The "Currently Playing..." Topic

2010-01-06 06:41:12 pm

Quote from TheGreenManalishi:

Funny, I did it first time with the Bunny Hood.

In order to get a heart container out of that chest, you have to do it as Goron Link. Do you just put on the Goron mask right before opening the chest, or...? I've always put it on before even paying the 30 rupees and leaving it on the whole time. I'm gonna kick myself if having it on that long was unnecessary.

As far as the OoT water temple goes, it takes a few playthroughs to memorize exactly where all the keys are and plan an optimal route with a minimum of water level changes. I really love that temple and thought it was brilliantly designed. I do agree that going into the equip submenu everytime you had to change boots was tiresome. Thank goodness they made the iron boots a regular item in later games (WW, TP).

Prime Hunter

2010-01-06 06:58:41 pm

True, the boot thing is one of the other complaints I have with it, although there were a few places I started getting good at dropping in the water at the right place so that by the time Link starts returning to the surface I can slide underneath some of the ceilings that you'd need to do that for. (Specifically that part right before the door where the Boss Key is where you have to pass by that boulder that falls)

It doesn't seem to matter how long it's been since I've played OOT, because I always get turned around in the Water Temple no matter what, and I've played this game for years now so I would think I'd be better at getting through there. I'll give you that, now that I think about the other temples in the game, it is unique for the way the water level is incorporated throughout all of the dungeon's puzzles and rooms. I think part of my anger this time around is partially due to the 3 heart run and having every single enemy become that much more dangerous than normal, simply because I'm still trying to get used to how much damage everything does and attempting to plan my actions based on that. The Tektites for instance never gave me this much trouble before I started this run.

If anything, this run is clearly making me see OOT in a different light than normal, although if that's good or bad I haven't completely figured out yet. Now that I'm coming up on some of my other favorite areas (The Gerudo Desert and Spirit Temple) I can get a better sense of that I hope.

True, the boot thing is one of the other complaints I have with it, although there were a few places I started getting good at dropping in the water at the right place so that by the time Link starts returning to the surface I can slide underneath some of the ceilings that you'd need to do that for. (Specifically that part right before the door where the Boss Key is where you have to pass by that boulder that falls)

It doesn't seem to matter how long it's been since I've played OOT, because I always get turned around in the Water Temple no matter what, and I've played this game for years now so I would think I'd be better at getting through there. I'll give you that, now that I think about the other temples in the game, it is unique for the way the water level is incorporated throughout all of the dungeon's puzzles and rooms. I think part of my anger this time around is partially due to the 3 heart run and having every single enemy become that much more dangerous than normal, simply because I'm still trying to get used to how much damage everything does and attempting to plan my actions based on that. The Tektites for instance never gave me this much trouble before I started this run.

If anything, this run is clearly making me see OOT in a different light than normal, although if that's good or bad I haven't completely figured out yet. Now that I'm coming up on some of my other favorite areas (The Gerudo Desert and Spirit Temple) I can get a better sense of that I hope.

Opium

Edit history:

Opium: 2010-01-06 07:11:43 pm

Opium: 2010-01-06 07:10:35 pm

2010-01-06 07:09:45 pm

Quote from Prime Hunter:

True, the boot thing is one of the other complaints I have with it, although there were a few places I started getting good at dropping in the water at the right place so that by the time Link starts returning to the surface I can slide underneath some of the ceilings that you'd need to do that for. (Specifically that part right before the door where the Boss Key is where you have to pass by that boulder that falls)

I'm gonna have to try that next time.

Quote from Prime Hunter:

It doesn't seem to matter how long it's been since I've played OOT, because I always get turned around in the Water Temple no matter what, and I've played this game for years now so I would think I'd be better at getting through there. I'll give you that, now that I think about the other temples in the game, it is unique for the way the water level is incorporated throughout all of the dungeon's puzzles and rooms. I think part of my anger this time around is partially due to the 3 heart run and having every single enemy become that much more dangerous than normal, simply because I'm still trying to get used to how much damage everything does and attempting to plan my actions based on that. The Tektites for instance never gave me this much trouble before I started this run.

