[SM] Super Metroid: Gravy

2009-06-22 12:28:54 pm

Embarrasing Fact: Power suit made by lowest bidder

There's a number of methods and each method has a range it can work in. I don't know the ranges off the top of my head though, I'd have to test them.

Derakon

2009-06-23 12:16:46 am

Argh, I was just replaying this, and realizing the number of really, really bitchy segments you added. For example:

* Any time you use respawning super missile blocks. Typically these are incorporated into tricky jumping or mockball segments (e.g. pre-Springball, or the upper half of the WS lake). There's no good reason to make these blocks come back; they just make you waste ammo (or more likely, rely unnecessarily heavily on savestates).

* The Springball area. It's entirely possible to get stuck here because you don't have the ammo to do a Crystal Flash. Even if you added respawning critters here to fix that, when I first visited the room I only had a max of 10 powerbombs. This is, of course, leaving aside the fact that requiring a Crystal Flash to solve a puzzle is insane. This would be somewhat OK if a) you had to do the flash to get in instead of (or in addition to) getting out, and b) if the Springball weren't required to get into Ridley's Lair.

* Speaking of which, the invisible crumble blocks in the Ridley's Lair entrance are just asinine. If you're going to block off a passage, it should be visibly blocked. Dicking the player around by making them dive into an acid pool only for that to be a dead end is unkind, to say the least.

* The Maridia loop. In order to get back to the Maridia "entrance" at the noob tube, you have to traverse a huge one-way loop because of the shinespark blocks. As far as I can tell, the only reason you did this was so you could have a long horizontal shinespark be the entrance to Maridia; while cool, this can be achieved without blocking passage back in the other direction.

* Use of hidden grapple crumble blocks to find required items. Why did you do this?

* Making wallcrawler enemies immune to powered-up beam attacks. Yeah, I know, you can use the grapple beam to one-shot them. But you shouldn't have to. Powerups should never make you weaker.

* The fast lava-rise room up and to the right of the Ridley's Lair entrance. Overall this room is fine, but the crumble blocks in it should be visibly crumble blocks from the get-go. Invisible crumble blocks are for subtle puzzles that the player has the leisure to retake over and over again, not for ones where they're racing barely ahead of massive pain by way of lava. As it stands, they basically just make you retry the puzzle at least once through no fault of your own, since you couldn't legitimately expect them to be there.

In general, I appreciate a hard hack, but this is hard in ways that aren't fun. And I'm saying this as someone who's actually beaten it before.

Argh, I was just replaying this, and realizing the number of really, really bitchy segments you added. For example:

[spoiler] * Any time you use respawning super missile blocks. Typically these are incorporated into tricky jumping or mockball segments (e.g. pre-Springball, or the upper half of the WS lake). There's no good reason to make these blocks come back; they just make you waste ammo (or more likely, rely unnecessarily heavily on savestates).

* The Springball area. It's entirely possible to get stuck here because you don't have the ammo to do a Crystal Flash. Even if you added respawning critters here to fix that, when I first visited the room I only had a max of 10 powerbombs. This is, of course, leaving aside the fact that requiring a Crystal Flash to solve a puzzle is insane. This would be somewhat OK if a) you had to do the flash to get [i]in[/i] instead of (or in addition to) getting out, and b) if the Springball weren't required to get into Ridley's Lair.

* Speaking of which, the invisible crumble blocks in the Ridley's Lair entrance are just asinine. If you're going to block off a passage, it should be visibly blocked. Dicking the player around by making them dive into an acid pool only for that to be a dead end is unkind, to say the least.

* The Maridia loop. In order to get back to the Maridia "entrance" at the noob tube, you have to traverse a [i]huge[/i] one-way loop because of the shinespark blocks. As far as I can tell, the only reason you did this was so you could have a long horizontal shinespark be the entrance to Maridia; while cool, this can be achieved without blocking passage back in the other direction.

* Use of hidden grapple crumble blocks to find required items. Why did you do this?

* Making wallcrawler enemies immune to powered-up beam attacks. Yeah, I know, you can use the grapple beam to one-shot them. But you shouldn't have to. Powerups should never make you [i]weaker[/i].

