the ones that get the best shots off at me too, so I've seen a lot of good soldiers be taken down by them during my games.

But I was just thinking of something. Have you captured an Outsider yet? If not I'd highly recommend doing so ASAP because the plot mission you get from following that chain of research scales with the game's progress. If you don't do it soon there will be worse things to deal with than Heavy Floaters once you get there.

Edit: Speaking of Floaters, I got incredibly lucky earlier and barely shot down an Abductor at the start of May, the fastest I've ever taken one of these down. 3 packs of Floaters and an Outsider. The Floaters all wanted to have a party with my squad apparently because they all came flying in right off the bat one turn after another it seemed. It felt great having the majority of the ship to myself once it was only the Outsider remaining, so I could leisurely stroll through the interior until I got to the bridge. Normally I tend to get swarmed in those middle rooms by Mutons or something.

tomatobob

2012-11-13 04:48:44 pm

One shall stand, one shall ball.

Quote from Prime Hunter:

If not I'd highly recommend doing so ASAP because the plot mission you get from following that chain of research scales with the game's progress. If you don't do it soon there will be worse things to deal with than Heavy Floaters once you get there.

You mean the Alien base Mission? That's been sitting there on my Geoscape for a couple months now. Shit.

Prime Hunter

Edit history:

Prime Hunter: 2012-11-13 08:07:29 pm

Prime Hunter: 2012-11-13 08:07:20 pm

2012-11-13 08:06:16 pm

Yeah I waited a long time before I went my first time too because of my experiences with base missions from UFO, so I was fully expecting the worst when I went. Pretty sure I ended up facing things as high as Sectopods in there my 1st time because I wanted to be sure I had the best armor and full plasma weaponry just in case. You might get lucky and have the game roll a pack of Sectoids or Floaters in the mix, but most likely you'll see a bunch of Mutons, Berserkers, Heavy Floaters, etc. by this point in time with an occasional Cyberdic or Sectopod or even Chryssalids. Basically, anything you've seen in all of your previous missions is fair game and can potentially show up.

tomatobob

2012-11-13 08:11:32 pm

One shall stand, one shall ball.

Guess I'll have to bring plenty of rockets then. Twisted Evil

tomatobob

2012-11-13 09:48:58 pm

One shall stand, one shall ball.

Doing a landed supply ship and oh what the hell Muton Elites. At least the mission won't be getting worse.

tomatobob

2012-11-13 09:49:42 pm

One shall stand, one shall ball.

tomatobob

2012-11-13 09:51:24 pm

One shall stand, one shall ball.

That wasn't very nice game.

Sectopods don't belong on UFOs. Sad

Prime Hunter

2012-11-13 10:31:22 pm

Wow, both Elites and Sectopods in one Supply Ship? Goodnight, squad! Good news is you've hit the alien cap until you do more story missions. The bad news is that now Elites and Sectopods can show up during the base assault, which is why I was trying to (not so) subtly remind you to do that mission if you were in a good position to do so.

I think I ran into my 1st Sectopod on a Supply Ship too. Not very nice indeed, since the first thing it did to introduce itself was firing its main beam twice to cripple/take out two of my soldiers if I remember correctly.

tomatobob

2012-11-14 01:52:42 am

One shall stand, one shall ball.

Well I hit the Sectopod with some suppression from one of my Supports once I stopped hiding like a baby, so it only almost killed my best Sniper instead of definitely killing him or my best Assault. Firing twice, what an asshole! The Elites did very nearly wipe me though, lotta dudes spending a lot of time in sick bay cause of them.

I actually saw neither in the Base, which I did pretty much immediately after because I was getting worried about that. Got a worst I got was a Heavy Floater/Cyberdisc funtime party near the end, fortunately I followed my own advice and brought some rockets. Also went through a lot of trouble to stun the Commander thinking he was unique only to be surprised by two more popping up in a Large Scout that landed in Russia. This game is very good at scaring me.

Overall so far I've been kind of disappointed with my Heavies, rockets are basically the only thing they hit with and they don't get too many of those. It's nice when you're up against a Sectopod or Cyberdisc and you can use their heat Ammo perk to hit them real hard with a Heavy Plasma but boy do they miss a lot. Suppression is real handy though.

Well I hit the Sectopod with some suppression from one of my Supports once I stopped hiding like a baby, so it only almost killed my best Sniper instead of definitely killing him or my best Assault. Firing twice, what an asshole! The Elites did very nearly wipe me though, lotta dudes spending a lot of time in sick bay cause of them.

I actually saw neither in the Base, which I did pretty much immediately after because I was getting worried about that. Got a worst I got was a Heavy Floater/Cyberdisc funtime party near the end, fortunately I followed my own advice and brought some rockets. Also went through a lot of trouble to stun the Commander thinking he was unique only to be surprised by two more popping up in a Large Scout that landed in Russia. This game is very good at scaring me.

Overall so far I've been kind of disappointed with my Heavies, rockets are basically the only thing they hit with and they don't get too many of those. It's nice when you're up against a Sectopod or Cyberdisc and you can use their heat Ammo perk to hit them real hard with a Heavy Plasma but boy do they miss a lot. Suppression is real handy though.