Pal/Ntsc

2005-04-22 05:07:50 am

Hello

A friend tells me that the time from Ntsc and Pal is a differnet.

He means that the Pal time :6x5 equals the ntsc time.

Is that true?

If it is, that means that a pal 42 min Run equals 36min in the ntsc time.

Are there also some ntsc/pal changes?

I only know about the Norfair room with the lava. the faster morphball and that the teleport beam doesnt work at pal.

Thx for answers

NecroWeapon

Thread title:

Red Scarlet

2005-04-22 06:01:11 am

I('d) like to watch (some MP3 runs)

I don't know about the time, but some of the different stuff I've heard about are the ability to roll over the noob bridge and to early Supers due to the game speed changed, PB66 in a NBMB is mindless to get, and you can easily pull off a spark charge in Draygon's room.

Going by PM's I've gotten, it seems the quick charge is harder to pull off, but I wouldn't know.

If some more knowledgable people (kej) see this topic, I'm sure that he can give more examples.

Frozen Mr. Toastbrot

2005-04-22 08:32:50 am

Older PAL games usually run about 17% slower than NTSC games, because of the different TV standards (50Hz PAL vs 60Hz NTSC) and a sloppy conversion. I can't tell for sure if that's the case with SM though, since I don't own either PAL or NTSC versions of the game, but it is possible.

Kejardon

2005-04-22 11:13:45 am

Embarrasing Fact: Power suit made by lowest bidder

Actually, Samus is sped up to account for the speed change. Thus it is possible (but requires a decent bit of luck) to simply roll across the bridge for early super missiles. I'm not sure what else is sped up and what isn't.

Also, every 50 frames counts as a second instead of every 60 frames.

I don't really know about the net result of time differences. From just glancing at the changes I know of, I'd say the times would be the same, but the game is much more complex than that. There's a ton to test, and I'm just not interested in testing it at all.

XtraX

2005-04-23 04:58:10 am

*reads topic*

...

well...it is possible to just roll over the n00b bridge on Pal.(should work on the early Super-bridge,too),because the crumble blocks need longer to disappear( I think).

It is possible to escape Torizos room on Pal.

You afaik jump a few frames higher in Pal( maybe only in water w/o gravity suit, I don't know). That's afaik the reason why evil 66 is easier to get on Pal.

I don't think it's easier to get a shinespark in Draygon's room. I'm not sure though and I can't test it..

And what do you mean with the "teleport beam"? The Spaz/Plasma glitch does work on Pal, the Reset glitch does work,too.

Kejardon

2005-04-23 02:28:43 pm

Embarrasing Fact: Power suit made by lowest bidder

You *can* roll over the bridge to early super missiles. I've seen it and done it a few times. Crumble blocks take the same amount of time to crumble (if you're counting frames) but Samus moves faster. If you're counting time relative to the player, Samus moves at the same speed, but the crumble blocks take a bit longer to break.
Mathematically, it shouldn't be possible to roll over either bridge as far as I can see. I honestly don't know why it's possible and happens. Also with NTSC, mathematically it shouldn't be possible to roll past three crumble blocks at once, but I've done it once.
Just something random that bugs me and I can't explain. ::shrug::

Crouch-jumps are a bit higher in PAL.

It's decently easy to get a quick-charge in Draygon's room in PAL. In NTSC it's nearly impossible. I've done it in both.

nate

2005-04-23 04:35:50 pm

Quote from Kejardon:

I can't explain.

i have lost my faith in god! ;_;

Red Scarlet

2005-04-23 05:00:17 pm

I('d) like to watch (some MP3 runs)

At samus.co.uk, there were a couple of posts with pics and explanations about not fighting the bomb Torizo..let me try to dig up what they said. Hm, not seeing it. No idea if it's doable. Would have to ask PALer's to try it out.

Kejardon

2005-04-23 06:10:12 pm

Embarrasing Fact: Power suit made by lowest bidder

It's possible, I think, but I think it requires a glitch that allows you to move up to one pixel-per-frame faster on the ground, and pretty much perfect timing. I haven't tested escaping on PAL personally though.
It still hasn't been done on NTSC without codes, though.

Someone put up a movie a while back, showing off the glitch. It's in NTSC, so it doesn't have the Torizo skip, but it shows a bunch of other tricks with it.
http://dehacked.2y.net/microstorage.php/info/23/MF_metroid3.smv
Needs the latest version of snes9x, I think.

Ryan Ferneau

2005-04-23 09:08:04 pm

Yeah, Michael Flatley's working on a 100% run for SNES9x, and I think that's the movie you linked to. I asked him to test the PAL version after reading about the room skip in another topic, and he confirmed that it was possible to skip the fight in the bomb room in the PAL version because the door closes a little later. But the PAL timing may not help his speed overall anyway because it offers less control of Samus, having only 5/6ths as many frames of input. I imagine a lot of NTSC-to-PAL game conversions compensate for the speed difference by boosting the character ahead an extra pixel every five frames or so. It doesn't always turn out perfect.

NecroWeapon

2005-04-25 01:16:28 pm

@ XtraX

with teleport beam I mean the Beam that teleports you to the Countdown (Cebes Explosion). That doesnt work on Pal

And how can you escape from Toizos room?

JaggerG

2005-04-25 04:14:08 pm

Shifty Leader

That M2k2 guy

Quickly.

Roxinos

2005-04-25 08:36:53 pm

I don't know how...but my brother said he got out of the Torizo's room before the door closed...I don't remember if he was talking about on the console or on the emu...but I guess it would be possible...at the time I was just thinking "bullshit"...

NecroWeapon

2005-05-05 07:45:28 am

No, Its like there is a point and when you walk over this point (or jump, shinespark, etc.) the door will close automatic. You only can get out if you reset the game and go with bombs to torizo, cuz the door then closes in 2 seconds but you dont need to take the bombs.

Kejardon

2005-05-05 02:44:48 pm

Embarrasing Fact: Power suit made by lowest bidder

No. The game detects whether or not Samus has the bombs in her equipment (not if she has them equipped, nor if they're still available to be picked up). If she does, a timer starts for the door, and at the end it closes, and the Torizo gets up soon after.

The only way the room has been escaped in NTSC was by Kagerato, using codes to get Blue Suit and no bombs. Then, probably from standing on top of the Torizo, Kagerato charged a super jump, grabbed the bombs, then super jumped out the door.

NecroWeapon

2005-05-16 11:41:51 am

@ Kejardon

Thx 4 the exact explanation, cuz I dont know this.

TixFrix

2005-05-20 06:30:27 pm

The ultra jump is different unless there is something that makes you go "higher" with it. Might be cuz that PAL has 625 lines and NTSC has 525. So you gain less hight using it. Like when standing on the ship sparking towards the power bombs you'll hit the alcove instead. And in Maridia 4th room (up right up from the tunnel) you cant just make a normal ultra jump to exit with the door on top right of the room. You will need to do a special trick that Graveworm made up in order to get to the door.

Besides that I havent noticed anything except that the game feels like it runs slower when you watch the speedruns made. Cant even get near the times in those.