* The fast lava-rise room up and to the right of the Ridley's Lair entrance. Overall this room is fine, but the crumble blocks in it should be visibly crumble blocks from the get-go. Invisible crumble blocks are for subtle puzzles that the player has the leisure to retake over and over again, not for ones where they're racing barely ahead of massive pain by way of lava. As it stands, they basically just make you retry the puzzle at least once through no fault of your own, since you couldn't legitimately expect them to be there. 
[/spoiler]
In general, I appreciate a hard hack, but this is hard in ways that aren't fun. And I'm saying this as someone who's actually beaten it before.

Kenzya

2009-06-23 05:18:57 am

I tried really hard to finish this hack...

...It's my only savestate too

FFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU

Cardweaver

2009-06-23 12:39:20 pm

IIRC, powerbomb there, then use super missiles, then grapple those blocks. It's a triple barrier.

Kenzya

Edit history:

Kenzya: 2009-06-23 02:22:03 pm

2009-06-23 01:58:06 pm

No, I'm stuck in the door :(

I can't move at all. The only direction I can shoot is down. The door won't open and I can't use the morphball. I tried using action replay codes to give me all the beams in case one of them hit the door but it appears as the door is stuck as well. Tragedy struck me that day...

Edit: Walk Through Walls: 90936E07 Finally, I can keep playing :)

Quietus

2009-06-23 02:37:30 pm

Super Secret Area - Dead Ahead!

I know you'vedone it now, but did you try the charge + other beam combos? They may have solved the problem. (Unless you don't have it, of course)

Kenzya

2009-06-23 02:56:18 pm

All I had, legit anyway, was the spazer and charge. Anything after that would be cheating either way.

Quietus

2009-06-23 03:24:58 pm

Super Secret Area - Dead Ahead!

No, I meant selecting Power Bombs, charging a shot, and letting the special open the door.

Zeke

2009-06-26 06:13:30 pm

Time bomb set get out fast!

I hate to ask, but I'm stuck after beating Draygon. I remember how I got down through the room before him, but I can't get seem to get back up that way. Can someone spoiler-tag a hint?

Derakon

2009-06-26 08:08:48 pm

You need to midair morph into the tunnel on the right under the spikes. Problem is, if you touch the spikes, then you'll get knocked away from the tunnel. It's a tricky jump, but it's doable. Alternately, you might be able to get in via IBJing.

Zeke

2009-06-28 07:42:01 pm

Time bomb set get out fast!

Ah. So in fact you do get out the same way you get in; guess I was premature in judging it to be impossible. Thanks.

Anybody know how many

bombs

it takes to kill Botwoon? I can find his HP in SMILE, but not how much damage he takes.

Derakon

2009-06-28 11:31:56 pm

There's a (tool-assisted) video of the Botwoon fight earlier in the thread. But you don't actually get anything for beating him except satisfaction.

Zeke

Edit history:

Zeke: 2009-06-29 03:51:20 pm

2009-06-29 02:27:39 pm

Time bomb set get out fast!

Victory! It took more attempts than I care to say (since I only let myself have a couple of savestates), but I beat Botwoon with eight energy tanks and one Crystal Flash. I wouldn't call him the hardest boss I've ever fought, but he's certainly the hardest I've fought in a Metroid hack; this may change when I reach the AngryFireChozo, though.

Here's a little advice for others attempting to kill this beast:

With Gravity Suit, the acid does 75 damage per round. Since you can't avoid that, concentrate on dodging Botwoon -- he hurts less but it adds up fast.
To answer my own question from the above post... well, I wasn't able to keep track, but it was about 30.
Collision damage during a Crystal Flash is fatal (you have no invincibility time), so bear that in mind. Shots and acid won't do this, but they seem to damage you normally, which can still kill you at the start of a CF.
If you want any hope of doing this without savestates or slowdown, then for the love of God, bring enough ammo for two CFs. It was all I could do just to win with only one.
Put jump on a shoulder button so you can, if you wish, hold it down continuously without making it awkward to press fire. Your thumb will thank you.
You can get spring ball before this fight. DO SO.
And finally, when you win, get out! The acid effect does not end with Botwoon's death.

