OMG! I mean, this is so wrong in so many levels... INSANE!!!

2004-12-06 12:49:56 am

all html tags are disabled by default for security reasons. i have to enable them individually, and i have only enabled select few useful ones.

SABERinBLUE

2004-12-06 02:47:03 am

Cook of the Sea

Quote from njahnke:

all html tags are disabled by default for security reasons. i have to enable them individually, and i have only enabled select few useful ones.

Ah, okay then.

Fusioneer

2004-12-12 01:23:55 pm

tht guy is pretie very much grandos very ultimate good i cant try to do that :S

Seiken Enhasa

2004-12-12 05:44:22 pm

Personally, I like this video more:

http://jo2.rocket3.net/umezono(ch)_vs_880(hu).wmv

Hugo vs. Chun-Li. In the second round, the Hugo player is down to a sliver of life, and the Chun player uses her super to try and chip him to death. So what does the Hugo player do? He parries half of Chun Li's super, then uses his Gigas Breaker super before she can finish. The motion for Gigas Breaker is a 720 degree spin of the joystick + punch, by the way.

Purple Lizard

2004-12-14 11:20:30 am

Quote from zell99:

I read that on another board I visit, it explains a bit how parrying works:

"I'm quite into 3rd Strike, and yes, that video is amazing. Daigo (the Ken player) is one of the best players in the world, and Justin Wong (the Chun player) is the American player who made it to the semi-finals against him at Evolution 2004, a big fighting game tournament held in the States.

If you watched the whole match, which I have, you'll know that Daigo was just playing around with Justin for the whole match. Frequently, he would taunt after doing basic moves and take the damage, just to show how superior he is at the game. So, it's a "comeback", yeah, but only because Daigo decided to end it dramatically by LETTING Justin hit him down to that much health, and taunting Justin by giving him the ability to do his super, which he then parried (something that's very hard to do, but somewhat standard in the 3rd Strike community in hardcoreness). Parrying, btw, is hitting forward on the joystick the very instant a hit connects, and you take no chip damage and actually build up some of your super meter. Chun's super hits 17 times, I believe, so Daigo hit forward on the joystick 17 times in a row, all within 0.03 seconds of the "perfect" time (I believe), and then linked to his super to end the match.

Justin is an amazing player, of course... but he's no match for many of the Japanese players. And Daigo showed it there."

I would just like to clear up that Daigo does not taunt to show his superiority. It's an actual game mechanic where taunting increases your stats. Some characters, like Hugo, gain defensive buffs from taunting (limit 3). Likewise, with Ken, he gains an offensive boost. I'd also like to say that Daigo didn't LET Justin do anything. Tournament mentality tends to be "do what it takes to win". Justin's style is to turtle, and play safe, and not take chances. Fact is, both players were there to win. Justin pulled off the super at the end because the odds of parrying all of it is VERY low, and him winning by chip damage was highly probable. Daigo didn't have a choice but to try to parry it all, else he would be put down 0-1 in the semis. Was not to be dramatic or anything... he was down, and he didn't want to lose. Plain and simple. 'Twas a last ditch effort that paid off bigtime.

Just some thoughts from someone who used to avidly compete in fighting game tourneys and has played 3rd strike for far too many hours through college... Rolling Eyes

[quote="zell99"]I read that on another board I visit, it explains a bit how parrying works:

"I'm quite into 3rd Strike, and yes, that video is amazing. Daigo (the Ken player) is one of the best players in the world, and Justin Wong (the Chun player) is the American player who made it to the semi-finals against him at Evolution 2004, a big fighting game tournament held in the States.

If you watched the whole match, which I have, you'll know that Daigo was just playing around with Justin for the whole match. Frequently, he would taunt after doing basic moves and take the damage, just to show how superior he is at the game. So, it's a "comeback", yeah, but only because Daigo decided to end it dramatically by LETTING Justin hit him down to that much health, and taunting Justin by giving him the ability to do his super, which he then parried (something that's very hard to do, but somewhat standard in the 3rd Strike community in hardcoreness). Parrying, btw, is hitting forward on the joystick the very instant a hit connects, and you take no chip damage and actually build up some of your super meter. Chun's super hits 17 times, I believe, so Daigo hit forward on the joystick 17 times in a row, all within 0.03 seconds of the "perfect" time (I believe), and then linked to his super to end the match.

