The "I need help" Topic

2013-11-29 01:24:06 pm

turns out you can't do a 4-tank vmr from the chozo elevator on ntsc. not exactly sure what the fastest route would be then. maybe this:

morph ball, charge, bombs, ibbf, hote/furnace e-tanks, flaahgra, wallcrawl out of sun chamber, wild, nature, main plaza e-tank, vmr via tallon, do everything else the same except pick up the research lab aether e-tank/maybe the one in ruined courtyard.

Rakaydos

2013-11-29 06:28:53 pm

Out of curiosity, does wallcrawling out of Flagera make an early Wild easier? I never figured out the dismount after the IBJ back to sunchamber.

T3

2013-11-29 06:58:50 pm

yeah it's probably easier though much slower. basically you'd get oob in sun chamber, touch the water to get floaty jump, get back in-bounds either by aether jumping or bombing against the wall, then jump down to the rock in sun tower to hit the ghost trigger and jump back up.

kirbymastah

2013-11-29 07:50:03 pm

I recommend doing the IBJ anyways, since it's much, much faster and not too bad. After you IBJ and have enough height and am prepared to unmorph, then hold up-right before your last bomb goes off, then unmorph right after the bomb hits you (while still holding up-right).

Rakaydos

2013-11-29 08:40:35 pm

Can someoe give me a newbie primer on Aetherjumping? (as I try and float my way up a secret world :p)

T3

2013-11-29 09:15:32 pm

every room is surrounded by a box which when you're in, you fall but can also jump. outside that box is the aether and this is where you float but can also stand without falling. the idea behind aether jumping is to stand in the aether (the area where you can stand), move into the box (the area where you can jump) and jump within 3 frames of entering the box. if you don't jump within those 3 frames you'll fall. when you're on the bottom of the box under the room you'll notice that your arm cannon will shake. this means you're in the box. if you keep walking in a direction and your arm cannon stops shaking then you know you've hit aether. also to get an idea of where the box is, the edges of the box will always be parallel to the doors and it usually extends just past the room.

so basically, stand in the aether, move into the box and jump within 3 frames.

Baby Sheegoth

2013-11-30 11:11:44 am

Aether will never extend past the furthest most part of a level. For example, 'geometric' levels like Chozo Ruins will never have aether further than the door you're warping in, except for really obvious situations like some rooms in Main Plaza, etc.

Levels like Tallon, however, may have boundaries in the level that will make the aether have weird proportions compared to the doors. Large overhangs, outcroppings in walls, etc, will all do this.

Is Aether always square?

Glitch15

Edit history:

Glitch15: 2013-11-30 01:07:07 pm

2013-11-30 01:06:43 pm

I'm having a tough time hitting the IBBF jump onto the ledge to get oob. I can jump onto the branch and then to the left but I can't hit the square to get out of bounds. Does anyone have any tips to land this or maybe even a tutorial video?

T3

2013-11-30 01:31:45 pm

Quote from Baby Sheegoth:

Aether will never extend past the furthest most part of a level. For example, 'geometric' levels like Chozo Ruins will never have aether further than the door you're warping in, except for really obvious situations like some rooms in Main Plaza, etc.

Levels like Tallon, however, may have boundaries in the level that will make the aether have weird proportions compared to the doors. Large overhangs, outcroppings in walls, etc, will all do this.

Is Aether always square?

you're mixing up aether with the room's box. aether is everything outside the room's box. the room's box is always rectangular and extends to the farthest part of the room.

Quote from Glitch15:

I'm having a tough time hitting the IBBF jump onto the ledge to get oob. I can jump onto the branch and then to the left but I can't hit the square to get out of bounds. Does anyone have any tips to land this or maybe even a tutorial video?

it's just a ghetto jump. make sure you're holding L the whole time and jump as soon as you touch the incline on the ground. jump earlier than you think.

[quote="Baby Sheegoth"]Aether will never extend past the furthest most part of a level. For example, 'geometric' levels like Chozo Ruins will never have aether further than the door you're warping in, except for really obvious situations like some rooms in Main Plaza, etc.

Levels like Tallon, however, may have boundaries in the level that will make the aether have weird proportions compared to the doors. Large overhangs, outcroppings in walls, etc, will all do this.

Is Aether always square?[/quote]
you're mixing up aether with the room's box. aether is everything outside the room's box. the room's box is always rectangular and extends to the farthest part of the room.

