Possible sequence break of DOOM! (escape TRO w/o high jump?)

2004-08-16 09:33:45 pm

Shifty Leader

That M2k2 guy

Okay, sorry for this, but I think I found a possible sequence break.

A while ago there was word of a possible single wall wall jump, but it's hard as a mofo, and you may not even gain height. This was considered when people were talking about the TRO trap and glitching up the game by reaching Nettori, and unlocking level 4 locks by beating it or something.

Anyways, WAY before that, when you first go into TRO to pick up the bombs, and are on your way to fight giant hoppy tree dude, you come across that huge shaft that's supposedly impossible to get up without high jump. Well, when you get to that door on the top right (big blue room full of NOTHING but huge walls and an empty crawl space), if you jump as high as you can, then wall jump, you will hit your head on the ledge up there , but continue to go up a few pixels (just pixels from grabbing on). What I'm proposing is that somebody wall jump into that wall, and since you can't go further away, but you can continue up a few pixels, somebody should try to reach the top of the jump, shoot, spin right, shoot, spin right, shoot, etc. I think you can gain a few pixels on that right wall this way, and be able to get a few pixels higher and actually grab onto the ledge!

Who's up to it? I can't do it, I suck at rapid tapping. I just wanna see it done, maybe even EXIT TRO WITHOUT HIGH JUMP!!! Adam cannot control us any longer! FIGHT THE POWER!!! MINIMUM PERCENT MAY BE NEGATIVE...or something.... Exclamation

Thread title:

Okay, sorry for this, but I think I found a possible sequence break.

A while ago there was word of a possible single wall wall jump, but it's hard as a mofo, and you may not even gain height. This was considered when people were talking about the TRO trap and glitching up the game by reaching Nettori, and unlocking level 4 locks by beating it or something.

Anyways, WAY before that, when you first go into TRO to pick up the bombs, and are on your way to fight giant hoppy tree dude, you come across that huge shaft that's supposedly impossible to get up without high jump. Well, when you get to that door on the top right (big blue room full of NOTHING but huge walls and an empty crawl space), if you jump as high as you can, then wall jump, you will hit your head on the ledge up there , but continue to go up a few pixels (just pixels from grabbing on). What I'm proposing is that somebody wall jump into that wall, and since you can't go further away, but you can continue up a few pixels, somebody should try to reach the top of the jump, shoot, spin right, shoot, spin right, shoot, etc. I think you can gain a few pixels on that right wall this way, and be able to get a few pixels higher and actually grab onto the ledge!

Who's up to it? I can't do it, I suck at rapid tapping. I just wanna see it done, maybe even EXIT TRO WITHOUT HIGH JUMP!!! Adam cannot control us any longer! FIGHT THE POWER!!! MINIMUM PERCENT MAY BE NEGATIVE...or something.... :!:  :shock:

Yoshi348

2004-08-16 10:40:12 pm

PAGE BREAKER

Ready and willing.

POWER TO THE WORKING MAN!

Erm, uh...

yeah.

Oh, and the sequence break of DOOM is the no clipping cheat code.

Wassup Dawgs

2004-08-17 12:33:37 am

Funny Yoshi.

I would try it (I would've tried a long time ago, but I didn't really care) but my keyboard has considerable lage to it. It's about .015 seconds slower than other keyboards. It might not seem like that much but when using it for extremely quick movements, it's very noticable.

Eh, I'll see what I can do.

JaggerG

2004-08-17 12:58:26 am

Shifty Leader

That M2k2 guy

I'll keep tryin' on my GBASP (heh, fat chance), but we'll see eventually. I hope I'm right, I haven't been right about much before. :?

nate

2004-08-17 01:15:22 am

hate to burst your bubble, but i'm pretty sure we proved last summer that you can't gain height wall jumping in fusion unless you are hit in the middle of the jump (thus the name of the technique, the "zero sum wall jump"). still, i don't mean to discourage. feel free to try, hacking a vmu if you can to try to get past your control issues.

Yoshi348

2004-08-17 02:36:24 am

PAGE BREAKER

Ready and willing.

So I'm seeing that if this does go through (and I'm seeing a yeah, right on that), it'll be as evil as no boost ball.

JaggerG

2004-08-18 12:08:54 am

Shifty Leader

That M2k2 guy

well, if the "zero sum wall jump" does work, then a few pixels gain should also work in this case. This is what is so frickin' annoying about it, that it may be possible, but it requires pixel perfection every moment of it. You only come about half a block short of grabbing it, so it's three wall jumps tops, but still...I just have to see it....

PikminKing

2004-08-18 09:27:02 am

That's sounds just smart enough to work. I'll try it!

JaggerG

2004-08-18 02:42:56 pm

Shifty Leader

That M2k2 guy

Well, I can do underwater single wall climbing fairly easily now, so I hope I can pull off this trick soon, before somebody else takes half the credit Wink

Maybe I should just use an emulator and slow down the frame rate or something. I dunno. Well, good luck to all that wish to try it.

