Odima16's Challenges and...Trivia or something

Edit history:

Odima16: 2009-01-18 05:27:00 pm

2009-01-03 08:33:14 pm

"C'mon, Luigi!"

These are challenges and some little (useless) gameplay facts for ZM. In my opinion, things like this keep ZM interesting, in case you don’t have any other portable games to play and/or you’ve played ZM to death (like me aiwebs_027

). I apologize if people have already found some of these; I found them all from just playing the game. Also, if anyone finds more challenges/trivia, I’d love to hear them. grin new

I’ll update the list in case I find out about any more.

I know most of the challenges involve Shinesparking, but shinesparking just has so much potential! Also, don’t ask me why I decided to start shinesparking random Chozo Statues, because I honestly don’t know the answer laugh new

CHALLENGES:
[No matter how impossible you may think these are to do, I've done all (except one) of them - and on the US cartridge.]

So far, I’ve found 7 Chozo Statues that can be shinesparked into. Can you find and shinespark those 7? Let me know when you’ve found and/or shinesparked one. (Hint: the most obvious one is in Kraid! )
Get to the Brinstar side of the Brinstar-to-Norfair elevator with a shinespark charge (no Power Bombs)
Kill the Imago Cocoon without the High Jump Boots and without touching the walls or the ripper
Shinespark up the long, "secret" Eastern shaft in Norfair
Shinespark an Imago Larva (once from the left, once from the right. It doesn’t do anything lol)
Get the lowest Energy Tank in Chozodia without dropping down into the vertical shaft below it
Get across the lava-filled room that’s to the right of the Ice Beam room without going in the lava or even touching any of the green platforms
Shinespark the ripper in the Imago Cocoon room
Get the Super Missile expansion in Brinstar without entering the little Southern room (with the missile expansion in it) that joins the two vertical shafts together (HAVEN'T PULLED THIS OFF YET)
Shinespark a Black Pirate (DONE WITH SAVESTATES)
Break the Speed Booster blocks in the first room of the game without going into the alcove underneath (which is covered by Power Bomb blocks)

GAMEPLAY TRIVIA:

On Hard Mode, it’s impossible to kill the Acid Worm using Power Bombs only. However, it’s possible to do this on both Easy and Normal Modes. (The Acid Worm only drops regular Missiles and energy – no Power Bombs or Super Missiles.)
If you get Samus’ “fully powered suit” before the Varia Suit, the Varia Suit disappears from the Chozo Statue that used to have it.
The Plasma Beam and Power Bombs can kill both Imago Larvae; however, it’s impossible to kill either of them from the right side.
In order to beat the game, you HAVE to pass through 10 save point rooms (11 if you count Samus' Gunship), total. (Anyone who’s done a speedrun will probably know this already...)
If you shoot diagonally (and perpendicularly) right between two blocks that are touching just by the corners, and there's nothing behind them; missiles, super missiles, and beams (without the wave beam) will pass through the point where the blocks touch.
If positioned properly, you can do a Screw-Attacking-spin jump at a destroyable block and still grab on.
Once you kill the Acid Worm, one of the enemies (which I forget the name of at the moment ) that pop out of the pipes two rooms above stop coming out.
JaggerG: It's possible to LOSE height in an infinite bomb jump, and there is absolutely no reason to ever do so.

Thread title:

These are challenges and some little (useless) gameplay facts for ZM. In my opinion, things like this keep ZM interesting, in case you don’t have any other portable games to play and/or you’ve played ZM to death (like me [aiwebs_027]). I apologize if people have already found some of these; I found them all from just playing the game. Also, if anyone finds more challenges/trivia, I’d love to hear them. :grinnew: I’ll update the list in case I find out about any more.