A good rule of thumb for that temple is everytime you feel like you have all the keys you need at any one point, you probably DON'T.
The way they laid it out with the different levels and such really requires comprehensive use of the map. I'm not sure I really studied any of the dungeon maps in previous zelda games the way I did until OoT water temple. The whole concept of the temple is brilliant and really goes beyond the generic 'upgrade ability or get key -> acess new area' formula.
As far as the tektites go, you must be talking about the room with the boulders rolling through the pool that has 6 tektites on it. I just take out my bow and carefully pick them all off before getting my feet wet. It's very frustrating if they hit you in the water and cause you to drift into the vortex, especially when doing so resets the enemies in the room and you don't have any arrows left.

Good luck with the 3 hearts thing. *shudder*

[quote="Prime Hunter"]True, the boot thing is one of the other complaints I have with it, although there were a few places I started getting good at dropping in the water at the right place so that by the time Link starts returning to the surface I can slide underneath some of the ceilings that you'd need to do that for. (Specifically that part right before the door where the Boss Key is where you have to pass by that boulder that falls)[/quote]

I'm gonna have to try that next time.

[quote="Prime Hunter"]It doesn't seem to matter how long it's been since I've played OOT, because I always get turned around in the Water Temple no matter what, and I've played this game for years now so I would think I'd be better at getting through there. I'll give you that, now that I think about the other temples in the game, it is unique for the way the water level is incorporated throughout all of the dungeon's puzzles and rooms. I think part of my anger this time around is partially due to the 3 heart run and having every single enemy become that much more dangerous than normal, simply because I'm still trying to get used to how much damage everything does and attempting to plan my actions based on that. The Tektites for instance never gave me this much trouble before I started this run.[/quote]

A good rule of thumb for that temple is everytime you feel like you have all the keys you need at any one point, you probably DON'T. 
The way they laid it out with the different levels and such really requires comprehensive use of the map.  I'm not sure I really studied any of the dungeon maps in previous zelda games the way I did until OoT water temple.  The whole concept of the temple is brilliant and really goes beyond the generic 'upgrade ability or get key -> acess new area' formula.
As far as the tektites go, you must be talking about the room with the boulders rolling through the pool that has 6 tektites on it.  I just take out my bow and carefully pick them all off before getting my feet wet.  It's very frustrating if they hit you in the water and cause you to drift into the vortex, especially when doing so resets the enemies in the room and you don't have any arrows left.

Good luck with the 3 hearts thing.  *shudder*

Prime Hunter

Edit history:

Prime Hunter: 2010-01-06 07:21:03 pm

Prime Hunter: 2010-01-06 07:20:25 pm

Prime Hunter: 2010-01-06 07:20:03 pm

Prime Hunter: 2010-01-06 07:19:38 pm

2010-01-06 07:19:18 pm

I just mean in general throughout the game. For some reason I keep having difficulties with them, or at least I was. Next time I come across one I'm just going to waste it with arrows and keep going. But yeah, one time in that room I was struggling to get out of range of that vortex in the corner near where you first enter, and they all kept jumping on top of me any time I got back to the surface, so I eventually died because I couldn't go up or down in there.

I think part of my problem at least this time around, again because of my 3 heart run, is that I can't remember if the later dungeons have heart pieces in them or not so I was trying to avoid opening any unnecessary chests and that's likely why I missed the keys each time. Once I was forced to go back and open them I realized that I had to open pretty much all of the chests in there anyway to get to the keys.

You have a point with the Temple's overall concept, but while that in itself is a good change I'll admit, it's the execution of that which I hate the most. I typically don't have problems with backtracking, but whenever I have to constantly do the same task over and over due to one little screw up (IE not having the keys or having the water level not at the right height for one room I need to get into) then it gets on my nerves a bit. And... I just don't like most water levels in games for some reason. I really can't explain it, but 90% of the time that water is involved the level/area usually ends up being one of my least favorite in that game. (Decreased mobility/visibility/item availability, perhaps?)