JaggerG

2004-08-21 03:45:13 pm

Shifty Leader

That M2k2 guy

Last night, I was just so sick of trying the TRO no High jump escape, that I decided I'd try out the TRO trap by Sess. I got there, kept trying, and just could not figure out how to do it. So I came here and watched the vid again. I was in awe. If somebody could pull that off, they will have no problem with my trick. That's just insane. It seems like Sess shoots the branch and wall jumps at the same time! That's got to be a physical impossibility, so my trick must be simple as hell. Sorry, guys, but this trick IS in fact possible for somebody that fast and loaded with caffeine and sugar, and is a robot, AKA Sesshoumaru. I don't believe he's human.

Izo

2004-08-21 03:52:00 pm

soaking through

Sess does shoot the branch and wall jump at the same time. It's a little trick that he found out on his 1% Tech demo.

JaggerG

2004-08-21 04:04:32 pm

Shifty Leader

That M2k2 guy

...

HOLY BAJEEBUS!!! You can shoot and wall jump without having to spin?!? WHY DON'T I KNOW THIS?!? I read all of his commentary, and the TRO trap commentary, and not ONCE have I heard of it!!! :?

JaggerG

2004-08-21 06:26:55 pm

Shifty Leader

That M2k2 guy

"When you hit the wall, you must quickly shoot diagonally up right to clear a root away, then quickly again hit left and jump to start spinning left, then right and jump immediately after to wall jump off."

A frame by frame run through the vid shows Sess hitting the wall, spinning after hitting it, then one frame at a time, he turns away, shoots, spins left, spins right, and jumps.

JaggerG

2004-09-03 04:40:58 am

Shifty Leader

That M2k2 guy

Okay, I discovered tonight that you can use l to spark diagonally. :x

I still can't do the TRO trap, but I'm sure there must be some trick to it that I don't know about. It just isn't possible to hit the keys that fast. How, Sess? How is it possible?

Sesshoumaru

2004-09-03 06:05:27 am

<_< >_>

Savestates

*runs*

Seriously though, there's a reason the video on m2k2 of it starts after I'm in mid-sparking. I made a savestate at that point, and then it was just a matter of hitting the keys over and over and over until it worked once. I never actually did it from scratch. I imagine that would be rather annoying. And as for hitting the keys that fast, that's just a matter of muscle memory. Practiceing until you don't have to think about it, you're hands just know what to do. Kind of like vent shaft in 22% actually. Once I practiced that bomb jump a few times, I only half-payed-attention to the screen, and my fingers knew what to do without me explicitly telling them, and due to the natural random variations in my timing, one of them was eventually timed perfectly.

It's really a lot like that jump I did in the I room of the meltdown segment, which was kind of like a single wall jump, where I grabbed the ledge above me after wall jumping, but that needs an overhang to work, which you also have here, so it works.

And as far as the 'shooting while wall jumping' bit, that was something I did back in, I think the going to giant plant segment, which involved having a full charge, then releasing the button during the 'crouch' animation of the wall jump. Problem is you need to have a charge for that to work, and since you just came out of a spark in this case, you don't have one built up, so you can't do that here.

Also I don't think it's actually frame-by-frame of play that you need to do all those things, just the video on m2k2 probably is using frameskip so it looks that way. I know it takes some of the amazing out of it to know that, but what can you do.

<_< >_>

Savestates

*runs*

Seriously though, there's a reason the video on m2k2 of it starts after I'm in mid-sparking.  I made a savestate at that point, and then it was just a matter of hitting the keys over and over and over until it worked once.  I never actually did it from scratch.  I imagine that would be rather annoying.  And as for hitting the keys that fast, that's just a matter of muscle memory.  Practiceing until you don't have to think about it, you're hands just know what to do.  Kind of like vent shaft in 22% actually.  Once I practiced that bomb jump a few times, I only half-payed-attention to the screen, and my fingers knew what to do without me explicitly telling them, and due to the natural random variations in my timing, one of them was eventually timed perfectly.

It's really a lot like that jump I did in the I room of the  meltdown segment, which was kind of like a single wall jump, where I grabbed the ledge above me after wall jumping, but that needs an overhang to work, which you also have here, so it works.

And as far as the 'shooting while wall jumping' bit, that was something I did back in, I think the going to giant plant segment, which involved having a full charge, then releasing the button during the 'crouch' animation of the wall jump.  Problem is you need to have a charge for that to work, and since you just came out of a spark in this case, you don't have one built up, so you can't do that here.

Also I don't think it's actually frame-by-frame of play that you need to do all those things, just the video on m2k2 probably is using frameskip so it looks that way.  I know it takes some of the amazing out of it to know that, but what can you do.

JaggerG

2004-09-05 04:27:16 pm

Shifty Leader

That M2k2 guy

Quote from Sesshoumaru:

Practiceing

*Practicing (Sorry, I just had to :) )

Quote from Seeshoumaru:

I don't think it's actually frame-by-frame of play that you need to do all those things, just the video on m2k2 probably is using frameskip so it looks that way.

