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SamuraiSamus
2005-11-30 05:52:02 pm
Beware: off duty ninja
well if that's the case, fusion just became less random, which is a good thing. a very good thing (will check this lovley discovery out after the question)

I am well aware of how charged shots point blank are good for damage and all, but exactly how much more damage do they casue as opposed to distance shots? is it a case where the swish does an additional charge beam's worth of damage, or does it do something totally different? (trying to fight nitghtmare in a 1% run and I wouldlike to know how the two compare as the strategy I'm using isn't nearly as brave as the "hide under the armpit" strat. . . .not that good at doing a 1% run so I just want to survive and get the gravity suit)
Chanoire
2005-11-30 06:10:51 pm
Okay, I'm a bit confused.  The "random factor" Jagger's referring to is whether the boss door is going to be a vulnerable eye or an invulnerable thing that fires at you.  Sasuke seems to be saying that you can kill it with a point-blank charged beam at just the right time.  Are these two related?  I mean, are Sasuke and DeathNoble saying that it can be killed even when it's not an eye?  If so, vid please.  If not, then knowing when to shoot the eye has nothing to do with the randomness of when it appears.
JaggerG
2005-11-30 07:30:56 pm
Shifty Leader
That M2k2 guy
I can't tell. I tried to explain what was random and Sasuke just said that it's definitely killable if you shoot it point blank. That's been known for years, but they're leading me to believe that it doesn't matter whether it will be a contact lens or an eye as long as you hit it in that time frame, which isn't known.

Somehow I get the feeling that Sasuke has no idea what we're talking about and Deathnoble just assumes he hit it when it was a lens.
SamuraiSamus
2005-11-30 10:42:20 pm
Beware: off duty ninja
well what I think what they're getting at is that the door needs X amount of frames to actually become invunerable if it's a lens and that if you shoot the door with a half open boss door, it will take damage due to what I think saskue_kun and deathnoble are getting at. I've tried to get the door open under said conditions, but a better fusion player than I needs to test this out because I haven't got it to work and I am not the best fusion player out there.
JaggerG
2005-12-01 01:33:14 am
Shifty Leader
That M2k2 guy
There we go. That's what I was thinking he was talking about.

So I guess it's a question of when it decides to grow a lens or not. If it's not replicable and doesn't work every time (or even most of the time), then there's a sign that it's a lens even as it's opening. I don't know what the odds are precisely, but I'd estimate 3:1 favoring the lens.
SamuraiSamus
2005-12-01 02:58:29 am
Beware: off duty ninja
well it's common knowledge that the door decides wether or not to be an eye or lens when one enters the room. . . but wether or not it's actually executable (shooting the door with the theory that the lens needs a set amount of frames in game to actually make the door invunerable) on cart is another story. if the door were vunerable for any set frame or frames, it would seem to me that one would have to rape fusion in order to get the desired result (much like skipping bob IS doable, but only by rape.)
JaggerG
2005-12-01 05:18:00 am
Shifty Leader
That M2k2 guy
Unless of course you pump unrelenting missiles at point blank range until it either dies or shoots back.
LDreamNinja
2005-12-02 05:46:57 am
Question: does the spread from difusion missles cause dammage or just freeze stuff? I know it takes out blocks, but Nintendo claims it causes pain to thy foes. My experince says otherwise.
Sasuke_Kun
(user is banned)
2005-12-02 05:54:18 am
I'm pretty sure the diffusion does no damage, but the actual missile does more damage when charged up. I think.
DeathNoble
2005-12-02 07:39:02 am
Quote from JaggerG:
I can't tell. I tried to explain what was random and Sasuke just said that it's definitely killable if you shoot it point blank. That's been known for years, but they're leading me to believe that it doesn't matter whether it will be a contact lens or an eye as long as you hit it in that time frame, which isn't known.

Somehow I get the feeling that Sasuke has no idea what we're talking about and Deathnoble just assumes he hit it when it was a lens.


I said I haven't been able to pull it off.  I was just making a theory as to why Sess never had to wait for the door.  He always blasted the hell out of it at point-blank range while it was opening.  Either he emulator-raped his 1% run and the door was opening as an eye the first time for him or he was using frame/sprite perfection knowledge to kill the door before it opened all the way.  I just personally believe that the latter is more believable since it didn't seem like he emu-raped anywhere else in his 1% run.

Quote from SamuraiSamus:
well what I think what they're getting at is that the door needs X amount of frames to actually become invunerable if it's a lens and that if you shoot the door with a half open boss door, it will take damage due to what I think saskue_kun and deathnoble are getting at. I've tried to get the door open under said conditions, but a better fusion player than I needs to test this out because I haven't got it to work and I am not the best fusion player out there.