I just mean in general throughout the game. For some reason I keep having difficulties with them, or at least I was. Next time I come across one I'm just going to waste it with arrows and keep going. But yeah, one time in that room I was struggling to get out of range of that vortex in the corner near where you first enter, and they all kept jumping on top of me any time I got back to the surface, so I eventually died because I couldn't go up or down in there.

I think part of my problem at least this time around, again because of my 3 heart run, is that I can't remember if the later dungeons have heart pieces in them or not so I was trying to avoid opening any unnecessary chests and that's likely why I missed the keys each time. Once I was forced to go back and open them I realized that I had to open pretty much all of the chests in there anyway to get to the keys.

You have a point with the Temple's overall concept, but while that in itself is a good change I'll admit, it's the execution of that which I hate the most. I typically don't have problems with backtracking, but whenever I have to constantly do the same task over and over due to one little screw up (IE not having the keys or having the water level not at the right height for one room I need to get into) then it gets on my nerves a bit. And... I just don't like most water levels in games for some reason. I really can't explain it, but 90% of the time that water is involved the level/area usually ends up being one of my least favorite in that game. (Decreased mobility/visibility/item availability, perhaps?)

arkarian

2010-01-06 09:26:07 pm

red chamber dream

just finished assassin's creed ii. i still think it's a good game, but it got too repetitive partway into venice - i actually think this is because the cities were too large. four huge cities + a few smaller ones were just too much, especially when there's only a few different types of tasks to do (follow someone, kill someone, escort someone). i hear the first game is far worse in this regard, so hey, it could have been worse.
i'm also a huge completionist in sandbox games, so opening all the chests got old too. there's 330 total ... maybe 300 would have been better.

i can't help but compare acii to crackdown, a sandbox game with similarly repetitive tasks that somehow never managed to become tiresome. it had three main areas, none of which were as large as anything in acii, and that served for a better game. acii could have easily lost the entirety of venice and been more fun.

Opium

2010-01-06 09:39:00 pm

What does 'sandbox game' mean?

arkarian

Edit history:

arkarian: 2010-01-06 09:41:04 pm

arkarian: 2010-01-06 09:40:46 pm

2010-01-06 09:40:33 pm

red chamber dream

one of those games where you can run around a large area as much as you want before having to do any quests/tasks. usually the tasks themselves are nonlinear (like in crackdown) but sometimes not (like in assassin's creed ii). think grand theft auto iii and iv.

Poision Envy

2010-01-06 10:34:11 pm

Club 27 Goals

Also prototype, infamous, Fallout 3, and oblivion are good examples that almost everyone has heard of.

Opium

2010-01-06 10:40:31 pm

lol - I haven't played any of those.

Prime Hunter

2010-01-07 01:52:42 am

Yeah, a few other sandbox games I can think of are games like Sim City or the Sims, where you're given a specific set of tools you can use, but then you can do whatever you want with them within the mechanics of the game. No set goals (Or very few) other than the ones you create for yourself.

I just infiltrated the Spirit Temple as adult Link, and it got me wondering about something as I was on my way here: I was thinking at first that you could pretty much do any of the adult temples whenever you wanted, except then I realized that's not the case since there are a few requirements here and there that force you to do the first three before you can get to the Spirit and Shadow temples properly.

You need the Feather Boots (Or whatever they're called) from the Shadow Temple or the Longshot from the Water Temple to get through the first task in the desert, you need the bow to get past that one room in the lower part of the Water Temple with the eye switch, and you need to complete the Forest Temple before you can go back in time for the Lens of Truth. (Needed for both Spirit and Shadow) There could be other things, but those are the big three I can think of right now based on what I've seen this time around. I'm sure speed runs of OOT would've shown me this sooner if I had ever watched them, but still, after I was able to get to the Fire and Water temples right off the bat I started thinking about it and wondering how much customization you could really have in what order you do the temples.

It's funny too, because even though the Spirit Medallion seems to suggest you're supposed to do Spirit before Shadow, not only does the game seem to lean towards doing Shadow first with the scene in Kakariko and giving you access to it (I've never found out what triggers that scene, but I'm thinking you at least need to finish the Forest Temple so you can go back for the Lens), but that's how I've always done it until this time.