I know most of the challenges involve Shinesparking, but shinesparking just has so much potential! Also, don’t ask me why I decided to start shinesparking random Chozo Statues, because I honestly don’t know the answer :laugh:

[i][b][u]CHALLENGES:[/u][/b][/i]
[i][No matter how impossible you may think these are to do, I've done all (except one) of them - and on the US cartridge.][/i]

[list]
[li]So far, I’ve found 7 Chozo Statues that can be shinesparked into. Can you find and shinespark those 7? Let me know when you’ve found and/or shinesparked one. (Hint: the most obvious one is in Kraid! :grinnew:)[/li]

[li]Get to the Brinstar side of the Brinstar-to-Norfair elevator with a shinespark charge (no Power Bombs)[/li]

[li]Kill the Imago Cocoon without the High Jump Boots and without touching the walls or the ripper[/li]

[li]Shinespark up the long, "secret" Eastern shaft in Norfair[/li]

[li]Shinespark an Imago Larva (once from the left, once from the right. It doesn’t do anything lol)[/li]

[li]Get the lowest Energy Tank in Chozodia without dropping down into the vertical shaft below it[/li]

[li]Get across the lava-filled room that’s to the right of the Ice Beam room without going in the lava or even [b]touching[/b] any of the green platforms[/li]

[li]Shinespark the ripper in the Imago Cocoon room[/li]

[li]Get the Super Missile expansion in Brinstar without entering the little Southern room (with the missile expansion in it) that joins the two vertical shafts together [b](HAVEN'T PULLED THIS OFF YET)[/b][/li]

[li]Shinespark a Black Pirate [b](DONE WITH SAVESTATES)[/b][/li]

[li]Break the Speed Booster blocks in the first room of the game without going into the alcove underneath (which is covered by Power Bomb blocks)[/li]
[/list]

[u][i][b]GAMEPLAY TRIVIA:[/b][/i][/u]

[list]
[li]On Hard Mode, it’s [b]impossible[/b] to kill the Acid Worm using Power Bombs only. However, it’s possible to do this on both Easy and Normal Modes. (The Acid Worm only drops regular Missiles and energy – no Power Bombs or Super Missiles.)[/li]

[li]If you get Samus’ “fully powered suit” before the Varia Suit, the Varia Suit disappears from the Chozo Statue that used to have it.[/li]

[li]The Plasma Beam and Power Bombs can kill both Imago Larvae; however, it’s impossible to kill [b]either[/b] of them from the right side.[/li]

[li]In order to beat the game, you HAVE to pass through 10 save point rooms (11 if you count Samus' Gunship), total. (Anyone who’s done a speedrun will probably know this already...)[/li]

[li]If you shoot diagonally (and perpendicularly) [i][b]right[/b][/i] between two blocks that are touching just by the corners, and there's nothing behind them; missiles, super missiles, and beams (without the wave beam) will pass through the point where the blocks touch.[/li]

[li]If positioned properly, you can do a Screw-Attacking-spin jump at a destroyable block and still grab on.[/li]

[li]Once you kill the Acid Worm, one of the enemies (which I forget the name of at the moment :mad:) that pop out of the pipes two rooms above stop coming out.[/li]

[li]JaggerG: It's possible to LOSE height in an infinite bomb jump, and there is absolutely no reason to ever do so.[/li]
[/list]

BioSpark

2009-01-03 09:32:04 pm

Quote from Odima16:

Get the Super Missile expansion in Brinstar without entering the little Southern room (with the missile expansion in it) that joins the two vertical shafts together (HAVEN'T PULLED THIS OFF YET - MIGHT BE IMPOSSIBLE)

It was done in Dragonfangs TAS, so it's at least possible in that sense.

spidey-widey

2009-01-03 10:24:32 pm

I haven't been able to do it yet, but I've determined it to be easier than the bob skip. It's still too difficult for me to try in a speedrun, though.

JaggerG

Edit history:

JaggerG: 2009-01-04 05:19:19 am

2009-01-04 05:11:13 am

Shifty Leader

That M2k2 guy

CHALLENGES:

Get to the Brinstar side of the Brinstar-to-Norfair elevator with a shinespark charge (no Power Bombs)

I've seen it done at least, but haven't bothered

Kill the Imago Cocoon without the High Jump Boots and without touching the walls or the ripper

I never bothered not touching the sides. I have too much trouble timing the shots and the turn at the same time.

Shinespark up the long, "secret" Eastern shaft in Norfair

I've done this, but unfortunately it's not useful in a speedrun, as the spark-path up the normal part of that shaft stops you at the exit.