Justin is an amazing player, of course... but he's no match for many of the Japanese players. And Daigo showed it there."[/quote]

I would just like to clear up that Daigo does not taunt to show his superiority.  It's an actual game mechanic where taunting increases your stats.  Some characters, like Hugo, gain defensive buffs from taunting (limit 3).  Likewise, with Ken, he gains an offensive boost.  I'd also like to say that Daigo didn't LET Justin do anything.  Tournament mentality tends to be "do what it takes to win".  Justin's style is to turtle, and play safe, and not take chances.  Fact is, both players were there to win.  Justin pulled off the super at the end because the odds of parrying all of it is VERY low, and him winning by chip damage was highly probable.  Daigo didn't have a choice but to try to parry it all, else he would be put down 0-1 in the semis.  Was not to be dramatic or anything... he was down, and he didn't want to lose.  Plain and simple.  'Twas a last ditch effort that paid off bigtime.

Just some thoughts from someone who used to avidly compete in fighting game tourneys and has played 3rd strike for far too many hours through college... :roll:

DominicanZero

2004-12-14 03:33:00 pm

直死の魔眼使い

How can you tell me Daigo wasn't purposedly humilliating Justin when he actually parried the LAST HIT, which he could have perfectly dodged by just ducking? :P That's publicly humilliating someone, man. :D He could have ducked that last kick, but no, he jumped and instead parried the hit, then linked it with his own combo and finished him off with his Shippu Jinrai Kyaku. I mean, come the hell on, dude. :P

Seiken Enhasa

2004-12-14 04:52:45 pm

I think there was a possibility that his combo might not have been able to knock out Chun if he didn't tack on that extra hit in the air, actually.

Yeah, I think the guy who wrote that post was seriously overestimating Daigo as well as underestimating Justin. Sure, Daigo's pretty freakin' good, but I don't think he's quite at the level of godliness where he'd be able to toy around with one of the best Third Strike players in America.

Toozin

2004-12-14 06:44:10 pm

Not impossible

just highly unlikely

Holy crap, a zell sighting! The guy is more elusive than bigfoot.

Purple Lizard

2004-12-14 11:43:16 pm

Quote from DominicanZero:

How can you tell me Daigo wasn't purposedly humilliating Justin when he actually parried the LAST HIT, which he could have perfectly dodged by just ducking? :P That's publicly humilliating someone, man. :D He could have ducked that last kick, but no, he jumped and instead parried the hit, then linked it with his own combo and finished him off with his Shippu Jinrai Kyaku. I mean, come the hell on, dude. :P

I'm not taking away anything from him... that super is already hard enough to parry when you KNOW it's coming in practice mode, let alone during stressful tournament pressure. But to say that he planned the whole thing is not only taking away from Justin, but from Daigo as well. If he did that against some random scrub in the early rounds, I can understand if he set it up, but this was the semifinals, and he was playing one of the top ranked players in the US... one who, earlier in the tournament, had already beaten on of Japan's finest with his extremely safe "turtle" style. Justin is a smart player, is one of the best 3rd Strike players, and THE best MvC2 player in the world. Having played in many tourneys and having the chance to be around many great players, I'll say this: tournament pressure, especially in later rounds, is brutal and nerve-racking. No matter how good you are, when you're in the semi-finals, against a top-ranked player, you're NOT gonna purposely put yourself down just to showboat. In a tournament, you do what it takes to WIN.

Watch the vid again... he had NO health left. ANY chip damage would have put him down 0-1, which is not exactly an optimal position to be in during the semis. He had no choice but to try to parry everything. In addition, the last hit of Chun Li's super hits mid, so even if he had crouched, he's still be forced to block it, which WOULD have killed him. Also, Seiken is right... a standard ground combo ending with super would not have been enough to finish off Justin (just tested every basic ground combo variation... the most damaging still leaves a small portion of life). Basically, it was a last ditch gamble, one that he had no choice but to attempt, and it just so happens that this time, his skill and experienced prevailed, and he won big. Had the same exact situation happened again, I'd still bet on Justin. Anyone who has played 3rd Strike extensively would know the sheer difficulty of that feat.

Anyways, was this an incredibly hardcore feat? Yes. Is he very skillful? Yes. But like I said, I highly doubt that he was thinking, "Man, I've got to humiliate this punk!" Moreso, "Ok, I've travelled thousands of miles across the Pacific... I do NOT want to lose now, and I do NOT want to go home empty-handed."