Now I'm working on getting into the turtle room. Cardweaver, I do want to figure this out myself, but just to make it fair... are any glitches necessary to get in? If so, are they well-known (like mockball) or obscure (like anything that involves glitching through solid blocks)?

Victory!  It took more attempts than I care to say (since I only let myself have a couple of savestates), but I beat Botwoon with eight energy tanks and one Crystal Flash.  I wouldn't call him the hardest boss I've ever fought, but he's certainly the hardest I've fought in a Metroid hack; this may change when I reach the AngryFireChozo, though.

Here's a little advice for others attempting to kill this beast:

[list][li]With Gravity Suit, the acid does 75 damage per round.  Since you can't avoid that, concentrate on dodging Botwoon -- he hurts less but it adds up fast.[/li]
[li]To answer my own question from the above post... well, I wasn't able to keep track, but it was about 30.[/li]
[li]Collision damage during a Crystal Flash is fatal (you have no invincibility time), so bear that in mind.  Shots and acid won't do this, but they seem to damage you normally, which can still kill you at the start of a CF.[/li]
[li]If you want any hope of doing this without savestates or slowdown, then for the love of God, bring enough ammo for two CFs.  It was all I could do just to win with only one.[/li]
[li]Put jump on a shoulder button so you can, if you wish, hold it down continuously without making it awkward to press fire.  Your thumb will thank you. [/li]
[li]You can get spring ball before this fight.  DO SO.[/li]
[li]And finally, when you win, get out!  The acid effect does [i]not[/i] end with Botwoon's death.[/li]
[/list]

Now I'm working on getting into the turtle room.  Cardweaver, I do want to figure this out myself, but just to make it fair... are any glitches necessary to get in?  If so, are they well-known (like mockball) or obscure (like anything that involves glitching through solid blocks)?

Cardweaver

2009-06-29 06:27:34 pm

I wouldn't call it a glitch, not for the intended way anyway. It is possible to glitch your way in though. Getting out requires either glitching through the ceiling or CFing though, so keep that in mind.

Zeke

2009-06-30 07:20:53 pm

Time bomb set get out fast!

Well, I got the 'Scope.

Cardweaver, you and I have pretty different ideas of what constitutes a glitch.

Zeke

Edit history:

Zeke: 2009-09-16 09:49:49 pm

2009-09-15 01:58:30 pm

Time bomb set get out fast!

Mission accomplished! Three times, in fact, and going on four. I like this hack so much I keep starting a new run each time I finish one. (My last run was with Justin Bailey and Kejardon's latest version of Control Freak applied, so for the record, they're both compatible with Gravy.)

That's with the animals saved (which is a huge pain in this hack) and all bosses beaten, including Botwoon. This time I beat him without crystal flashing, although I did have all the energy and reserve tanks in the game. After three runs, I know Gravy well enough now to try playing for actual speed, so that's my next project.

I have a bunch of comments on the hack, which I'll spoiler-tag. First, though, I owe Cardweaver an apology for my previous post. There are two ways to get into the turtle room -- one intended, one via a glitch. I found the glitch and assumed it was the intended way. Sorry about that.

