Speed tricks topic

2006-06-23 05:39:41 pm

I'am thinking of doing a run but I don't have a dvd recorder for the moment. I'am not sure if am gonna do a low % or an any% run, what would be more interesting?

silent (((((echo)))))

2006-06-24 04:18:59 am

The torvus temple access------->great bridge------->abandoned worksite-------> forgotten bridge route is slower than the torvus grove access-------->torvus grove--------->polluted mire------->dark falls save station route. The early boost ball trick involves a floating which makes it longer.

Quote:

I'am thinking of doing a run but I don't have a dvd recorder for the moment. I'am not sure if am gonna do a low % or an any% run, what would be more interesting?

I would be very interested in seeing an improved any% run! :P

bartendorsparky

2006-06-24 09:09:42 am

always move fast

you can get over the gate for early boost ball without floating at all via bsj...

tuomii

2006-06-24 01:32:13 pm

Quote from bartendorsparky:

you can get over the gate for early boost ball without floating at all via bsj...

hmm a single bsj won't make it but a dubble bsj can make it. it's just that it is impossible do preform it cuse you will fall off the ledge when your about to lay the second bomb. :(

doninss

2006-06-24 05:25:28 pm

I hadn't thought of it before, but the special bsj the SJ skippers use to multi-bsj off the black pea-pods (also used in the ibsj concept) might work in Forgotten Bridge.

DJGrenola

2006-06-24 06:29:38 pm

how about a bsj based on bombs one and two of a prime ubj or hbj ?

bartendorsparky

2006-06-24 10:56:59 pm

always move fast

no tuomii it isn't impossible because i've done it countless times. jump onto the little ledge, look out toward the room, 2/3 bsj and jump over.

silent (((((echo)))))

2006-06-25 04:07:48 am

Quote from bartendorsparky:

no tuomii it isn't impossible because i've done it countless times. jump onto the little ledge, look out toward the room, 2/3 bsj and jump over.

Cool, I didn't know that. I should try it ASAP.
I still don't think that the great bridge and forgotten bridge route is faster. Polluted mire with the bsj is really quick. And after doing the 2bsj over the gate, you would have to return to dark falls to save your game. Costing a bit time. I think that the rooms leading to dark forgotten bridge load slower than the torvus grove route. I'm not sure though.

tuomii

2006-06-25 05:31:09 am

okey could anyone time the difference of the two routes, mybe someone that has an AR just to get over the gate easier.

It would be great to know so that I can start practice this Wink

and thanks sparky I will try this 8-)

bartendorsparky

2006-06-25 07:56:59 am

always move fast

silent echo, with two energy tanks (possibly 1, im not sure), i think you could beat boost and make it up to before chykka. i tried it at some point for a bit and made it up to just after getting the key just before the save station (with two tanks). im not sure its faster, but it shouldnt be ruled out...

silent (((((echo)))))

2006-06-25 09:55:23 am

Quote from bartendorsparky:

silent echo, with two energy tanks (possibly 1, im not sure), i think you could beat boost and make it up to before chykka. i tried it at some point for a bit and made it up to just after getting the key just before the save station (with two tanks). im not sure its faster, but it shouldnt be ruled out...

I think that it would save time. Though, it would really be difficult to survive after the boost guardian imo.

tuomii

2006-06-28 04:32:00 pm

S_E I think you are right about the the route I was takling about, it is a bit slower but I'am not really sure tough.

we all know that we only need to bomb the last conduct in portal terminal so i tried to take a faster way to get there, and I got to the last conduct from behind, but you can't bomb the damn thing Evil or Very Mad

is this known?

The platform you land on when you use the speedtrick, could it be possible to reach it with a tripple bsj?

silent (((((echo)))))

2006-06-28 05:51:31 pm

Quote:

we all know that we only need to bomb the last conduct in portal terminal so i tried to take a faster way to get there, and I got to the last conduct from behind, but you can't bomb the damn thing Evil or Very Mad is this known?

Yes it is known, the guy who discovered the portal terminal speed trick noticed it, I think that it was true_diehard_master.

Quote:

The platform you land on when you use the speedtrick, could it be possible to reach it with a tripple bsj?

I tried to reach the platform you're talking about with a 3bsj a while ago. i got very close but I've never been able to do it. Though, I think that it would be useless. In fact, nothing happen if you destroy the last conduct before killing all the pirates and activating the bombslot. Even, if we could reach the platform with a 3bsj, it wouldn't save time. The time to get close to the platform and performing a 3bsj is as long as getting to the platform the normal way, with the morph ball elevator unfortunately. :|

[quote]we all know that we only need to bomb the last conduct in portal terminal so i tried to take a faster way to get there, and I got to the last conduct from behind, but you can't bomb the damn thing Evil or Very Mad is this known? [/quote]

Yes it is known, the guy who discovered the portal terminal speed trick noticed it, I think that it was true_diehard_master.