Get the lowest Energy Tank in Chozodia without dropping down into the vertical shaft below it

I don't even remember the tank you're referring to. Is that the one near the glass tube? I probably tried it before realizing I could just drop into the shaft, but I don't think I ever succeeded.

Shinespark the ripper in the Imago Cocoon room

I've shinesparked in that room, but only straight up so I can hit it slightly sooner.

Get the Super Missile expansion in Brinstar without entering the little Southern room (with the missile expansion in it) that joins the two vertical shafts together

I believe Dragonfangs did it unassisted once.

GAMEPLAY TRIVIA:

On Hard Mode, it’s impossible to kill the Acid Worm using Power Bombs only. However, it’s possible to do this on both Easy and Normal Modes. (The Acid Worm only drops regular Missiles and energy – no Power Bombs or Super Missiles.)

Does it take more than 50 pbombs to kill it? For some reason I remember normal bombs hurting it, but I could be mistaken. It's been a LONG time since I fought it.

If you get Samus’ “fully powered suit” before the Varia Suit, the Varia Suit disappears from the Chozo Statue that used to have it.

That's because it's included as part of the gravity suit for some dumb reason. You never have to pick it up, but it's one of the 9% "required."

In order to beat the game, you HAVE to pass through 10 save point rooms, total. (Anyone who’s done a speedrun will probably know this already...)

Huh, never thought of that. Let's see...1 in Kraid, 1 in Crateria, 2 in Norfair, 1 in Ridley, 2 in Tourian...is it 2 or 3 in the suitless segment? Then there's another one just before the 9%hard breaker. Funny thing is, less than half of the required save rooms are actually used in speedruns.

Add sub-30 normal, 9% normal, and 10% hard NTSC on there, so my score could look much better. :^P

[i][b][u]CHALLENGES:[/u][/b][/i]
[list][li]Get to the Brinstar side of the Brinstar-to-Norfair elevator with a shinespark charge (no Power Bombs)[/li][/list]
I've seen it done at least, but haven't bothered

[list][li]Kill the Imago Cocoon without the High Jump Boots and without touching the walls or the ripper[/li][/list]
I never bothered not touching the sides. I have too much trouble timing the shots and the turn at the same time.

[list][li]Shinespark up the long, "secret" Eastern shaft in Norfair[/li][/list]
I've done this, but unfortunately it's not useful in a speedrun, as the spark-path up the normal part of that shaft stops you at the exit.

[list][li]Get the lowest Energy Tank in Chozodia without dropping down into the vertical shaft below it[/li][/list]
I don't even remember the tank you're referring to. Is that the one near the glass tube? I probably tried it before realizing I could just drop into the shaft, but I don't think I ever succeeded.

[list][li]Shinespark the ripper in the Imago Cocoon room[/li][/list]
I've shinesparked in that room, but only straight up so I can hit it slightly sooner.

[list][li]Get the Super Missile expansion in Brinstar without entering the little Southern room (with the missile expansion in it) that joins the two vertical shafts together[/li][/list]
I believe Dragonfangs did it unassisted once.

[u][i][b]GAMEPLAY TRIVIA:[/b][/i][/u]

[list]
[li]On Hard Mode, it’s [b]impossible[/b] to kill the Acid Worm using Power Bombs only. However, it’s possible to do this on both Easy and Normal Modes. (The Acid Worm only drops regular Missiles and energy – no Power Bombs or Super Missiles.)[/li][/list]
Does it take more than 50 pbombs to kill it? For some reason I remember normal bombs hurting it, but I could be mistaken. It's been a LONG time since I fought it.

[list][li]If you get Samus’ “fully powered suit” before the Varia Suit, the Varia Suit disappears from the Chozo Statue that used to have it.[/li][/list]
That's because it's included as part of the gravity suit for some dumb reason. You never have to pick it up, but it's one of the 9% "required."

[list][li]In order to beat the game, you HAVE to pass through 10 save point rooms, total. (Anyone who’s done a speedrun will probably know this already...)[/li][/list]
Huh, never thought of that. Let's see...1 in Kraid, 1 in Crateria, 2 in Norfair, 1 in Ridley, 2 in Tourian...is it 2 or 3 in the suitless segment? Then there's another one just before the 9%hard breaker. Funny thing is, less than half of the required save rooms are actually used in speedruns.