First, something that may be new. Cardweaver said a while back that you need the plasma beam, screw attack, or awesome short-charge skills to get out of the old Plasma Beam room, where the wave beam now resides. Guess what? Uncharged wave beam shots hurt pink pirates! I'm guessing this was an accident, but if you have nothing else to kill them with, it's just what the doctor ordered.
~~I bet in a time attack it would be possible to get Screw Attack before Gravity Suit.~~ While working on this post, I read the rest of the thread, and I found out this is well-known. Damn!
Some people upthread have claimed that the elevator from Crateria to red Brinstar is one-way. Not so -- Cardweaver put hidden spikes in that room for a reason. Crystal flash through the right-hand drop block, fire a super missile straight up, and jump clear. You can bomb the rest of the way.
Btw, that's how the mysterious "hurt you for no reason" spots work. Invisible spikes. Pretty clever.
~~Has anyone else noticed that Cardweaver hid some grapple blocks in the sand rooms of Maridia? They're on top of the posts between sand pits, disguised as ordinary blocks.~~ Actually, I just checked and they're not there. I must have been confusing Gravy with RBO, which I also beat recently.
One thing I'm proud of in the last run is that I used no savestates except in save rooms... with one exception. The Mochtroid room before Draygon is so hard I finally resorted to saving just outside it. Anyone have a trick for getting through there, besides "grapple better"?
To clear something up, when I wondered earlier if the ice mochtroid trick was the only way into Maridia main street, it probably sounded odd since there's another way around. Well, I had looked at the map, but I was forgetting a room that wasn't on it. Rookie mistake (which is embarrassing since I'm not one).
As much fun as Gravy is, I have to agree with some of Derakon's points. The invincibility of crawly enemies is just a nuisance. Respawning super missile blocks aren't much better. However, I'm not sure what he means about this supposed Maridia loop -- it is possible to go back through all the fake doors. Some can even be travelled both ways (try morphing).
The funny thing about the X-Ray Scope entry glitch is that it probably would be well-known if it were possible anywhere in the original game. So there's a hint if anybody wants one: look for something about the room layout which is never found in regular SM.
Speaking of advice, spring ball through the big acid room! It's much easier than trying to jump; your recoil will screw you every time. Morphing will also get you Crocomire's energy tank without waiting for the grapple beam.
The power bomb tank in the room full of eggs is completely unfair. I don't know how anyone found it without reading the thread archives or cracking the game open in SMILE.

And now a couple of questions for anyone who can answer them...

What's the trigger for the door to Lower Norfair (or rather, the acid room leading there)? There's been talk of Ridley-before-Draygon in this thread, but I'm at that point in my current run and the door won't open.
How in the damn hell do you get down to the Dachora's room? The floor isn't speed blocks anymore, but Cardweaver must have done something because the grapple beam acts funny there. If possible, please give me a hint without giving it away.

Finally, I've found a number of other places to get stuck. (Some turned out to be mentioned earlier in the thread.) This is understandable since it was Cardweaver's first hack and all, but I think it's important to warn players. Here's a list of all the trouble spots I know of, including those which have been mentioned already. I'll run it by you guys here and then move it to the intro post. No spoiler tags since that would defeat the purpose.

The Spring Ball room can only be exited by crystal flash. You can take damage in there, but you can't refill your ammo. Bring a full stock. Super missiles are most important since you'll use up several getting there, and the enemies nearby almost never drop supers.
The turtle area in Maridia also requires crystal flash to leave. It's easier to refill for this one, though.
If you want to exit the old pre-Wave Beam room by the lower door, make sure you have a power bomb, and save state first. It's possible to get permastuck there.
The water room in old Brinstar (the one which usually has an invisible platform and hidden boulders) requires the Gravity Suit. You'll get stuck if you try it without.
When leaving the old Ice Beam room, if you're out of super missiles and power bombs, respawn the crawly enemies until they give you a refill. Otherwise you'll get caught between a drop block and an enemy you can't destroy.
A couple of horizontal rooms no longer have a floor. If you fall through, you'll wrap around and come out the ceiling, landing halfway down. Sometimes you can jump back the way you came, but not always, so avoid doing this. There's one of these rooms near the Norfair bubble room and another early in Tourian. (Interesting things happen when you do it with a Metroid attached.)
There's an obvious stupid thing you can do immediately after getting the Varia or Gravity Suit. Don't do it.
Don't enter the Crateria gauntlet without a decent number of energy tanks. You can't go back, and unlike the usual gauntlet, it's outright impossible if you don't have enough health.
If you try exploring Maridia without Gravity, don't go through any green gates if you're not confident you can glitch back through them.

do not go back

close

Mission accomplished!  Three times, in fact, and going on four.  I like this hack so much I keep starting a new run each time I finish one.  (My last run was with Justin Bailey and Kejardon's latest version of Control Freak applied, so for the record, they're both compatible with Gravy.)