[quote]The platform you land on when you use the speedtrick, could it be possible to reach it with a tripple bsj?[/quote]

I tried to reach the platform you're talking about with a 3bsj a while ago. i got very close but I've never been able to do it. Though, I think that it would be useless. In fact, nothing happen if you destroy the last conduct before killing all the pirates and activating the bombslot. Even, if we could reach the platform with a 3bsj, it wouldn't save time. The time to get close to the platform and performing a 3bsj is as long as getting to the platform the normal way, with the morph ball elevator unfortunately.  :|

Frozen Mr. Toastbrot

2006-07-13 05:34:33 pm

Quote from silent (((((echo))))):

Here is a 100% speed trick in sanctuary entrance. After destroying the background with the turret, you can reach the kinectic orb cannon ledge for the power bomb expansion much faster with a well-placed screw-attack cancel.

It saves 10 secs.

Here is the vid : http://zeromission.co.uk/silent_echo/sanctuary_entrance_pb_speedtrick.avi

The previous and slower method was this one : http://zeromission.co.uk/silent_echo/sanctuary_entrance_pb_oldmethod.avi

I know I'm late, but I just feel the need to respond here, since this is one of the few things I'm still proud of :P.
Back then when I first made it to the powerbomb expansion I actually jumped from the turret to the red ledge, but I couldn't figure out a reliable way of landing there, so it resulted in a lot of unnecessary deaths (also for kip, who tried to record it back then). It almost made me crazy, so I just had to find another way to make getting the early PB much easier, which is why the longer way was born. So, congratulations on making it possible to get the early PB the way I first did it, without all those unnecessary deaths :P

P.S.: You should be able to find all that early PB stuff somewhere on pages 15 to 17 here, in case you're interested.

[quote="silent (((((echo)))))"]Here is a 100% speed trick in sanctuary entrance. After destroying the background with the turret, you can reach the kinectic orb cannon ledge for the power bomb expansion much faster with a well-placed screw-attack cancel.

It saves 10 secs.

Here is the vid : http://zeromission.co.uk/silent_echo/sanctuary_entrance_pb_speedtrick.avi

The previous and slower method was this one : http://zeromission.co.uk/silent_echo/sanctuary_entrance_pb_oldmethod.avi[/quote]

I know I'm late, but I just feel the need to respond here, since this is one of the few things I'm still proud of :P.
Back then when I first made it to the powerbomb expansion I actually jumped from the turret to the red ledge, but I couldn't figure out a reliable way of landing there, so it resulted in a lot of unnecessary deaths (also for kip, who tried to record it back then). It almost made me crazy, so I just had to find another way to make getting the early PB much easier, which is why the longer way was born. So, congratulations on making it possible to get the early PB the way I first did it, without all those unnecessary deaths :P

P.S.: You should be able to find all that early PB stuff somewhere on pages 15 to 17 here, in case you're interested.

DJGrenola

2006-07-13 05:39:20 pm

in watering hole you can bend a dash forwards off the nullified light crystal to reach the missile door in a single jump.

this will be in my 17%.

tuomii

2006-07-14 06:40:30 am

undertemple shaft: this may not be a speedtrick but it is a alternate method to reach the platform. insted of doing the dash jump you can jump on to the Luminoths head, from here walk as far left as you can then jump to the door. it's a little bit tricky but it shoulden't be to hard Wink

is this known?

bartendorsparky

2006-07-14 03:56:32 pm

always move fast

there's a video of getting over the dfb wall with a bsj without float. sorry for the long delay..

rekameohs

2006-07-14 03:58:12 pm

Anywhere, everywhere

Do you think that it's faster than the current route?

And welcome back! grin new

DJGrenola

2006-07-14 07:19:01 pm

Quote from tuomii:

undertemple shaft: this may not be a speedtrick but it is a alternate method to reach the platform. insted of doing the dash jump you can jump on to the Luminoths head, from here walk as far left as you can then jump to the door. it's a little bit tricky but it shoulden't be to hard Wink

is this known?

http://www.metroid2002.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=43771#43771

edit: in Battleground, where you fight the Ing for the Agon dark temple key, it's a lot faster if you take the time to shoot the light beacons with the light beam. Usually two or three of the Ing will commit suicide in the supercharged beacons. This should be a particularly effective strategy on hard mode. It's possible to complete the fight in normal mode in ~30 seconds this way, and if you've only got 50 beam ammo you also save a lot of time shooting pea pods for light beam refills.

one other little thing - after collecting light beam, you can rolljump from the platform to the light door.

silent (((((echo)))))

2006-07-20 11:24:22 am

I'm back.

