normal 15% run. Whats required, whats not?

2004-02-18 08:37:11 pm

Alright, im currently staring at ridley, whom has killed me about 50 times at this point without any luck, as im trying for a normal 15% run, but, thats not the main point of this post, as nothing can beat him but skill.

anyway, this is my current item setup (what its going to be) and i think i cover all the mandatory, and then have a good idea where to put my extra (and that stupid missile tank i got)

1% morph ball
2% bomb
4% missiles (x2 second one i couldn't figure out how to skip... its in brinstar)
5% varia suit (can't bypass it)
6% power grip (can't bypass it either) , it gives you varia suit as a % after the "metal gear samus" segment, and you *have* to have power grip to get past norfair, othewise theres something blocking your way.
9% 3x "unkown items" (need them as well)
10% ice beam (believe you need this)
11% 1x energy tank (for double life, not needed)
12% screw attack (not needed, but will make things easier)
13-15% 3x super missile tanks to make things far easier on me, mainly at bosses.

if you know of a better setup, keep in mind that i already have 1 energy tank and 2 missiles, but, i would like help wherever it could be.

along with any way to help with with ridley, or if theres anyway to not do him in the order i did. (I went through brinstar for morph ball, missile, bomb, grabbed varia just cause i wanted to see if i could.. then i basicly immediately went down into ridleys lair after power grip and ice beam, then fell down the longest shaft i've ever seen in any metroid game that i stumbled across on accident.. I somehow managed to beat the big bug, and now im *STUCK* at ridley)

Thread title:

Alright, im currently staring at ridley, whom has killed me about 50 times at this point without any luck, as im trying for a normal 15% run,  but, thats not the main point of this post, as nothing can beat him but skill.

anyway, this is my current item setup (what its going to be) and i think i cover all the mandatory, and then have a good idea where to put my extra (and that stupid missile tank i got)

1% morph ball
2% bomb
4% missiles (x2 second one i couldn't figure out how to skip... its in brinstar)
5% varia suit (can't bypass it)
6% power grip (can't bypass it either) , it gives you varia suit as a % after the "metal gear samus" segment, and you *have* to have power grip to get past norfair, othewise theres something blocking your way.
9% 3x "unkown items" (need them as well)
10% ice beam (believe you need this)
11% 1x energy tank (for double life, not needed)
12% screw attack (not needed, but will make things easier)
13-15% 3x super missile tanks to make things far easier on me, mainly at bosses.

if you know of a better setup, keep in mind that i already have 1 energy tank and 2 missiles, but, i would like help wherever it could be.

along with any way to help with with ridley, or if theres anyway to not do him in the order i did.  (I went through brinstar for morph ball, missile, bomb, grabbed varia just cause i wanted to see if i could.. then i basicly immediately went down into ridleys lair after power grip and ice beam, then fell down the longest shaft i've ever seen in any metroid game that i stumbled across on accident.. I somehow managed to beat the big bug, and now im *STUCK* at ridley)

Yoshi348

2004-02-18 08:42:58 pm

PAGE BREAKER

Ready and willing.

Quote from Syl_Aran:

1% morph ball
2% bomb
4% missiles (x2 second one i couldn't figure out how to skip... its in brinstar)

Wall jumping below it gets you by. Check the m2k2 page...

Quote from Some person... who knows? heh.:

5% varia suit (can't bypass it)
6% power grip (can't bypass it either) , it gives you varia suit as a % after the "metal gear samus" segment, and you *have* to have power grip to get past norfair, othewise theres something blocking your way.
9% 3x "unkown items" (need them as well)
10% ice beam (believe you need this)
11% 1x energy tank (for double life, not needed)
12% screw attack (not needed, but will make things easier)
13-15% 3x super missile tanks to make things far easier on me, mainly at bosses.

if you know of a better setup, keep in mind that i already have 1 energy tank and 2 missiles, but, i would like help wherever it could be.

If you figure out how to skip that missle tank, I'd trade it for an energy tank. It could also go to another super tank, but I'd go for the health.