[quote="Glitch15"]I'm having a tough time hitting the IBBF jump onto the ledge to get oob.  I can jump onto the branch and then to the left but I can't hit the square to get out of bounds.  Does anyone have any tips to land this or maybe even a tutorial video?[/quote]
it's just a ghetto jump. make sure you're holding L the whole time and jump as soon as you touch the incline on the ground. jump earlier than you think.

Glitch15

Edit history:

Glitch15: 2013-11-30 01:51:52 pm

2013-11-30 01:43:54 pm

Ah, I've been just tapping L as if it were an L Jump. Thanks for explaining.

Rakaydos

2013-11-30 08:54:38 pm

I've been having the same problem, even with the ghetto when I can get it to work. I can get high enough to see the edge of the water through the hole, but I never pass through the wall.

Glitch15

2013-12-01 02:35:37 pm

You are talking about the IBBF ghetto to out of bounds right? Because using the tips T3 gave me I can get out nearly every try. Pretty much do what he said, but to expand on it a little bit, move backwards right after you jump first so then you can give yourself room to make it to the ledge with the space jump.

Or you could be talking about something else and I'm just rambling.

Rakaydos

2013-12-01 04:47:05 pm

I've been getting the ghetto and just pressing against the wall as I go up. You're saying I need to back off after the ghetto but before the space jump?

Rakaydos

Edit history:

Rakaydos: 2013-12-02 01:35:53 am

Rakaydos: 2013-12-02 01:26:19 am

2013-12-02 01:18:54 am

I'm getting OOB, but I'm still trying to figure out the mechanics of switching rooms.

As I get near my target door, it feels like the gravity and geometry is alredy half-there, and it's confusing me.

(I'm sill at the "15 min trying to get out of bounds, fall to bottom of level on accident in a minute and a half" level)
EDIt: I've gotten visible geometry to load after shooting the door and getting close to it, but it vanishes when I trymoving out to it.

Daryoshi

2013-12-02 06:30:43 am

loving low%

Oh, I also had serious trouble at the beginning w/ Secret Worlds/ Wallcrawling, but I found this site which helped me a lot:
http://web.archive.org/web/20041028142001/http://www.samus.co.uk/mprime/wallcrawling/

Quote:

As I get near my target door, it feels like the gravity and geometry is alredy half-there, and it's confusing me.

This is because the room is in a so called state of having been "secretized" (don't know what that means but it's the term used for rooms that are still invisible but "here" dough).
Before you can continue wallcrawling, you first have got to actually load the room. There are several ways to do this (you can even load rooms that would require you to have for example Ice Beam, but while out of bounds, you can skip Ice Beam (for example in the faster route of Ice Beam before Flaahgra [IBBF]).

I'd suggest reading through all the beginners techniques before attempting to get IBBF, because it's not to easy at first and few can do it very reliably in SS runs, so yeah, it's atricky wallcrawl and you can easily mess it all up and/ or fall quite below the doors, at the height of so called "level".

Oh, I also had serious trouble at the beginning w/ Secret Worlds/ Wallcrawling, but I found this site which helped me a lot:
http://web.archive.org/web/20041028142001/http://www.samus.co.uk/mprime/wallcrawling/

[quote]As I get near my target door, it feels like the gravity and geometry is alredy half-there, and it's confusing me.[/quote]
This is because the room is in a so called state of having been "secretized" (don't know what that means but it's the term used for rooms that are still invisible but "here" dough).
Before you can continue wallcrawling, you first have got to actually load the room. There are several ways to do this (you can even load rooms that would require you to have for example Ice Beam, but while out of bounds, you can skip Ice Beam (for example in the faster route of Ice Beam before Flaahgra [IBBF]).

I'd suggest reading through all the beginners techniques before attempting to get IBBF, because it's not to easy at first and few can do it very reliably in SS runs, so yeah, it's atricky wallcrawl and you can easily mess it all up and/ or fall quite below the doors, at the height of so called "level".

Rakaydos

2013-12-05 01:13:35 am

Quote from T3:

morph ball, charge, bombs, ibbf, hote/furnace e-tanks, flaahgra, wallcrawl out of sun chamber, wild, nature, main plaza e-tank, vmr via tallon, do everything else the same except pick up the research lab aether e-tank/maybe the one in ruined courtyard.

Bumping this because I still think it could be interesting.

So does 5/7 energy tanks feel like enough for stuff like Plasma beam and all the magmore artifacts, on the current routes? I would expect there to be a lot more "Dashes" involved, possibly grabbing stuff in a less efficent order since the efficent order would involve staying in the heat too long.

