Metroid Prime hacking research

2014-12-01 12:53:15 pm

Yeah I know, I found it in the Metroid5.pak of Metroid Prime 2 with a very interesting texture.
Its file name is d93bf8f4.CMDL
I find it really weird that this is in the game, I speculate it had something to do with the light suit, going off of its texture, but I cant be too sure.

Aruki

Edit history:

Aruki: 2014-12-01 01:52:59 pm

2014-12-01 01:50:26 pm

Quote from metroid9824:

I've been watching this thread like a hawk ever since I found it. I'm really excited about this project. Paraxade, keep it up. You are part of what makes the Internet so great. I look forward to your first release.

that's awesome, thanks! I'm kinda trying to work towards getting a first release running at the moment so I can get some UI feedback but there's a lot that needs to get done by that point. I gotta get the backend sorted out and add pak/MLVL support, I want to get the "viewing" aspects mostly finished, and I want to get at least basic object editing functionality working.

Quote from flarespire:

Thank you so much! also I stumbled across this whilst searching for the Quadraxis models yesterday, I wonder what its intended purpose was:

That actually looks a lot like an unused morph ball model I found in the MP1 demo. That's pretty bizarre. Wonder what it's doing in MP2...

EDIT: it's probably the same model, in fact, just looks difference since the materials aren't being rendered in Max. The one in the demo has the exact same resource ID. (It's in TestAnim.pak.)

[quote="metroid9824"]I've been watching this thread like a hawk ever since I found it. I'm really excited about this project. Paraxade, keep it up. You are part of what makes the Internet so great. I look forward to your first release.[/quote]

that's awesome, thanks! I'm kinda trying to work towards getting a first release running at the moment so I can get some UI feedback but there's a lot that needs to get done by that point. I gotta get the backend sorted out and add pak/MLVL support, I want to get the "viewing" aspects mostly finished, and I want to get at least basic object editing functionality working.

[quote="flarespire"]Thank you so much! also I stumbled across this whilst searching for the Quadraxis models yesterday, I wonder what its intended purpose was:[/quote]

That actually looks a lot like [url=https://m2k2.taigaforum.com/post/metroid_prime_hacking_research_475.html]an unused morph ball model I found in the MP1 demo[/url]. That's pretty bizarre. Wonder what it's doing in MP2...

EDIT: it's probably the same model, in fact, just looks difference since the materials aren't being rendered in Max. The one in the demo has the exact same resource ID. (It's in TestAnim.pak.)

flarespire

2014-12-01 01:56:08 pm

Yeah it is very weird, whats weirder is that is packaged in with most of the sanctuary content, so it may just be anomalous padding data or it may have had some sort of function within that section of the game at a guess. Hmm, I wonder if its possible to model swap the light suits morph ball for that within the ROM, might yield some interesting results.

Aruki

2014-12-01 02:02:37 pm

in the demo it's just a generic spider ball model, I believe - it's the only node listed in SamusSpiderBallANCS. In Echoes it looks like it's used in Quadraxis's death cutscene in Hive Temple. It's listed as the model for a cutscene actor named "Spiderball_On_head". The game probably actually uses an ANCS to fetch that model, so it doesn't show up ingame.

There are some similar cases in MP1... there's some weird chozo ghost and beam trooper models that are listed as the model for some objects, but since the game actually uses an ANCS to fetch the assets for those objects, they never actually show up ingame.

flarespire

2014-12-01 02:16:37 pm

Hmm, that does explain a few things, including the coincidence of me finding it whilst ironically searching for the parts of Quadraxis yesterday.

On a side note, has anyone else noticed that the Prime 3 PED suit has physically modeled human bones in its legs?

I'm guessing its most likely for use with the X-Ray visor which makes its return in Prime 3.

Bearborg

Edit history:

Bearborg: 2014-12-01 08:11:08 pm

2014-12-01 02:32:59 pm

Yeah, it's for when you're in your ship.

Aruki

2014-12-01 02:35:32 pm

now I'm reminded of these pictures I tweeted a few months ago while screwing around with free look in dolphin

flarespire

2014-12-01 02:36:51 pm

You know, I haven't played Prime 3 in such a long time I completely forgot you had the ship segments. although I do love the attention to detail Retro show in their Games.

@Paraxade, WTF?

Antidote

2014-12-03 12:30:50 am

@flarespire, Retro placed the arms relative to the position of the camera, and the freelook feature derps around with it and causes hilarious results.

Antidote

Edit history:

Antidote: 2014-12-03 12:38:08 am

2014-12-03 12:36:47 am

Quote from Paraxade:

in the demo it's just a generic spider ball model, I believe - it's the only node listed in SamusSpiderBallANCS. In Echoes it looks like it's used in Quadraxis's death cutscene in Hive Temple. It's listed as the model for a cutscene actor named "Spiderball_On_head". The game probably actually uses an ANCS to fetch that model, so it doesn't show up ingame.

There are some similar cases in MP1... there's some weird chozo ghost and beam trooper models that are listed as the model for some objects, but since the game actually uses an ANCS to fetch the assets for those objects, they never actually show up ingame.

What I've been able to figure out is that the game first checks the ANCS field, if it's set to either 0 or -1, it then checks the CMDL field, which makes it always use the appropriate model. I know this is the case becuase clearing out the ANCS field and filling in the model field with the proper value produces no change, while leaving both empty either causes the game to crash, or makes it skip loading that particular asset, I think it largely depends on the component type. Unsuprisingly some models are left in a permanent T-Pose if you don't load the ANCS.