[quote="DominicanZero"]How can you tell me Daigo wasn't purposedly humilliating Justin when he actually parried the [b]LAST HIT[/b], which he could have perfectly dodged by just ducking? :P That's publicly humilliating someone, man. :D He could have ducked that last kick, but no, he [b]jumped[/b] and instead [b]parried the hit[/b], then linked it with his own combo and finished him off with his Shippu Jinrai Kyaku. I mean, come the hell on, dude. :P[/quote]

I'm not taking away anything from him... that super is already hard enough to parry when you KNOW it's coming in [i]practice mode[/i], let alone during stressful tournament pressure.  But to say that he planned the whole thing is not only taking away from Justin, but from Daigo as well.  If he did that against some random scrub in the early rounds, I can understand if he set it up, but this was the semifinals, and he was playing one of the top ranked players in the US... one who, earlier in the tournament, had already beaten on of Japan's finest with his extremely safe "turtle" style.   Justin is a smart player, is one of the best 3rd Strike players, and THE best MvC2 player in the world.  Having played in many tourneys and having the chance to be around many great players, I'll say this:  tournament pressure, especially in later rounds, is brutal and nerve-racking.   No matter how good you are, when you're in the semi-finals, against a top-ranked player, you're NOT gonna purposely put yourself down just to showboat.  In a tournament, you do what it takes to WIN.

Watch the vid again... he had NO health left.  ANY chip damage would have put him down 0-1, which is not exactly an optimal position to be in during the semis.  He had no choice but to try to parry everything.  In addition, the last hit of Chun Li's super hits mid, so even if he had crouched, he's still be forced to block it, which WOULD have killed him.  Also, Seiken is right... a standard ground combo ending with super would not have been enough to finish off Justin (just tested every basic ground combo variation... the most damaging still leaves a small portion of life).   Basically, it was a last ditch gamble, one that he had no choice but to attempt, and it just so happens that this time, his skill and experienced prevailed, and he won big.  Had the same exact situation happened again, I'd still bet on Justin.  Anyone who has played 3rd Strike extensively would know the sheer difficulty of that feat.

Anyways, was this an incredibly hardcore feat?  Yes.  Is he very skillful?  Yes.  But like I said, I highly doubt that he was thinking, "Man, I've got to humiliate this punk!"  Moreso, "Ok, I've travelled thousands of miles across the Pacific... I do NOT want to lose now, and I do NOT want to go home empty-handed."

SABERinBLUE

2004-12-15 02:18:52 am

Cook of the Sea

Quote from Seiken Enhasa:

Personally, I like this video more:

http://jo2.rocket3.net/umezono(ch)_vs_880(hu).wmv

Hugo vs. Chun-Li. In the second round, the Hugo player is down to a sliver of life, and the Chun player uses her super to try and chip him to death. So what does the Hugo player do? He parries half of Chun Li's super, then uses his Gigas Breaker super before she can finish. The motion for Gigas Breaker is a 720 degree spin of the joystick + punch, by the way.

The combo was harder to pull off, then, but is the parrying actually more difficult with Hugo? I mean, it looks that way because of his bulk, but is it equal for every character, or what?

Seiken Enhasa

2004-12-15 03:06:42 am

No, it's not any harder to parry with Hugo, but he only had a fraction of a second to input the motion for Gigas Breaker before Chun's super continued. He could have just parried her entire super then used Gigas Breaker afterwards, which I think would've been much easier, but since it was a casual match he went for the risky (but also flashy and very entertaining) mid-parry Gigas Breaker. It's pretty hard to do a 720 motion in such a short span of time...

Purple Lizard

2004-12-15 10:27:16 pm

Quote from Seiken Enhasa:

No, it's not any harder to parry with Hugo, but he only had a fraction of a second to input the motion for Gigas Breaker before Chun's super continued. He could have just parried her entire super then used Gigas Breaker afterwards, which I think would've been much easier, but since it was a casual match he went for the risky (but also flashy and very entertaining) mid-parry Gigas Breaker. It's pretty hard to do a 720 motion in such a short span of time...

Well, technically, it IS harder to parry with Hugo than Ken. Certain characters only have to parry Chun's super in sets of 7 (7/7/1), while others have to parry them in sets of 8 (8/8/1). Hugo is one of those that has to parry a sets of 8.

And... it's really not that hard to pull a gigas breaker after a parry Rolling Eyes

Actually, I just tried it for the first time tonight and was getting them consistently after about 2-3 minutes. The parry animation actually gives you a lot more time than you realize to buffer in the 720. Actually, you don't even have to do a true 720. The game mechanics registers a 360 as a series of six consecutive points, to give the player some leeway. That means in the case of a 720, you really only have to do a 540.

Ex.
Note, I'll be using numpad notation, so if you're facing right, 6 means forward, 2 is crouching, 8 is jumping, etc.

Parry with 6, and during the parry animation, input 6321478963214 + Punch. Gigas breaker will come out immediately. This, of course, leads to all kinds of buffers, such as 666321478963214 + Punch (dash forward, gigas breaker), 4,4123698741236 + Punch (block, GB), etc.