[IMG]http://i616.photobucket.com/albums/tt243/CZeke/SuperMetroidGravyJBCF.jpg[/img]

That's with the animals saved (which is a huge pain in this hack) and all bosses beaten, including Botwoon.  This time I beat him without crystal flashing, although I did have all the energy and reserve tanks in the game.  After three runs, I know Gravy well enough now to try playing for actual [i]speed[/i], so that's my next project.

I have a bunch of comments on the hack, which I'll spoiler-tag.  First, though, I owe Cardweaver an apology for my previous post.  There are [i]two[/i] ways to get into the turtle room -- one intended, one via a glitch.  I found the glitch and assumed it was the intended way.  Sorry about that.

[spoiler]
[list][li]First, something that may be new.  Cardweaver said a while back that you need the plasma beam, screw attack, or awesome short-charge skills to get out of the old Plasma Beam room, where the wave beam now resides.  Guess what? Uncharged wave beam shots hurt pink pirates!  I'm guessing this was an accident, but if you have nothing else to kill them with, it's just what the doctor ordered.[/li]
[li][s]I bet in a time attack it would be possible to get Screw Attack before Gravity Suit.[/s] While working on this post, I read the rest of the thread, and I found out this is well-known.  Damn![/li]
[li]Some people upthread have claimed that the elevator from Crateria to red Brinstar is one-way.  Not so -- Cardweaver put hidden spikes in that room for a reason.  Crystal flash through the right-hand drop block, fire a super missile straight up, and jump clear.  You can bomb the rest of the way.[/li]
[li]Btw, that's how the mysterious "hurt you for no reason" spots work.  Invisible spikes.  Pretty clever.[/li]
[li][s]Has anyone else noticed that Cardweaver hid some grapple blocks in the sand rooms of Maridia?  They're on top of the posts between sand pits, disguised as ordinary blocks.[/s] Actually, I just checked and they're not there.  I must have been confusing Gravy with RBO, which I also beat recently.  [/li]
[li]One thing I'm proud of in the last run is that I used no savestates except in save rooms... with one exception.  The Mochtroid room before Draygon is so hard I finally resorted to saving just outside it.  Anyone have a trick for getting through there, besides "grapple better"?[/li]
[li]To clear something up, when I wondered earlier if the ice mochtroid trick was the only way into Maridia main street, it probably sounded odd since there's another way around.  Well, I [i]had[/i] looked at the map, but I was forgetting a room that wasn't on it.  Rookie mistake (which is embarrassing since I'm not one).[/li]
[li]As much fun as Gravy is, I have to agree with some of Derakon's points.  The invincibility of crawly enemies is just a nuisance.  Respawning super missile blocks aren't much better.  However, I'm not sure what he means about this supposed Maridia loop -- it [i]is[/i] possible to go back through all the fake doors.  Some can even be travelled both ways (try morphing).[/li]
[li]The funny thing about the X-Ray Scope entry glitch is that it probably [i]would[/i] be well-known if it were possible anywhere in the original game.  So there's a hint if anybody wants one: look for something about the room layout which is never found in regular SM.[/li]
[li]Speaking of advice, spring ball through the big acid room!  It's [i]much[/i] easier than trying to jump; your recoil will screw you every time.  Morphing will also get you Crocomire's energy tank without waiting for the grapple beam.[/li]
[li]The power bomb tank in the room full of eggs is completely unfair.  I don't know how anyone found it without reading the thread archives or cracking the game open in SMILE.[/li]
[li]Man, does the scrolling go weird after you pick up the Maridia main street items, or what?
[/list][/spoiler]

And now a couple of questions for anyone who can answer them...

