New 100% Route

2013-05-02 05:11:39 pm

I think a video speedrunning tutorial like Kirby did for fusion would probably be a good idea. Walking through the game, talking about suggested strategies for rooms and routes, and alternate/backup strats.

I'd be up for it, but I think Zx and others have a better understanding of all the strats. We should write a script or something.

kirbymastah

2013-05-02 05:47:40 pm

We could make a new thread for it; I think the new thread could focus on what to focus on for the tutorial, and this thread should be used for new strats/routes

Mobiusman

2013-05-02 06:24:05 pm

these videos are awesome <3 There are lots of tiny things I do differently, but here are some actual comments:

0:42 this is slower than not tripping the wire, right? I remember this question came up before but I can't remember if there was a definitive answer
1:04 you can just shoot up from the ground, no need to pause your walljump
3:31 why springball into this room?

ZX497

2013-05-02 06:33:51 pm

0:42, correct, it's slower, by about a second. I just do it for safety: if you attempt to do that section stealthily, and fail, that'll cost you a bunch of time... basically, I'm just gonna suck up the one second loss and not worry about it.

1:04, yeah, I know, but that feels a little bit slower than this, if both strategies are executed perfectly. If you shoot from the ground up and follow with a series of wall-jumps, you have to walk all the way next to the wall. If you do it like this, you can already be mid-air when you reach the wall. I guess shooting from the ground is more consistent, and not much if any slower... I actually use it occasionally myself, it just depends on how good I feel about my wall-jumps at the moment :P

3:31, so the Power Bomb is planted marginally higher. Save the frames!

Dragondarch

2013-05-03 09:49:51 pm

2:40 - I'm guessing that spark is probably the same as the one for the Crateria PB, where you have 4 frames where you're high enough to not smack the wall.
3:17 - I prefer to remorph after the bomb explodes and just roll into the next room, rather than remorphing in the next room.

ZX497

2013-05-04 09:09:47 am

2:40, it is pretty tight, yeah.

3:17, that's actually a great idea. Probably better for RTA to just stay morphed and ball jump up to that PB tank.

Dragondarch

2013-05-27 08:41:16 am

So...I read Skype to see that Jagger was playing around with a possible route change in Kraid cleanup.

http://www.twitch.tv/jaggerg/b/408517681?t=8h16m00s

It looks like it has potential, but I think the biggest concern is that missile tank under the Rio room, and when to get it.

/discuss

Mobiusman

2013-05-27 10:00:52 am

it'd be cool if you can maintain a spark from the save room and use it in the large room with the crabs. looks probably slower but worth timing.

ZX497

2013-05-27 10:22:11 am

Kirby timed that already, from what I remember, and it turned out to be quite a bit slower, sadly.

kirbymastah

Edit history:

kirbymastah: 2013-05-27 02:31:46 pm

kirbymastah: 2013-05-27 02:30:03 pm

2013-05-27 02:27:50 pm

These are the Kraid routes I tested a while back:

Information is in the youtube video info. But yeah, if jagger was trying out what I think he was trying out, it's noticeably slower (but definitely jagger% material) by 7 in-game seconds. But it's definitely doable in a run, it's not that major; pulling off the shinesparks is very difficult though.

Both videos can be equally sped up by using charge beam on the first giant side hopper instead of screw attacking it, but that doesn't really matter for comparison purposes.

Dragonfangs

Edit history:

Dragonfangs: 2013-05-27 06:53:07 pm

2013-05-27 06:52:46 pm

Jagger, Kirby and I, while on Skype, JUST realized that this is way more viable with AWS because grabbing the Rio missile tank on the first trip is almost free. You have to go in there to charge a shinespark anyway. I might even have to time this for TAS purposes.

Mobiusman

2013-06-10 08:22:02 am

dragonfangs, would you be willing to make a little video for me of the correct room strat for getting the workrobot super late? I feel like what I'm doing is really slow. Thanks!

ZX497

2013-06-10 08:36:10 am

Mobius:

- Have Supers equipped when you enter the room.
- Shoot one straight to kill the pirate.
- Shoot one diagonally to clear the missile block.
- Turn around, kill the pirate following you (if there is one).
- Activate workbot with a diagonal shot.
- Clear the block above you with a vertical shot.
- Lay down a Bomb, and get up.

That's the way I try to do it anyway.

Dragonfangs

2013-06-10 09:01:52 am

Something like this (Very similar to what Zx just posted):

Feel free to use more supers to kill pirates if you want, we're refilling in the next room anyway.

kirbymastah

Edit history:

kirbymastah: 2013-06-10 09:10:19 am

2013-06-10 09:10:05 am

So is that actually a little faster than getting the super missile tank earlier? Looks like I'll have to practice that :P

Dragonfangs

2013-06-10 09:57:36 am

It's virtually the same for in-game time, but the first transition is shorter since it's not a door so it saves realtime. I find it easier too.

kirbymastah

Edit history:

kirbymastah: 2013-06-10 01:24:48 pm

kirbymastah: 2013-06-10 01:24:25 pm

kirbymastah: 2013-06-10 01:23:06 pm

kirbymastah: 2013-06-10 01:22:33 pm

2013-06-10 01:22:09 pm

well I always screw that up, so having an actual strat would be nice. I guess I'll sit down and practice that a bit :P

Not sure if anyone knows the below already, but...

I mentioned this to mobiusman while we were racing, but ~~we wanted to keep it a secret so we can have a one RTA second advantage over everyone else in races~~ the vertical shaft in chozodia with the pirates that lags like crazy... There's no lag if you space jump while hugging the right wall. It seems consistent on my cartridge; not sure if that applies for emulator, but it SHOULD be ok for all cartridges (can someone confirm this?). It does save RTA time, and you won't mess up your space jumps because of the lag. If it does work for everyone, I highly recommend doing it, since even if it doesn't technically save in-game time, it does save a little RTA time, and space jumping is much easier without the lag.

ZX497

2013-06-10 01:32:40 pm

Which vertical shaft? All I can think of is the one near the glass tube, but I always Space Jump up the right side there anyway on second pass.

kirbymastah

2013-06-10 02:23:59 pm

The shaft near iron ted, where you can unlock a shortcut with a power bomb

ZX497

2013-06-10 02:33:30 pm

Wait, that one's "lagging like crazy" for you guys? I've barely noticed anything, both when playing myself and when watching your streams.

kirbymastah

2013-06-10 02:36:11 pm

Yeah it definitely lags if you hug the left wall instead, because of so many pirates being on the screen. Again it could just be my cartridge, but IIRC it's lagged on other ZM runner's games too...

ZX497

2013-06-10 02:46:19 pm

Well, I just tried timing that with wsplit by hugging both left and right walls, and there doesn't seem to be a speed difference there on the emu. It's worth noting, that the emu I'm using is not immune to lag in general. For example, the game does actually slow down considerably on the return trip through the room where you get the first Power Bomb, since a couple of pirates barge in from left and right.

Thomaz

2013-06-10 02:52:18 pm

The game lags for me. I'll try it out when I get there. =)

kirbymastah

2013-06-10 03:29:29 pm

Yeah the room with the main power bomb always lags for me when going right to left; definitely moreso than the vertical shaft. However, all you have to do is jump and shoot once, so that's fine. The vertical shaft's lag HAS messed my space jumping up for me though, so getting rid of that is very helpful.

kirbymastah

2013-06-10 10:10:17 pm

so is there any strat on defeating acid worm quickly with plasma beam & supers?