Basically, a fundamental staple of playing Hugo is learning how to buffer his special throws so that it becomes reflexive to do it in any situation (block, parry, dash, whatever), without pulling a jump by accident. The real difficult part is parrying Chun Li's damn super...

[quote="Seiken Enhasa"]No, it's not any harder to parry with Hugo, but he only had a fraction of a second to input the motion for Gigas Breaker before Chun's super continued. He could have just parried her entire super then used Gigas Breaker afterwards, which I think would've been much easier, but since it was a casual match he went for the risky (but also flashy and very entertaining) mid-parry Gigas Breaker. It's pretty hard to do a 720 motion in such a short span of time...[/quote]

Well, technically, it IS harder to parry with Hugo than Ken.  Certain characters only have to parry Chun's super in sets of 7 (7/7/1), while others have to parry them in sets of 8 (8/8/1).  Hugo is one of those that has to parry a sets of 8.

And... it's really not that hard to pull a gigas breaker after a parry  :roll:  Actually, I just tried it for the first time tonight and was getting them consistently after about 2-3 minutes.  The parry animation actually gives you a lot more time than you realize to buffer in the 720.  Actually, you don't even have to do a true 720.  The game mechanics registers a 360 as a series of [i]six[/i] consecutive points, to give the player some leeway.  That means in the case of a 720, you really only have to do a 540.

Ex.  
Note, I'll be using numpad notation, so if you're facing right, 6 means forward, 2 is crouching, 8 is jumping, etc.

Parry with 6, and during the parry animation, input 6321478963214 + Punch.  Gigas breaker will come out immediately.  This, of course, leads to all kinds of buffers, such as 666321478963214 + Punch (dash forward, gigas breaker), 4,4123698741236 + Punch (block, GB), etc.

Basically, a fundamental staple of playing Hugo is learning how to buffer his special throws so that it becomes reflexive to do it in any situation (block, parry, dash, whatever), without pulling a jump by accident.  The real difficult part is parrying Chun Li's damn super...

Red Scarlet

2004-12-15 10:31:11 pm

I('d) like to watch (some MP3 runs)

If SF3's controls are like SF2's, then Purple Lizard is right; all it takes to do a Spinning Pile driver is >, <, ^ (or <, >, ^ if you prefer) + punch.

Purple Lizard

2004-12-15 10:57:29 pm

Yep, they are indeed the same (you can do the 540 buffers I outlined above with Super Turbo 'gief), except SF3 is a tad bit more forgivable with their inputs, and gives you slightly more buffer time.

Red Scarlet

2004-12-15 11:20:55 pm

I('d) like to watch (some MP3 runs)

Ok, cause I didn't play SF3 much; I had 2nd Impact for a couple weeks, then got bored of using just Dudley.

I have 3rd Strike somewhere, but it didn't catch me either. But watching matches for the game puts me in awe.

Purple Lizard

2004-12-15 11:53:00 pm

Well, Scarlet, if you're interested (or anyone else, for that matter), here's some matches from the first time Japan came over the the US during an Evolution event and played our two best 3S players(2002, if I remember correctly).

Match 1:
mason.gmu.edu/~htrinh1/11.tokido_vs_justin.wmv

Tokido is Urien, Justin is Chun Li. Justin tries to do his "turtle and build super" style. Tokido lets him build super, and builds his own gauge. Then... well, bad things happen.

Match 2:
mason.gmu.edu/~htrinh1/20.ohnuki_vs_alex.wmv

Ohnuki is Chun Li, Alex is Ryu. Ohnuki basically shows Alex that top-tier Chun Li involves more than turtling and building super.

Match 3:
mason.gmu.edu/~htrinh1/21.mester_vs_justin.wmv

Mester is Yun. Doesn't it almost look like a combo video?

Match 4:
mason.gmu.edu/~htrinh1/25.mester_vs_alex.wmv

Mester is Yun again. This is just a straight beatdown.

Enjoy :D

Red Scarlet

2004-12-16 12:56:04 am

I('d) like to watch (some MP3 runs)

Nice, I'll watch all those in a min.

Wow, getting Perfected at a tournament would be a big ego smasher.

Seiken Enhasa

2004-12-16 01:35:49 am

That's rather interesting about the 720 really being a 540...kind of strange, too. Bah, I suck at motions like that. Most of the fighting games I play don't have very difficult motions.

I'm gonna check out those videos right now.

Edit: Hah, they're all straight beatdown. :P I like the first one in particular, since I haven't seen too many videos with good Urien players before. Plus, that mutual super building at the beginning was freakin' hilarious.