[quote="Paraxade"]in the demo it's just a generic spider ball model, I believe - it's the only node listed in SamusSpiderBallANCS. In Echoes it looks like it's used in Quadraxis's death cutscene in Hive Temple. It's listed as the model for a cutscene actor named "Spiderball_On_head". The game probably actually uses an ANCS to fetch that model, so it doesn't show up ingame.

There are some similar cases in MP1... there's some weird chozo ghost and beam trooper models that are listed as the model for some objects, but since the game actually uses an ANCS to fetch the assets for those objects, they never actually show up ingame.[/quote]
What I've been able to figure out is that the game first checks the ANCS field, if it's set to either 0 or -1, it then checks the CMDL field, which makes it always use the appropriate model. I know this is the case becuase clearing out the ANCS field and filling in the model field with the proper value produces no change, while leaving both empty either causes the game to crash, or makes it skip loading that particular asset, I think it largely depends on the component type. Unsuprisingly some models are left in a permanent T-Pose if you don't load the ANCS.

Aruki

Edit history:

Aruki: 2014-12-03 05:38:03 am

2014-12-03 05:37:48 am

Yeah, without the ANCS it has no rigging information so the model can't animate. That's why you typically only see the CMDL field being actually used by the game on static objects like platforms. Makes me wonder what the CMDL field is for exactly on other objects, though, especially when it links to assets that otherwise aren't used. Maybe it's their editor model.

Antidote

2014-12-03 03:59:33 pm

Quote from Paraxade:

Yeah, without the ANCS it has no rigging information so the model can't animate. That's why you typically only see the CMDL field being actually used by the game on static objects like platforms. Makes me wonder what the CMDL field is for exactly on other objects, though, especially when it links to assets that otherwise aren't used. Maybe it's their editor model.

That's what I was thinking too.

embyr_75

2014-12-03 04:44:28 pm

Metroid Wiki

Ok this is probably a really stupid question, but I don't know the answer and I'm in the presence of Prime Hacking Geniuses so here goes:

Is there any way to activate particular cutscenes, for viewing purposes only? I was thinking specifically that a Debug Menu would be great (there was one for Majora's Mask that was fun to play with), but I haven't found any evidence online that one has been discovered for the Primes. It would also be nice to begin gameplay in a particular world, regardless of my progress on a particular file. I'm mostly concerned with capturing Screenshots, videos, etc, without having to actually play through the game (my laptop is painfully slow and the AR codes are glitchy). I got all excited when I discovered the THP files but, of course, those are only for the prerendered movies. Boo.

Aruki

2014-12-03 04:51:14 pm

If you know the game it shouldn't really take more than a few hours to play through it... barring that the only other thing you can really do is hex edit the dol to change what world you start at in a new file, which DJGrenola posted how to do here.

Bearborg

2014-12-03 04:57:32 pm

Quote from embyr_75:

I'm mostly concerned with capturing Screenshots, videos, etc, without having to actually play through the game (my laptop is painfully slow and the AR codes are glitchy).

Personally, the best solution I've found for this is just keeping a library of exported save files to use for each game. Whenever I need images from a specific section, I just load up a save nearby.

embyr_75

2014-12-03 06:57:50 pm

Metroid Wiki

^ But I'm soooo laaaazy....

Yeah, this will work if it's my only option. I just dread going through the entire game at 10 fps for one lousy cutscene. :P

Aruki

2014-12-03 07:08:22 pm

How are you gonna record a video of a cutscene if you're running the game at 10 fps anyway?

embyr_75

2014-12-03 07:32:13 pm

Metroid Wiki

Very, very slowly. :P Stop pointing out the gaping flaws in my plans!

Seriously though the cutscenes actually run quite smoothly for me compared to regular gameplay. That having been said, all screen capture programs I've tried have been pretty much intolerable. But I'll cross that bridge when I come to it. Screenshots of cutscenes are more realistic are a more realistic goal for me atm.

Antidote

2014-12-03 09:05:27 pm

Unfortunately Retro was pretty thorough in removing the debug stuff, most of the debug code is either unreferenced, or empty.

Antidote

2014-12-03 09:06:52 pm

Eh, if you have a Wii you can just play to the point you want, and extract the save when you get there and import it into Dolphin.

Bearborg

2014-12-03 10:06:44 pm

Quote from Paraxade:

How are you gonna record a video of a cutscene if you're running the game at 10 fps anyway?

You can get pretty good results by using Dolphin's frame limiter to keep things stable at a low framerate, and then speeding the footage back up afterwards. This was recorded at 15 fps, for instance. There's no usable audio, of course, but you could solve that with Dolphin's audio dump feature.

wantija

2014-12-07 09:54:41 pm

Not sure if this has been asked already, but is it possible to fix the loop point for the flaahgra boss music for the NTSC release? If so what file(s) would I edit?

Antidote

2014-12-07 10:04:29 pm

It should be rather simple to do it, but first we have to find it.

MilesSMB

2014-12-07 10:26:11 pm

It loops perfectly fine. It's not a glitch, that's the entire track on the disc; they extended it for later versions of the game.

Aruki

2014-12-07 10:26:25 pm

there is no loop point error, the track is just simply extended on the PAL version. Just take the track from the PAL version and stick it on the NTSC disc if you want the full one.