Add sub-30 normal, 9% normal, and 10% hard NTSC on there, so my score could look much better. :^P

Odima16

Edit history:

Odima16: 2009-01-04 01:04:05 pm

2009-01-04 12:37:07 pm

"C'mon, Luigi!"

Quote from JaggerG:

Get the lowest Energy Tank in Chozodia without dropping down into the vertical shaft below it

I don't even remember the tank you're referring to. Is that the one near the glass tube?

Yeah, it's the one underneath the glass tube, then through those Power Bomb blocks on the left, and then through the Speed Booster blocks above. (Personally, I think the challenge for this one is pretty fun to do. grin new

But my favorite challenge is definitely shinesparking all the Chozo Statues.)

Quote from JaggerG:

Shinespark the ripper in the Imago Cocoon room

I've shinesparked in that room, but only straight up so I can hit it slightly sooner.

I'm pretty sure that if you shinespark diagonally left in Morph Ball form, you hit it every time.
And remember, barely any (and if not, none) of these challenges are supposed to serve any speedrunning purposes or make ZM any easier. They're just supposed to get you absolutely nowhere. lol

Quote from JaggerG:

On Hard Mode, it’s impossible to kill the Acid Worm using Power Bombs only. However, it’s possible to do this on both Easy and Normal Modes. (The Acid Worm only drops regular Missiles and energy – no Power Bombs or Super Missiles.)

Does it take more than 50 pbombs to kill it? For some reason I remember normal bombs hurting it, but I could be mistaken. It's been a LONG time since I fought it.

I think you need around 16 to kill it, although I can't remember what the exact number is off the top of my head. Also, I think I tried to hurt it with regular Bombs before, but it didn't work. (However, I might've not been technically hitting it with them...)

Quote from JaggerG:

If you get Samus’ “fully powered suit” before the Varia Suit, the Varia Suit disappears from the Chozo Statue that used to have it.

That's because it's included as part of the gravity suit for some dumb reason. You never have to pick it up, but it's one of the 9% "required."

I know, I'm just mentioning it because there's no point to going back into that room once you get the Gravity Suit, so I assume most people haven't wasted their time just to check (but I did it for them! How convenient! *sarcasm*).

Quote from JaggerG:

Add sub-30 normal, 9% normal, and 10% hard NTSC on there, so my score could look much better. :^P

Well, remember, I wanted the list to be unique and not include speedruns, low% playthroughs, well-known techniques used in either one, or anything posted in http://www.metroid2002.com/0/, because those type of challenges are basically a given (givens?).

FOUND MORE TRIVIA!

If you shoot diagonally (and perpendicularly) right between two blocks that are touching just by the corners, and there's nothing behind them; missiles, super missiles, and beams (without the wave beam) will pass through the point where the blocks touch.

[quote="JaggerG"]
[list][li]Get the lowest Energy Tank in Chozodia without dropping down into the vertical shaft below it[/li][/list]
I don't even remember the tank you're referring to. Is that the one near the glass tube?[/quote]

Yeah, it's the one underneath the glass tube, then through those Power Bomb blocks on the left, and then through the Speed Booster blocks above. (Personally, I think the challenge for this one is pretty fun to do. :grinnew: But my favorite challenge is definitely shinesparking all the Chozo Statues.)

[quote="JaggerG"]
[list][li]Shinespark the ripper in the Imago Cocoon room[/li][/list]
I've shinesparked in that room, but only straight up so I can hit it slightly sooner.[/quote]

I'm pretty sure that if you shinespark diagonally left in Morph Ball form, you hit it every time.
And remember, barely any (and if not, none) of these challenges are supposed to serve any speedrunning purposes or make ZM any easier. They're just supposed to get you absolutely nowhere. lol

[quote="JaggerG"]
[list]
[li]On Hard Mode, it’s [b]impossible[/b] to kill the Acid Worm using Power Bombs only. However, it’s possible to do this on both Easy and Normal Modes. (The Acid Worm only drops regular Missiles and energy – no Power Bombs or Super Missiles.)[/li][/list]
Does it take more than 50 pbombs to kill it? For some reason I remember normal bombs hurting it, but I could be mistaken. It's been a LONG time since I fought it.[/quote]

I think you need around 16 to kill it, although I can't remember what the exact number is off the top of my head. Also, I think I tried to hurt it with regular Bombs before, but it didn't work. (However, I might've not been technically hitting it with them...)