Quote from figure it out.:

along with any way to help with with ridley, or if theres anyway to not do him in the order i did. (I went through brinstar for morph ball, missile, bomb, grabbed varia just cause i wanted to see if i could.. then i basicly immediately went down into ridleys lair after power grip and ice beam, then fell down the longest shaft i've ever seen in any metroid game that i stumbled across on accident.. I somehow managed to beat the big bug, and now im *STUCK* at ridley)

How many supers do you have? Your 3? You can skip the bug entirely, but since you fought him already, it's alright now, heh.

[quote="Syl_Aran"]
1% morph ball
2% bomb
4% missiles (x2 second one i couldn't figure out how to skip... its in brinstar)
[/quote]

Wall jumping below it gets you by. Check the m2k2 page...

[quote="Some person... who knows? heh."]
5% varia suit (can't bypass it)
6% power grip (can't bypass it either) , it gives you varia suit as a % after the "metal gear samus" segment, and you *have* to have power grip to get past norfair, othewise theres something blocking your way.
9% 3x "unkown items" (need them as well)
10% ice beam (believe you need this)
11% 1x energy tank (for double life, not needed)
12% screw attack (not needed, but will make things easier)
13-15% 3x super missile tanks to make things far easier on me, mainly at bosses.

if you know of a better setup, keep in mind that i already have 1 energy tank and 2 missiles, but, i would like help wherever it could be.
[/quote]

If you figure out how to skip that missle tank, I'd trade it for an energy tank. It could also go to another super tank, but I'd go for the health.

[quote="figure it out."]
along with any way to help with with ridley, or if theres anyway to not do him in the order i did.  (I went through brinstar for morph ball, missile, bomb, grabbed varia just cause i wanted to see if i could.. then i basicly immediately went down into ridleys lair after power grip and ice beam, then fell down the longest shaft i've ever seen in any metroid game that i stumbled across on accident.. I somehow managed to beat the big bug, and now im *STUCK* at ridley)[/quote]
How many supers do you have? Your 3? You can skip the bug entirely, but since you fought him already, it's alright now, heh.

Syl

2004-02-18 08:58:43 pm

i have a total of 2 supers at the moment... is there any place i can get more while still in ridley? im sure they would make a huge difference.

Yoshi348

2004-02-18 09:08:36 pm

PAGE BREAKER

Ready and willing.

Quote from Syl_Aran:

i have a total of 2 supers at the moment... is there any place i can get more while still in ridley? im sure they would make a huge difference.

From the save before Ridely...

Code:

  --->
  |
  |
--

With the room with the missle tank and bouncing fireballs. Jump in the upper left of the missle chamber (you should grip a ledge and get up into a morph) and bomb. Then jump up and destroy the Super Missle block, and it's obvious from there.

Light of Day

2004-02-18 09:12:14 pm

I would highly reccomend high-jump for the Tourian escape, unless you are very good at bomb-jumping. In fact, my ideal setup would be as you listed, but drop the extra missile tank for high-jump. Unfortunately, it sounds a little late for that. If anything, I'd say drop a super missile for high-jump. You're going to find Mother Brain/Tourian escape very hard either way. The extra energy tank and screw attack I'd say are both things you can't live without, though. At least, I couldn't.

As for taking out Ridley, after the initial bout of breathing fire at you, try to stay between his feet at all times. If done correctly, he should just go back and forth, up and down, occasionally stopping to breath fire a bit (which is handy for refilling missiles), and you shouldn't get hit at all.

I'm assuming the second missile tank you couldn't avoid was the one in Ridley. To get past that, when you first enter Ridley go right. You'll be at a dead-end. Stand 2 blocks from the door, and shoot a missile straight up to reveal an alternate path, basically following the usual path out.

Every bit of advice I've given here comes courtesy of TFergussons 15% hard run, even down to my advised choices for your optional items.