[spoiler][list][li]What's the trigger for the door to Lower Norfair (or rather, the acid room leading there)?  There's been talk of Ridley-before-Draygon in this thread, but I'm at that point in my current run and the door won't open.[/li]
[li]How in the damn hell do you get down to the Dachora's room?  The floor isn't speed blocks anymore, but Cardweaver must have done [i]something[/i] because the grapple beam acts funny there.  If possible, please give me a hint without giving it away.[/li]
[li]The room before the kung fu pirates normally has a false wall you can power bomb.  That wall is solid in Gravy and the PB upgrade that's supposed to be behind it has been moved elsewhere.  Is that little room just gone now, or can you still get in?  It seems odd since Cardweaver didn't remove any other small rooms whose upgrades were no longer there.[/list][/spoiler]

Finally, I've found a number of other places to get stuck.  (Some turned out to be mentioned earlier in the thread.)  This is understandable since it was Cardweaver's first hack and all, but I think it's important to warn players.  Here's a list of all the trouble spots I know of, including those which have been mentioned already.  I'll run it by you guys here and then move it to the intro post.  No spoiler tags since that would defeat the purpose.

[list][li]The Spring Ball room can only be exited by crystal flash.  You can take damage in there, but you can't refill your ammo.  Bring a full stock.  Super missiles are most important since you'll use up several getting there, and the enemies nearby almost never drop supers.[/li]
[li]The turtle area in Maridia also requires crystal flash to leave.  It's easier to refill for this one, though.[/li]
[li]If you want to exit the old pre-Wave Beam room by the lower door, make sure you have a power bomb, and save state first.  It's possible to get permastuck there.[/li]
[li]The water room in old Brinstar (the one which usually has an invisible platform and hidden boulders) requires the Gravity Suit.  You'll get stuck if you try it without.[/li]
[li]When leaving the old Ice Beam room, if you're out of super missiles and power bombs, respawn the crawly enemies until they give you a refill.  Otherwise you'll get caught between a drop block and an enemy you can't destroy.[/li]
[li]A couple of horizontal rooms no longer have a floor.  If you fall through, you'll wrap around and come out the ceiling, landing halfway down.  Sometimes you can jump back the way you came, but not always, so avoid doing this.  There's one of these rooms near the Norfair bubble room and another early in Tourian.  (Interesting things happen when you do it with a Metroid attached.)[/li]
[li]There's an obvious stupid thing you can do immediately after getting the Varia or Gravity Suit.  Don't do it.[/li]
[li]Don't enter the Crateria gauntlet without a decent number of energy tanks.  You can't go back, and unlike the usual gauntlet, it's outright impossible if you don't have enough health.[/li]
[li]If you try exploring Maridia without Gravity, don't go through any green gates if you're not confident you can glitch back through them.[/li]
[li]In the Wrecked Ship, there's a door with a wall right in front of it.  Once you make it through this door, [i]do not go back[/i] -- you'll be stuck in the wall with no escape.  Unfortunately, coming [i]close[/i] to re-entering the door is necessary to advance.  Just be careful about it.
[/list]

Quietus

2009-09-15 03:24:50 pm

Super Secret Area - Dead Ahead!

For your questions:

2, As far as I know, they're just solid blocks.
3, As above, but if you haven't found them, the Bombs are:

in the right-hand wall below the lower lift

Cardweaver

2009-09-16 01:13:25 pm

Thanks for such a large amount of feedback.

As far as your questions... That door is triggered by a door in Maridia, I'm guessing one involving Draygon. Quietus is right about the other 2.

Regarding some of the feedback:
-You can glitch through the ceiling when leaving the turtle room, no CF is required there.
-There isn't an easier way to cross the mochtroid room before grappling, other than freezing a mochtroid close to the last grapple block.
-I believe some of the discrepancies of what I've said and what is true are because of the fact that I released v1.2 after v1.1 still had problems.

I'm glad you liked it so much. When I look back at Gravy, I think how far I've come, but it's nice to know that so many peopel thoroughly enjoyed it.

Zeke

2009-10-01 01:42:24 am

Time bomb set get out fast!

So I have indeed been playing Gravy for speed. My first run clocked in at about 2:25 -- good but not great. I'm much more satisfied with the second one:

This was with 46%. I hope to reduce that, but I'm not sure how much I can cut without resigning myself to a ton of retries. (We're not talking about a tas run here -- I allowed myself something like 15 savestates in all, mostly in save rooms.) When it comes to speed, Gravy has an unusual limiting factor in Mini-Kraid. You have to collect enough missile tanks to take him down in one go, or else spend a year and a half finishing him with charge beam.