[quote="JaggerG"]
[list][li]If you get Samus’ “fully powered suit” before the Varia Suit, the Varia Suit disappears from the Chozo Statue that used to have it.[/li][/list]
That's because it's included as part of the gravity suit for some dumb reason. You never have to pick it up, but it's one of the 9% "required."[/quote]

I know, I'm just mentioning it because there's no point to going back into that room once you get the Gravity Suit, so I assume most people haven't wasted their time just to check (but I did it for them! How convenient! *sarcasm*).

[quote="JaggerG"]
Add sub-30 normal, 9% normal, and 10% hard NTSC on there, so my score could look much better. :^P[/quote]

Well, remember, I wanted the list to be unique and not include speedruns, low% playthroughs, well-known techniques used in either one, or anything posted in http://www.metroid2002.com/0/, because those type of challenges are basically a given (givens?).

[b][u]FOUND MORE TRIVIA![/u][/b]
[list]
[li]If you shoot diagonally (and perpendicularly) [i][b]right[/b][/i] between two blocks that are touching just by the corners, and there's nothing behind them; missiles, super missiles, and beams (without the wave beam) will pass through the point where the blocks touch.[/li]
[/list]

rekameohs

2009-01-04 12:52:41 pm

Anywhere, everywhere

Quote from JaggerG:

is it 2 or 3 in the suitless segment?

There's 4 in the suitless segment. I don't think the ship should count as one since you can skip that room until the escape and the ship doesn't save there.

Odima16

2009-01-04 01:09:27 pm

"C'mon, Luigi!"

Oh yeah, I completely forgot to add Samus' Gunship as a possible save point, so I'll add that in.

Odima16

Edit history:

Odima16: 2009-01-05 10:04:54 pm

2009-01-05 08:24:28 pm

"C'mon, Luigi!"

New Challenge:

Shinespark a Black Pirate (DONE WITH SAVESTATES)

This does nothing, by the way. aiwebs_027

New trivia:

If positioned properly, you can do a Screw-Attacking-spin jump at a destroyable block and still grab on.

This actually happens to me all the time, and it's really annoying lol.

I attached a little .gif that shows what I'm talking about (but it has a really crappy frame rate, so just be patient with it).

attachment:

Grippy.gif

Odima16

2009-01-10 07:59:15 pm

"C'mon, Luigi!"

New Challenge:

Break the Speed Booster blocks in the first room of the game without going into the alcove underneath (which is covered by Power Bomb blocks)

New Trivia:

Once you kill the Acid Worm, one of the enemies (which I forget the name of at the moment ) that pop out of the pipes two rooms above stop coming out.

JaggerG

2009-01-11 06:07:37 am

Shifty Leader

That M2k2 guy

Trivia: It's possible to LOSE height in an infinite bomb jump, and there is absolutely no reason to ever do so.

I hope there's gonna be a hack that requires you to do this to get space jump. Nobody else does, though. >_>

P.JMan

2009-01-18 12:04:45 pm

I like Big Butts and I can not lie

Quote from JaggerG:

Trivia: It's possible to LOSE height in an infinite bomb jump, and there is absolutely no reason to ever do so.

Just unmorph and remorph before the peak of your upwards height

MetroidMst

Edit history:

MetroidMst: 2009-01-19 01:45:23 am

2009-01-19 01:40:24 am

Go ahead. Stare.

Quote from JaggerG:

I hope there's gonna be a hack that requires you to do this to get space jump. Nobody else does, though. >_>

I don't see how I could make the player use such a technique when they could simply... fall. Now if there was a door at the bottom, and SJ was too far to the left/right to prevent walljumping it might be possible to make them lose height, and then HBJ to get SJ... (See attached pic.)