Yeah, a few other sandbox games I can think of are games like Sim City or the Sims, where you're given a specific set of tools you can use, but then you can do whatever you want with them within the mechanics of the game. No set goals (Or very few) other than the ones you create for yourself.

I just infiltrated the Spirit Temple as adult Link, and it got me wondering about something as I was on my way here: I was thinking at first that you could pretty much do any of the adult temples whenever you wanted, except then I realized that's not the case since there are a few requirements here and there that force you to do the first three before you can get to the Spirit and Shadow temples properly.

You need the Feather Boots (Or whatever they're called) from the Shadow Temple or the Longshot from the Water Temple to get through the first task in the desert, you need the bow to get past that one room in the lower part of the Water Temple with the eye switch, and you need to complete the Forest Temple before you can go back in time for the Lens of Truth. (Needed for both Spirit and Shadow) There could be other things, but those are the big three I can think of right now based on what I've seen this time around. I'm sure speed runs of OOT would've shown me this sooner if I had ever watched them, but still, after I was able to get to the Fire and Water temples right off the bat I started thinking about it and wondering how much customization you could really have in what order you do the temples.

It's funny too, because even though the Spirit Medallion seems to suggest you're supposed to do Spirit before Shadow, not only does the game seem to lean towards doing Shadow first with the scene in Kakariko and giving you access to it (I've never found out what triggers that scene, but I'm thinking you at least need to finish the Forest Temple so you can go back for the Lens), but that's how I've always done it until this time.

arkarian

Edit history:

arkarian: 2010-01-07 01:57:50 am

2010-01-07 01:56:54 am

red chamber dream

actually, i think you can get to the temples in any order using various sequence breaks, though i don't know many offhand. the shadow temple requires some trickery to get up on the ledge running around the graveyard, then simply walking there in a semi-secret world.
actually completing the temples is trickier though, since you need items from previous ones.

you also don't need to visit any of the temples to finish the game, i believe due to some glitch activating the rainbow bridge.

Prime Hunter

Edit history:

Prime Hunter: 2010-01-07 02:07:45 am

2010-01-07 02:07:24 am

Well yeah, I'm sure that with Sequence Breaking you'd be able to go wherever you wanted just fine, but I'm taking about normal means. Although, I'm not sure why I'm completely against that seeing as I joined this site for that purpose with Metroid... Oh well...

Anyway, forgot to mention that the Iron Knuckle gave me less trouble than the path leading up to him, interestingly enough. I only died twice to him, both times because I was just stupid. Stood right in the way of his overhead strike, and then the second time I jumped forward to attack him as he was in the middle of the backswing of his sideways attack. Also ended up dying a few times in the desert due to those spinning things that pop out of the sand, plus the Stafos got me once in the young Link section, and then I had another death or two from the other baddies. Yeah... I've been having terrible luck suddenly against what should be semi-easy fights by now for me, or just in general.

tomatobob

2010-01-07 02:24:58 am

One shall stand, one shall ball.

Quote from Prime Hunter:

(I've never found out what triggers that scene, but I'm thinking you at least need to finish the Forest Temple so you can go back for the Lens), but that's how I've always done it until this time.

I'm pretty sure you have to clear the Forest, Fire, and Water Temples to trigger that scene, I know just beating Forest and Water or Forest and Fire won't do it. Pretty annoying since I don't like playing any of those three anymore and would much rather skip to the last two, OOT sequence breaking is way out of my league. :/ The best I can manage is the Goron Damage Boost thing and some incredibly picky Hookshot use to get up to Ikana proper in MM.

arkarian

2010-01-07 02:34:12 am

red chamber dream

Quote from Prime Hunter:

Well yeah, I'm sure that with Sequence Breaking you'd be able to go wherever you wanted just fine, but I'm taking about normal means.

i've realized that whenever someone says that i should just bow out.