I would [i]highly[/i] reccomend high-jump for the Tourian escape, unless you are [i]very[/i] good at bomb-jumping. In fact, my ideal setup would be as you listed, but drop the extra missile tank for high-jump. Unfortunately, it sounds a little late for that. If anything, I'd say drop a super missile for high-jump. You're going to find Mother Brain/Tourian escape very hard either way. The extra energy tank and screw attack I'd say are both things you can't live without, though. At least, I couldn't.

As for taking out Ridley, after the initial bout of breathing fire at you, try to stay between his feet at all times. If done correctly, he should just go back and forth, up and down, occasionally stopping to breath fire a bit (which is handy for refilling missiles), and you shouldn't get hit at all.

I'm assuming the second missile tank you couldn't avoid was the one in Ridley. To get past that, when you first enter Ridley go right. You'll be at a dead-end. Stand 2 blocks from the door, and shoot a missile straight up to reveal an alternate path, basically following the usual path out.

Every bit of advice I've given here comes courtesy of [url=http://www.metroid2002.com/0/speed_runs_0_low_percent_15P_01_26_42_TFergusson.html]TFergussons 15% hard run[/url], even down to my advised choices for your optional items.

nate

2004-02-18 09:21:02 pm

Quote from Light of Day:

I would highly reccomend high-jump for the Tourian escape, unless you are very good at bomb-jumping.

ok so ... i got out on hard without high jump without bomb jumping once ... is bomb jumping just a substitute for wall jumping or something?

Light of Day

2004-02-18 09:35:00 pm

Quote from njahnke:

ok so ... i got out on hard without high jump without bomb jumping once ... is bomb jumping just a substitute for wall jumping or something?

Quote from Toozin:

I've done it without hi jump. You've got to bomb jump up that shaft, and that means doing pretty much everything flawless. You have BARELY enough time to get out. Expect to get to the ship with a second or less to go.

I'm just taking Toozin's word for it that you need to bomb jump out without high-jump. Then again, the thread that was taken from was talking about running out of time on hard without high-jump, so taking Toozin's quote out of context may not have been a good idea. Ok, then; I take back high-jump as a highly recommended item for normal.

That quote is taken from here, by the way.

Warlock

2004-02-18 10:05:03 pm

Regarding Ridley, I'm pretty sure he uses his tail when you attack him while he's shooting. So be careful not to fire while he is shooting out fireballs (esp. at the beginning when you still have full missiles and super missiles).

And yeah, for both of mine (Normal and Hard) I picked up 1 energy tank, 1 missile tank, 3 supers, and Hi-Jump (basically the same as yours only swapping the second missile tank for Hi-Jump). I honestly have not tried the Tourian escape without Hi-Jump but I keep hearing it's a nightmare (esp. on Hard I imagine). Plus, I'm sure Hi-Jump is useful for other things such as Mother Brain (jumping onto that high ledge in the upper right, unless you can grab that - but still, when you have Rinkas coming at you, you don't want to wait for the extra second it takes to grab that ledge).

Anyways, if you can find Terence's video of his 15% hard run, that helped a lot for me.

nate

2004-02-18 10:36:15 pm

Quote from Warlock:

Anyways, if you can find Terence's video of his 15% hard run, that helped a lot for me.

sorry, everyone. -_-

Toozin

2004-02-19 02:52:01 am

Not impossible

just highly unlikely

The item combo that I chose both times (easy and hard) was the 9 required items, plus 2 e-tanks, 3 super missiles, and Screw Attack.
The Screw Attack is insanely valuable. The rest of the items I didn't really miss, save for the Tourian escape where I would have loved Hi Jump. Having Supers for Mecha Ridley makes anything you give up worthwhile, though. I'd almost think about trading those e-tanks for more Supers.

Syl

2004-02-19 09:42:35 am

yeah, well my main issue with ridley is his annoying TAIL. I have no idea how to get around that TAIL of his, once that thing starts swinging all crazy-like, you die in about 4 seconds, without anywhere to go. i could probably beat him if i knew what triggered that stupid tail swinging frenzy, and how to avoid it.