I just noticed a serious flaw... *scampers off to fix said flaw*

That should just about do it!

attachments:

IBJ-HBJ-SJ 2.PNG

IBJ-HBJ-SJ.PNG

P.JMan

2009-01-19 10:29:38 am

I like Big Butts and I can not lie

I don't really see how the spikes help, especially since you have invincibility time and you can respin after geting hurt

Odima16

2009-01-19 06:15:03 pm

"C'mon, Luigi!"

Quote from P.JMan:

I don't really see how the spikes help, especially since you have invincibility time and you can respin after geting hurt

Maybe the hack could be like SM Redesign and have certain walls you can't jump off of?

(Although we need to make sure that the physics are left intact this time lol)

MetroidMst

Edit history:

MetroidMst: 2009-01-19 07:36:00 pm

2009-01-19 07:28:24 pm

Go ahead. Stare.

Quote from P.JMan:

I don't really see how the spikes help, especially since you have invincibility time and you can respin after geting hurt

The spikes have to be there along with the door at the bottom. (I'm thinking of SM, not MZM here.) Because you could spin jump down the pit, and then jump off the wall and morph and HBJ from there, the spikes prevent that because in SM, if you hit the spikes you lose your spin and you can't get it back, so you fall helplessly through the door which would put you into another room through a one-way door, making the player go back around to get to the SJ room. That would require you to IBJ downward to HBJ across. I think that would cover every aspect of getting to SJ except the desired way.

EDIT: Keep in mind that this would require the door at the bottom to be one-way only, so there is no way they could jump up through the door on the right side and walljump up that. I'd say it would take a two scroll room at least in width to make the gap suffeciently wide. This is actually a really good idea. I just might implement it for an important item, maybe SJ but probably for something you come across much earlier, like Plasma. So if you have the skills you could get it super early instead of waiting for SJ to get it. That is brilliant! If you have any other ideas let me know.

[quote="P.JMan"]
I don't really see how the spikes help, especially since you have invincibility time and you can respin after geting hurt
[/quote]
The spikes have to be there along with the door at the bottom. (I'm thinking of SM, not MZM here.) Because you could spin jump down the pit, and then jump off the wall and morph and HBJ from there, the spikes prevent that because in SM, if you hit the spikes you lose your spin and you can't get it back, so you fall helplessly through the door which would put you into another room through a one-way door, making the player go back around to get to the SJ room. That would require you to IBJ downward to HBJ across. I think that would cover every aspect of getting to SJ except the desired way.

EDIT: Keep in mind that this would require the door at the bottom to be one-way only, so there is no way they could jump up through the door on the right side and walljump up that. I'd say it would take a two scroll room at least in width to make the gap suffeciently wide. This is actually a really good idea. I just might implement it for an important item, maybe SJ but probably for something you come across much earlier, like Plasma. So if you have the skills you could get it super early instead of waiting for SJ to get it. That is brilliant! If you have any other ideas let me know.

JaggerG

2009-01-20 08:06:32 am

Shifty Leader

That M2k2 guy

I'm thinking more something like this. Stupid touchpad.

attachment:

BombFallToDBJ.JPG

MetroidMst

2009-01-20 04:25:53 pm

Go ahead. Stare.

Same basic principle. Though, if you notice how big the doors are, the wall you have looks twice as big, and that I think would give the player enough space to jump off of it... Maybe not. It might get them started lower on the IBJ but it looks like they'd have to pull off that little stunt to get back there anyway.

And as a side note... I would've said my little brother, age 22 drew that. laugh new

Much more about the topic; how about defeating Ridley without touching the ground? Yeah, it is pretty obvious how to do it, but can you actually pull it off? (My hands hurt for two days.)

And some trivia. Wave beam turns blue if you collect it before Ice.

P.JMan

2009-01-20 05:54:19 pm

I like Big Butts and I can not lie

That thing at the start when Ridley shoots those fireballs at you can be cut short by being on the opposite side of where he detects you or something. VBM attached

attachment:

Metroid - Zero Mission (U) [!].vbm