Quote from Frozen Mr. Toastbrot:

Quote from silent (((((echo))))):

Here is a 100% speed trick in sanctuary entrance. After destroying the background with the turret, you can reach the kinectic orb cannon ledge for the power bomb expansion much faster with a well-placed screw-attack cancel.

It saves 10 secs.

Here is the vid : http://zeromission.co.uk/silent_echo/sanctuary_entrance_pb_speedtrick.avi

The previous and slower method was this one : http://zeromission.co.uk/silent_echo/sanctuary_entrance_pb_oldmethod.avi

I know I'm late, but I just feel the need to respond here, since this is one of the few things I'm still proud of :P.
Back then when I first made it to the powerbomb expansion I actually jumped from the turret to the red ledge, but I couldn't figure out a reliable way of landing there, so it resulted in a lot of unnecessary deaths (also for kip, who tried to record it back then). It almost made me crazy, so I just had to find another way to make getting the early PB much easier, which is why the longer way was born. So, congratulations on making it possible to get the early PB the way I first did it, without all those unnecessary deaths :P

P.S.: You should be able to find all that early PB stuff somewhere on pages 15 to 17 here, in case you're interested.

Thanks, I'm glad that this trick is useful. :P

Quote:

in watering hole you can bend a dash forwards off the nullified light crystal to reach the missile door in a single jump.

It's also possible to get across that gap with a roll jump.

I'm back.

[quote="Frozen Mr. Toastbrot"][quote="silent (((((echo)))))"]Here is a 100% speed trick in sanctuary entrance. After destroying the background with the turret, you can reach the kinectic orb cannon ledge for the power bomb expansion much faster with a well-placed screw-attack cancel.

It saves 10 secs.

Here is the vid : http://zeromission.co.uk/silent_echo/sanctuary_entrance_pb_speedtrick.avi

The previous and slower method was this one : http://zeromission.co.uk/silent_echo/sanctuary_entrance_pb_oldmethod.avi[/quote]

I know I'm late, but I just feel the need to respond here, since this is one of the few things I'm still proud of :P.
Back then when I first made it to the powerbomb expansion I actually jumped from the turret to the red ledge, but I couldn't figure out a reliable way of landing there, so it resulted in a lot of unnecessary deaths (also for kip, who tried to record it back then). It almost made me crazy, so I just had to find another way to make getting the early PB much easier, which is why the longer way was born. So, congratulations on making it possible to get the early PB the way I first did it, without all those unnecessary deaths :P

P.S.: You should be able to find all that early PB stuff somewhere on pages 15 to 17 here, in case you're interested.[/quote]

Thanks, I'm glad that this trick is useful. :P

[quote]in watering hole you can bend a dash forwards off the nullified light crystal to reach the missile door in a single jump. [/quote]

It's also possible to get across that gap with a roll jump.

XtraX

2006-07-20 01:35:58 pm

...
It might be possible to raise at least two of the spinners in Vault
aiwebs_016

I haven't raised any of them yet, but at least two seem possible.
Go to the spinner on the left or the right side in the room and make a Rezbit fly towards you (I think you just have to enter the boost ball generator or do nothing at all, I don't know). Sadly, the Rezbits won't follow you to the other two Spinners; it seems they'll only fly towards Grand Abyss.
Anyway, just wait until the Rezbit comes to you. It likes you. So it will fly into Samus (which is morphed in the boost ball generator) and use it's shield. While it does that, it pushs you really hard. It is possible to roll in this situation. I am not sure if you have to press any button before (I randomly pressed X,R,L, bombed out of the slot,...), but it is definitialey possible to manipulate the spinners. I haven't been able to fully manipulate one (as it seems luck-based on how much you'll raise it while the Rezbit uses his shiled), but I did come pretty far. I've tried it with two Rezbits, but I was always pusehed out of the spinner (that can happen, too.) It is theoretically possible to raise them though.

As for the other Spinners, you can get Rezbits close to them (they use some sort of sidehop sometimes). They won't push you though, and I've only been able to raise the Spinners for like one second while the Rezbits uses his shiled. Maybe you can manipulate them to push you though?

Somebody please play around with this, Vault w/o Boost would be a huge Sequence break!