Exactly.

Quote from LDreamNinja:
Question: does the spread from difusion missles cause dammage or just freeze stuff? I know it takes out blocks, but Nintendo claims it causes pain to thy foes. My experince says otherwise.


The spread does, but doesn't cause damage.  You see, it'll instantly freeze any enemy.  So think of things like the Funes (The extending wall creatures) that need more than one Ice Missile to freeze because they have so much health.  The Diffusion's spread will instantly freeze the thing, reducing the enemy's health to whatever low level it needs to be at to get it to freeze.  Therefore, once and after it's frozen, it'll have less health.  However, the Diffusion's spread will not kill anything on its own.  You'll need a beam blast or an actual hit from the Missile itself.

Quote from Sasuke_Kun:
I'm pretty sure the diffusion does no damage, but the actual missile does more damage when charged up. I think.


Nope.  The Diffusion Missile itself is much more powerful than an Ice Missile.  Case and point: those hanging things in sector ARC and in Ridley's part of SRX.  They take two Ice Missiles to kill.  After the Diffusion Missile upgrade, they only take one Missile to kill.  Charging up the diffusion does nothing more than cause the spread.
Dragonfangs
2005-12-02 11:14:49 am
Sess did not rape any part of his run, he simply redid each segment until the eye opened nicely right away.
DeathNoble
2005-12-02 02:06:06 pm
:?  Well then...  *Shuts up*
SamuraiSamus
2005-12-02 05:22:49 pm
Beware: off duty ninja
Quote from Sasuke_Kun:
I'm pretty sure the diffusion does no damage, but the actual missile does more damage when charged up. I think.


as far as I know, the diffusion just adds the screen wide freeze effect. has no power increase to the missle at all. a rather useless powerup, like the seekers from MP2.
Chanoire
2005-12-02 05:59:21 pm
DeathNoble just said otherwise, three posts above yours.  Do you have contradictory findings?
LifeMega
2005-12-02 06:43:21 pm
Through Emu-Raping, I have determined that the door-eye cannot be hurt when it's a lens. In either form, the eye cannot be hurt while opening and closing (there is only one half-open sprite), and when it's a lens, there are no frames when it is fully open and not a lens.

EDIT: Regarding Diffusion Missiles: The purple wall-head guys take two DMs to kill, charged and uncharged, so charging doesn't affect damage. If frozen with the diffusion effect, they still take two missiles to kill, so the diffusion does no damage.
DeathNoble
2005-12-04 12:04:18 pm
I've got video proof that a Diffusion Missile is stronger than an Ice Missile, but...  The videos are in AVI format.  Kinda big.  So I can't find a file hosting site to host 'em...  If I could, I'd post 'em here.

If only I had some file space on M2K2...  :?
Yoshi348
2005-12-04 12:42:55 pm
PAGE BREAKER
Ready and willing.
A charged Diffusion Missle, or just a Diffusion Missle?
DeathNoble
2005-12-04 06:14:19 pm
~Deleted so you never have any hope of knowing what it said, Noble~
SABERinBLUE
2005-12-04 06:16:01 pm
Cook of the Sea
What the hell was that?  Shocked
DeathNoble
2005-12-04 06:18:48 pm
Laughing  Sorry about that there.  I got frustrated because it wouldn't work so I tried every BB Code thingamabobber combination I could think of.  Then I clicked them all to see which one worked.  But I figured out which BB Code thingamabobber (The third combination I tried) worked and I edited the post.  There's only two of the four vids I said there'd be.  Stay tuned for the others.  I'll edit them in once I upload 'em.
nate
2005-12-04 07:34:14 pm
dude. you uploaded raw video. don't do that again. you need to export whatever you record as divx, so either select divx to record with or open it in virtualdub and change the codec to divx, maybe 1024 kbps for 60 fps or 512 kbps for 30 fps or less. compressing the audio wouldn't hurt, either.

here's the sda faq for more.
DeathNoble
2005-12-05 03:27:39 pm
Sorry.  Embarassed  It's gone now; deleted.  Take to long to install all that and compress the vids...  I'll just leave the stuff gone from existence.
kwinse
2005-12-05 03:50:51 pm
At least you had some proof about missile strengths for a short while anyway.
DeathNoble
2005-12-05 04:55:05 pm
soroki
2006-01-05 01:02:27 pm
After defeating Nightmare and claimed the gravity suit, i speed boosted through some blocks and ended up in aqa sector. I flew through more blocks and ended up in an underwater enviroment. with tons of red hatches and stuff. I think i am stuck because i cant boost back through the blocks cuz i cant get enough speed to activate the booster. help!