Since I clearly can't put this hack down, I think I just might try speedrunning it for real. Obviously the run would be recorded in an emulator, but I'd play under console conditions: save only in save rooms, no slowdown (which I don't use anyway). A Sess run, in other words. I'm already working on a Metroid X run, so this would be strictly back-burner, but is it something y'all would be interested in seeing?

Cardweaver: Okay, so what did you do to the Dachora entrance? Walk around firing the grapple beam and you'll see what I mean about it acting funny there.

Quietus: Thanks for the tip, but I suggest you look at my percentage again. :)

So I have indeed been playing Gravy for speed.  My first run clocked in at about 2:25 -- good but not great.  I'm much more satisfied with the second one:

[IMG]http://i616.photobucket.com/albums/tt243/CZeke/CopyofSuperMetroidGravyJBCF.jpg[/img]

This was with 46%.  I hope to reduce that, but I'm not sure how much I can cut without resigning myself to a ton of retries.  (We're not talking about a tas run here -- I allowed myself something like 15 savestates in all, mostly in save rooms.)  When it comes to speed, Gravy has an unusual limiting factor in Mini-Kraid.  You have to collect enough missile tanks to take him down in one go, or else spend a year and a half finishing him with charge beam.

Since I clearly can't put this hack down, I think I just might try speedrunning it for real.  Obviously the run would be recorded in an emulator, but I'd play under console conditions: save only in save rooms, no slowdown (which I don't use anyway).  A Sess run, in other words.  I'm already working on a Metroid X run, so this would be strictly back-burner, but is it something y'all would be interested in seeing?

Cardweaver: Okay, so what [i]did[/i] you do to the Dachora entrance?  Walk around firing the grapple beam and you'll see what I mean about it acting funny there.

Quietus: Thanks for the tip, but I suggest you look at my percentage again. :)

Quietus

2009-10-01 04:15:52 am

Super Secret Area - Dead Ahead!

Quote from Zeke:

is it something y'all would be interested in seeing?

Speed runs of any hack are always welcome as far as I'm concerned.

Quote from Zeke:

Quietus: Thanks for the tip, but I suggest you look at my percentage again. :)

Me no understand, unless you're telling me that 46% is the max, in which case you must have found it..?

Cardweaver

2009-10-01 04:49:59 am

I'm fairly certain that grapple beam problem you're experiencing is because of a scroll PLM. I've noticed that the grapple beam acts a little weird when fired either through it or when you're standing on it. No idea why, but Kej could probably explain it.

And yes, I'd all love to see another speed run of this.

Sneaky Paradox

2009-10-02 08:18:07 pm

Yes, speedrun this hack to get Cardweaver to forget about my not speedrunning Soup. I'll love you forever, Zeke.

Zeke

2009-10-02 09:23:30 pm

Time bomb set get out fast!

Cardweaver: The scroll point! Of course! I looked at the room in SMILE and saw some weird tiles, but they must just represent scrolling instructions. That explains why it happened in Soup too. I'll have to play with grapple around some other scroll points and see if the same odd things happen.

Quietus: No, the post you were answering originally.

Just for fun, here are two more Gravy screenshots. First, a funny thing happened when I was fighting the Golden Torizo:

(Now we just need to make him pogo...)

And second, an exciting discovery! I guarantee you I took this screenshot in Gravy, without editing the ROM or using cheat codes of any kind.

Can anybody figure out how I did it?

Quietus

2009-10-04 11:17:47 am

Super Secret Area - Dead Ahead!

I presume since you've been talking about scroll blocks and Grapple that they're involved, but you should spill the beans - it may be a new exploitable glitch. aiwebs_011

Zeke

2009-10-08 03:47:57 am

Time bomb set get out fast!

Oh, I wouldn't pull a Brightstar on you. There are no new techniques involved. It is, however, a bit of a trick question.