...
It might be possible to raise at least two of the spinners in Vault 
[aiwebs_016]
I haven't raised any of them yet, but at least two seem possible.
Go to the spinner on the left or the right side in the room and make a Rezbit fly towards you (I think you just have to enter the boost ball generator or do nothing at all, I don't know). Sadly, the Rezbits won't follow you to the other two Spinners; it seems they'll only fly towards Grand Abyss.
Anyway, just wait until the Rezbit comes to you. It likes you. So it will fly into Samus (which is morphed in the boost ball generator) and use it's shield. While it does that, it pushs you really hard. It is possible to roll in this situation. I am not sure if you have to press any button before (I randomly pressed X,R,L, bombed out of the slot,...), but it is definitialey possible to manipulate the spinners. I haven't been able to fully manipulate one (as it seems luck-based on how much you'll raise it while the Rezbit uses his shiled), but I did come pretty far. I've tried it with two Rezbits, but I was always pusehed out of the spinner (that can happen, too.) It is theoretically possible to raise them though.

As for the other Spinners, you can get Rezbits close to them (they use some sort of sidehop sometimes). They won't push you though, and I've only been able to raise the Spinners for like one second while the Rezbits uses his shiled. Maybe you can manipulate them to push you though?

Somebody please play around with this, Vault w/o Boost would be a huge Sequence break!

XtraX

2006-07-26 11:17:42 am

Double posting invalid after how many days ? <_<;

In part 18 in silent echo's 1:43 run, he goes from Sanctuary to Temple grounds to get that one sky key there. I believe it might be a bit faster to go to Agon and warp to Great Temple -> Temple grounds though.

More important, I had this idea since writing the last post, but didn't try it until some minutes before: Freezing Rezbits using a charged Dark beam shot makes him have his shield for some more seconds. I believe this could make Vault w/o Boost possible, though I Haven't tried to raise the spinners using this yet.

I've heard there is an IS spot in Vault. True?/Where?

arkarian

2006-07-26 11:22:03 am

red chamber dream

Quote from XtraX:

Double posting invalid after how many days ?

A month. But if you're adding good information or have something important to say (which you are/do), you're fine.

Master ZED

2006-07-26 11:43:11 am

Quote from XtraX:

More important, I had this idea since writing the last post, but didn't try it until some minutes before: Freezing Rezbits using a charged Dark beam shot makes him have his shield for some more seconds.

No it doesn't. The game can't retract the visible object unless the Rezbit unfreezes, but the shield's actual duration remains unchanged. You really shouldn't put so much faith in your eyes. :\

Quote from XtraX:

I've heard there is an IS spot in Vault. True?/Where?

False. IS in Vault is done via the use of secret worlds to enter the room while EL'ed.

DJGrenola

2006-07-26 06:52:15 pm

I've been struggling and struggling to get over the dark forgotten bridge fence without floating like sparky did in his example vid. I managed to succeed twice in practice and then once in an actual run segment, but sadly I couldn't keep that segment because I didn't get the half pipe after boost guardian cleanly. Since then I've tried and tried but failed miserably to do it.

I'd all but resigned myself to giving up and floating over the fence when I came up with a way to add about half a morph ball's worth of height to a single BSJ (using a 2BSJ is very hard because you will fall off the fence 99% of the time when you land after the first bomb). The idea is to place two bombs right on top of each other very quickly rather than just a single bomb. The only way I've found to lay them quickly enough is to hit A with first the middle finger of the right hand and then with the index finger of the right hand immediately afterwards using a drumming motion (Chanoire informs me that this is a piano technique but I learned it playing Street Fighter II in the arcades, go wasted youth). Anyway if you can get two bombs on top of each other and get them both to hit you, the BSJ is still possible and I've managed to get over the fence twice in half a dozen attempts with this technique, and without floating.

Hope this helps someone.

I've been struggling and struggling to get over the dark forgotten bridge fence without floating like sparky did in his example vid. I managed to succeed twice in practice and then once in an actual run segment, but sadly I couldn't keep that segment because I didn't get the half pipe after boost guardian cleanly. Since then I've tried and tried but failed miserably to do it.

I'd all but resigned myself to giving up and floating over the fence when I came up with a way to add about half a morph ball's worth of height to a single BSJ (using a 2BSJ is very hard because you will fall off the fence 99% of the time when you land after the first bomb). The idea is to place two bombs right on top of each other very quickly rather than just a single bomb. The only way I've found to lay them quickly enough is to hit A with first the middle finger of the right hand and then with the index finger of the right hand immediately afterwards using a drumming motion (Chanoire informs me that this is a piano technique but I learned it playing Street Fighter II in the arcades, go wasted youth). Anyway if you can get two bombs on top of each other and get them both to hit you, the BSJ is still possible and I've managed to get over the fence twice in half a dozen attempts with this technique, and without floating.

Hope this helps someone.