I see no issue with tourian escape without high jump, can't you just walljump up the wall all the way to the top? not to mention the excesive amount of time on normal, and that bombjumping is no longer a problem for me at all... (mainly after getting Varia Suit, along with for no apparent reason trying to bombjump all the way up that *LONG* shaft in norfair, which i honestly think im going to have to do on the way out...)

just wondering, just how do you get screw attack without speed boster? only way i can think of requires speed booster to get to the ball launcher, and then to leave that area requires screw attack anyway....

Tim

2004-02-19 01:10:00 pm

Read this post as well as the rest of the thread

-Tim

Toozin

2004-02-19 03:17:44 pm

Not impossible

just highly unlikely

Quote from Syl_Aran:

yeah, well my main issue with ridley is his annoying TAIL. I have no idea how to get around that TAIL of his, once that thing starts swinging all crazy-like, you die in about 4 seconds, without anywhere to go. i could probably beat him if i knew what triggered that stupid tail swinging frenzy, and how to avoid it.

Stay in between his tail and his hand for the entire fight. He will not be able to touch you.

Syl

2004-02-19 04:14:22 pm

heh, any and all questions i could have had now hold no ground, im sitting at the save point infront of mother brain, with every upgrade i mentioned above... my time is on the long side, but, thats because of all the trial and error i did for much of the trip.

the 3 super missiles i got:
1 behind the ugly bug.
1 above ridley, (im surprised that ledgegrab + jump actually worked so well)
1 in norfair, nearish where screw attack is... i froze a bug, bomb jumped onto the bug than jumped to the ledge, seemed the most logical way of doing things.

I realized just how much thought nintendo put into allowing you to get past area's you weren't supposed too, and how difficult they purposely made it to get 15%, i actually think it made the game much more interesting looking for all those "one random missile block" which meant i knew i was going the right way.

anyway, i'll be done with it tommorow most likely, i'll report back after i finish mother brain.. im sure 6 super missiles is going to help make that much easier for me..

heh, any and all questions i could have had now hold no ground, im sitting at the save point infront of mother brain, with every upgrade i mentioned above... my time is on the long side, but, thats because of all the trial and error i did for much of the trip.

the 3 super missiles i got:
1 behind the ugly bug.
1 above ridley, (im surprised that ledgegrab + jump actually worked so well)
1 in norfair, nearish where screw attack is... i froze a bug, bomb jumped onto the bug than jumped to the ledge, seemed the most logical way of doing things.

I realized just how much thought nintendo put into allowing you to get past area's you weren't supposed too, and how difficult they purposely made it to get 15%, i actually think it made the game much more interesting looking for all those "one random missile block" which meant i knew i was going the right way.

anyway, i'll be done with it tommorow most likely, i'll report back after i finish mother brain.. im sure 6 super missiles is going to help make that much easier for me..

Syl

2004-02-19 08:56:43 pm

alright, beat mother brain.
when i actually beat her it was dissapoining, cause it made me realize i was about 2 hits away the previous 5 times >_>.
anyway, i just destroyed her tank with regular missiles (recharging when necessary), and then used all my super missiles on her eye, and whatever other missiles i could pick up.

why were you guys complaining aboutt he tourian escape sequence? i had nearly a minute to spare and i was *Very* sloppy, the only thing that high jump could have helped me with was very quick to bomb ladder to the top of (im assuming you mean the alternate passage to the ship at the surface)
i'll do stealth later tonight.

DOH!!!
I just got my gravity suit, saved, and turned off the game, I remember leaving it on earlier, but.. well, my game file is now over 6 hours long >< darn, guess i gotta go through normal again to get the under 2 hour ending, im so glad the 15% isn't based on time.

Yoshi348

2004-02-19 09:37:51 pm

PAGE BREAKER

Ready and willing.

Quote from Syl_Aran:

why were you guys complaining aboutt he tourian escape sequence? i had nearly a minute to spare and i was *Very* sloppy, the only thing that high jump could have helped me with was very quick to bomb ladder to the top of (im assuming you mean the alternate passage to the ship at the surface)
i'll do stealth later tonight.

In normal, it's fine. In hard, the reduced time doesn't allow you enough time to grip and jump, grip and jump on to each ledge.