Well, that's pretty much what I meant...Frame by frame on the clip... Embarassed

Quote from Sesshoumaru:

I know it takes some of the amazing out of it to know that

Nah, it's still a sequence break in an unsequence breakable game. I suppose that would count for something at least. :P

Quote from Sesshoumaru:

what can you do.

Well, I still intend to do it, I suppose all that's left is practice. I know I CAN, but I'm not very good at sparking in the right spot, so that AND the perfect shoot/wall jump have to both work on the same run. Last time I tried, I had trouble getting speed boost, having stopped about a pixel too soon. Embarassed

Well, I appreciate the input. So, getting a bit more on topic, you think you'll ever try the no High Jump TRO escape? It doesn't seem as demanding as the first, it's just a long round of perfection followed by a super [----------c--e--n--s--o--r--e--d----------] pixel perfect spin/wall jump routine. Shouldn't be TOO impossible....

[quote="Sesshoumaru"]Practiceing[/quote]
*Practicing (Sorry, I just had to :) )

[quote="Seeshoumaru"]I don't think it's actually frame-by-frame of play that you need to do all those things, just the video on m2k2 probably is using frameskip so it looks that way.[/quote]
Well, that's pretty much what I meant...Frame by frame on the clip... :oops:

[quote="Sesshoumaru"]I know it takes some of the amazing out of it to know that[/quote]
Nah, it's still a sequence break in an unsequence breakable game. I suppose that would count for something at least. :P

[quote="Sesshoumaru"]what can you do.[/quote]
Well, I still intend to do it, I suppose all that's left is practice. I know I CAN, but I'm not very good at sparking in the right spot, so that AND the perfect shoot/wall jump have to both work on the same run. Last time I tried, I had trouble getting speed boost, having stopped about a pixel too soon. :oops:

Well, I appreciate the input. So, getting a bit more on topic, you think you'll ever try the no High Jump TRO escape? It doesn't seem as demanding as the first, it's just a long round of perfection followed by a super [----------c--e--n--s--o--r--e--d----------] pixel perfect spin/wall jump routine. Shouldn't be TOO impossible....

Wassup Dawgs

2004-09-11 12:24:31 am

You know, if the shinespark lasted one more warble, I could SB another Power Bomb. It's the PB behind the yellow Barrier-X in ARC. I can break the first bomb block, and still retain the shine, but I always run out when trying to get the second one.

Or if that one ramp were little more to the left.

Now that I think about, if the spark was a warble longer, I could SB even another Power Bomb. You can almost get that one underwater in SRX. The one near the Beam-core-X. You can barely break the first speed block because you hit it and the ceiling to the left. It might be possible to grab this one though. Just need to try a little more.

nate

2004-09-11 12:30:06 am

just to clarify, right now the divx versions of sess's videos include about half of the frames of a full framerate original. they will include every frame soon (when sess finishes the demo and i redo all of the segments again).

JaggerG

2004-09-11 04:43:31 pm

Shifty Leader

That M2k2 guy

Sounds pretty cool, so we're still not through with Fusion! Yay!

SonicandTails218

2004-09-11 07:35:06 pm

I just realized something. I think N is having fun with us. They know that we'll try anything possible to sequence break, so they made a game that you think you can SB, but you are just a little short.

We really need a Fusion version of the Mockball, one glitch that opens it all up.

Yoshi348

2004-09-11 08:16:34 pm

PAGE BREAKER

Ready and willing.

You do know about the event++ system, right?

elyscape

2004-09-11 08:20:08 pm

Quote from Yoshi348:

You do know about the event++ system, right?

I don't. What is it?

Yoshi348

2004-09-12 12:19:07 am

PAGE BREAKER

Ready and willing.

Quote from njhakne:

for the uninformed, whenever you accomplish anything in fusion, be it unlocking security doors, defeating a boss, or acquiring an item, the game calls event++;, which increments an integer called "event" by one. picking up the plasma beam might be event 20, and picking up the morph ball bombs might be even 5, for example. because of this, should you attempt to sequence break and get the plasma beam before the morph ball bombs, for example, the game will give you the morph ball bombs when you pick up the plasma beam instead of the plasma beam, since it just incremented "event" from 4 to 5.

A couple points:

1) This is why you can't shark up items very well.
2) Nate wrote this up quite a while ago.
3) Technically, it shouldn't be called "calling" event++. (Of course, they probably don't write it in C, but...) Event++ isn't a defined function, so "calling" Event++ would be like "calling" the assignment operator.

Jigglysaint

2004-09-12 01:00:59 am

Has anybody ever located the events in the rom?

elyscape

2004-09-12 01:36:38 am

Quote from Yoshi348:

3) Technically, it shouldn't be called "calling" event++. (Of course, they probably don't write it in C, but...) Event++ isn't a defined function, so "calling" Event++ would be like "calling" the assignment operator.

Actually, they probably do write in C/C++. Most games for most systems are written in it/them/thing (ignoring, of course, webgames, as they use things such as Flash or Java).

Quote from Jigglysaint:

Has anybody ever located the events in the rom?

If nobody has yet, I'm sure you could, Jiggly.