Daryoshi

Edit history:

Daryoshi: 2013-12-05 06:39:37 am

2013-12-05 06:38:38 am

loving low%

There're a bunch of rooms that aren't even heated. IIRC, the one where STRENGTH is (Warrior Shrine) and Geothermal ~~Whore~~ Core (the big room you gotta climb for Plasma Beam) and all rooms southern of a certain room aren't heated. The room where NATURE is, is heated, and even gives you about twice amount of damage/sec (about 20 instead of 10) plus the room where Ice Spreader is is also heated and you gotta stay there for "a long time" in order to get it, so yeah, you're probably right.

Quote:

So does 5/7 energy tanks

Do you mean 5 or 7? I'm quite sure that 5 (five) are NOT enough to clear the game the "normal way", T3 proposed, and taking up to 9 (nine) Tanks or so would probably still be faster than making some MAJOR routing changes, but I can't say anything for sure.
Gotta test it out yourself, I think. Few are common w/ Magmoor w/out Varia Suit and most of them haven't ever done a speedrun w/ skipping Varia Suit, therefore, the routing has been tested veeery slightly in comparison to other categories..

There're a bunch of rooms that aren't even heated. IIRC, the one where STRENGTH is (Warrior Shrine) and Geothermal [s]Whore[/s] Core (the big room you gotta climb for Plasma Beam) and all rooms southern of a certain room aren't heated. The room where NATURE is, is heated, and even gives you about twice amount of damage/sec (about 20 instead of 10) plus the room where Ice Spreader is is also heated and you gotta stay there for "a long time" in order to get it, so yeah, you're probably right.
[quote]So does 5/7 energy tanks[/quote] Do you mean 5 or 7? I'm quite sure that 5 (five) are NOT enough to clear the game the "normal way", T3 proposed, and taking up to 9 (nine) Tanks or so would probably still be faster than making some MAJOR routing changes, but I can't say anything for sure.
Gotta test it out yourself, I think. Few are common w/ Magmoor w/out Varia Suit and most of them haven't ever done a speedrun w/ skipping Varia Suit, therefore, the routing has been tested veeery slightly in comparison to other categories..

Baby Sheegoth

2013-12-05 04:43:20 pm

Strength is heated

Rakaydos

2013-12-05 10:02:54 pm

HOTE/Furnace early etanks, Main plaaza Etank, Research lab Aether, Ruined Courtyard, whatever that phenedra access in magmore is called, is 6 energy tanks.

But since I cant even wall crawl yet (certiantly cant manage the 3 tank rush) I have to beg for others to test for me.

Skull64

2013-12-11 01:58:10 pm

Where are the best places to try to get power bombs in a 100% run? I'm using zoid's 1:24 route and I figure I need 6 PBs in the 2nd pass through the mines:

1. Security Access A (for missile expansion)
2. Mine Security Station (for Flamethrower)
3. Elite Research (for Artifact of Warrior)
4. Central Dynamo (to unblock the door)
5. Metroid Quarantine A (for the ghetto to get the missile expansion)
6. Phazon Mining Tunnel (to unblock the room)

I was 2 minutes ahead of my PB in my last run entering the mines and then I ended up losing a total of 8 minutes between then and saving at the ship due to a combination of PB-hunting and really bad mistakes.

ptorflaxendrosis

2013-12-11 03:13:32 pm

Well, you get a guaranteed two from the boxes in Central Dynamo, if that helps.

MilesSMB

2013-12-11 03:18:02 pm

Shoot some scarabs in Chozo Ruins on the way to Ruined Fountain. It's a ton of drops with a 50% PB drop rate.

Skull64

2013-12-11 09:54:25 pm

Quote from ptorflaxendrosis:

Well, you get a guaranteed two from the boxes in Central Dynamo, if that helps.

Quote from MilesSMB:

Shoot some scarabs in Chozo Ruins on the way to Ruined Fountain. It's a ton of drops with a 50% PB drop rate.

Awesome. Thank you. Between those I should have plenty.

Glitch15

2013-12-15 04:04:44 am

How should I go about performing Early Wild? I can sometimes get the ball to fall slowly, but not consistently. How exactly should I be holding the control stick? Probably just directly left, I would assume...

MarreDeLaPrepa

Edit history:

MarreDeLaPrepa: 2013-12-15 09:55:39 am

2013-12-15 09:52:21 am

hold the stick up-left.
getting early wild through infinite bomb jump is just a question of timing. No matter how faster or slower you may fall if you hold the stick up-left, with the right bomb timing you'll always succeed your infinite bomb jump, although it's not going to be optimised.

If you don't want to learn infinite bomb jump yet so you don't kill most of your runs, I recommend using floaty jump, just after beating Flaahgra.