Prime Hunter

Edit history:

Prime Hunter: 2010-01-07 02:59:53 am

2010-01-07 02:55:57 am

I mainly said that because I haven't tried to SB anything outside of Metroid before, so not only do I have a very limited experience of what you can do in OOT, but I've never even attempted any of the ones I've vaguely heard about. Besides, I'd rather not do more than one new thing at a time here. (Speaking of 3 Hearts)

So the next time I play I'll be starting the Shadow Temple. Twinrova gave me no trouble at all, and I only died against Nabooru since I was stupid again and replayed the same exact mistake I made earlier of simply standing there to take the overhead attack. Yeah, I know the series has used the Fire/Ice boss combo a few times now since Twinrova, but I still love all three of the ones I can think of anyway. (Same with the Ganon-energy-ball-tennis-matches.)

And actually, for the most part the 3 Heart challenge isn't as tough as I thought it would be. Sure, I'm dying a lot more than I'd like, but that's mostly me making stupid mistakes or underestimating the power of certain attacks and enemies. Most of my troubles are coming from the mini-bosses and bosses anyway, which is just like what happens to me with Metroid low% runs most of the time.

But I'm still wary of the Ganondorf battles regardless of this, since I know I'm going to have to dodge practically everything he does in both forms in order to survive.

I mainly said that because I haven't tried to SB anything outside of Metroid before, so not only do I have a very limited experience of what you can do in OOT, but I've never even attempted any of the ones I've vaguely heard about. Besides, I'd rather not do more than one new thing at a time here. (Speaking of 3 Hearts)

So the next time I play I'll be starting the Shadow Temple. Twinrova gave me no trouble at all, and I only died against Nabooru since I was stupid again and replayed the same exact mistake I made earlier of simply standing there to take the overhead attack. Yeah, I know the series has used the Fire/Ice boss combo a few times now since Twinrova, but I still love all three of the ones I can think of anyway. (Same with the Ganon-energy-ball-tennis-matches.)

And actually, for the most part the 3 Heart challenge isn't as tough as I thought it would be. Sure, I'm dying a lot more than I'd like, but that's mostly me making stupid mistakes or underestimating the power of certain attacks and enemies. Most of my troubles are coming from the mini-bosses and bosses anyway, which is just like what happens to me with Metroid low% runs most of the time.

But I'm still wary of the Ganondorf battles regardless of this, since I know I'm going to have to dodge practically everything he does in both forms in order to survive.

nn12000

2010-01-07 03:58:31 am

Mister ...

OoT, in my opinion, has the best Fire/Ice boss in the series, and I was very disappointed that they didn't do the same thing with the mirror shield ever again. Twinrova is easily my favorite bit of OoT, and I have actually played the game a couple times just to replay that fight alone.

tomatobob

Edit history:

tomatobob: 2010-01-07 07:26:59 am

tomatobob: 2010-01-07 07:24:41 am

2010-01-07 07:23:21 am

One shall stand, one shall ball.

I've started level hopping in Half-Life 2 since I recently got it back after my sister lent it out to a friend. I should be finishing up Episode 2 but I'm just not looking forward to the Antlion tunnels as the Guardian bit just looks annoying. So I've been slowly gearing up for that with regular old Half-Life 2. Went through the first two chapters then jumped straight to Water Hazard halfway through Route Kanal, I know nobody likes Water Hazard but I do. The parts where you're shooting dudes are fun and I don't hate the airboat. Then skipped past Ravenholm because I just really didn't feel like dealing with all those Fast Zombies and went on to Highway 17 and then the first part of Sand Traps. Something about just driving along from shantytown to shantytown clearing Overwatch from each building as you go is really fun to me.

The pacing is really good, a quick shootout then some nice calm driving along the coast, then action again, then more driving, then "Hell yes, I got me a goddamn rocket launcher!" and crane shenanigans, then more relaxation followed by crawling around the support structure of a railway bridge. I love that bridge. The atmosphere is incredible and it only gets better once the action kicks in. Also I totally pinned that sniper to a small support beam for the overhang he was standing under by his neck. He got into some weird position that left him in some kind of seizure for a couple minutes before he finally found a resting position the game found acceptable. The crossbow is hilarious and every game needs to give you a weapon or object that allows you to stick people to things.

Half-Life 2: Still amazing.

I've started level hopping in Half-Life 2 since I recently got it back after my sister lent it out to a friend. I should be finishing up Episode 2 but I'm just not looking forward to the Antlion tunnels as the Guardian bit just looks annoying. So I've been slowly gearing up for that with regular old Half-Life 2. Went through the first two chapters then jumped straight to Water Hazard halfway through Route Kanal, I know nobody likes Water Hazard but I do. The parts where you're shooting dudes are fun and I don't hate the airboat. Then skipped past Ravenholm because I just really didn't feel like dealing with all those Fast Zombies and went on to Highway 17 and then the first part of Sand Traps. Something about just driving along from shantytown to shantytown clearing Overwatch from each building as you go is really fun to me.

The pacing is really good, a quick shootout then some nice calm driving along the coast, then action again, then more driving, then "[i]Hell[/i] yes, I got me a goddamn rocket launcher!" and crane shenanigans, then more relaxation followed by crawling around the support structure of a railway bridge. I love that bridge. The atmosphere is incredible and it only gets better once the action kicks in. Also I totally pinned that sniper to a small support beam for the overhang he was standing under by his neck. He got into some weird position that left him in some kind of seizure for a couple minutes before he finally found a resting position the game found acceptable. The crossbow is hilarious and every game needs to give you a weapon or object that allows you to stick people to things.

Half-Life 2: Still amazing.

TheGreenManalishi

2010-01-07 07:37:28 am

I liked Water Hazard too. I've never got past Ravenholm, and I can't skip it on PS3, which is almost a good thing, because when pigs freeze over and hell can fly I'll probably try to complete the game.

Da Dood

2010-01-07 09:01:43 am

Dood Trigger™

I will be playing Bayonetta in... 8 hours. Can't freaking wait!

arkarian

2010-01-07 02:10:22 pm

red chamber dream

how do you play water hazard but skip ravenholm? blasphemy.

Prime Hunter

2010-01-07 03:22:07 pm

I've played HL2 enough at this point that Ravenholm doesn't have the same sort of feeling anymore, so it's not anywhere near as bad as that first time I went through it. And I like Water Hazard and Highway 17, personally, although I'd take the car over the boat any day. I have some great memories of my first time through with the car and getting to a place that you need to do something in order to open up the road to proceed. Rather than do what you're supposed to by lowering the gate/whatever it is, I spent a good few minutes lifting the car up and over the wall to the left and proceeding that way.

I love the gravity gun for being able to do great stuff like that. I end up using that as my main weapon in a lot of situations.

Da Dood

2010-01-07 04:49:56 pm

Dood Trigger™

Looks like now I may choose to open the box or not, but I just don't know...

*puts on sunglasses*

... witch.

YEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEAAAAH~

tomatobob

2010-01-07 04:56:06 pm

One shall stand, one shall ball.

Quote from arkarian:

how do you play water hazard but skip ravenholm? blasphemy.

Fast Zombies annoy me that much. There are three or so at the very beginning of Sandtraps but they weren't moving as quickly as I remember, still had one of the Headcrabs pop off and start annoying me though. Usually all of them do it so that's something. Still can't hit Fast Headcrabs to save my life.

Quote from Prime Hunter:

I have some great memories of my first time through with the car and getting to a place that you need to do something in order to open up the road to proceed. Rather than do what you're supposed to by lowering the gate/whatever it is, I spent a good few minutes lifting the car up and over the wall to the left and proceeding that way.

This is the only true way to get through that area, finding the batteries to raise the gate is for babies and women.

Opium

2010-01-07 05:07:44 pm

I need a little break from MM. Can't decide to do a run of RoS, Fusion, or ZM.

arkarian

2010-01-07 05:37:35 pm

red chamber dream

Quote from tomatobob:

This is the only true way to get through that area, finding the batteries to raise the gate is for babies and women

think i tried that my first time through but eventually gave up and got the batteries. i'm not very cool.