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Hazel
Hazel
Edit history:
Hazel: 2012-03-11 12:12:35 pm
2012-03-11 12:10:47 pm
rocks, locks, and invisible blocks
Ok we have a few ideas on wave beam/artifact of sun

1. do everything inbounds, get wave then use IS to get sun
2. wall crawl to chapel tunnel, door warp inbounds, get IS, get sun, start Sheegoth fight from chaple tunnel with IS
3. wall crawl to chapel of elders and skip sheegoth fight, get IS, get sun

now the 2 and 3 both need a way past that gate in the ice temple, I assume that there is a way to activate that bomb slot in a SW or by using IS

afaik #2 should be fastest because the sheegoth fight removes IS and we can dash and shot doors without the game dying
Baby Sheegoth
2012-03-12 06:03:02 pm
... Why use IS? The route doesn't call for it. You pass by the same area later in the game and it takes ~35 seconds if done properly, versus about a minute and a half that IS takes
Hazel
2012-03-12 10:37:34 pm
rocks, locks, and invisible blocks
wait, why do I ever come back to phen shorelines again?

Also 1:56:231 at PQ, I'd upload a video but over abundance of dail up is making that impossible
tate
2012-03-13 08:52:39 am
And if you get early plasma before getting to phen you remove the need for IS, what route are you taking for this tas?
Quietus
2012-03-13 08:58:36 am
Super Secret Area - Dead Ahead!
[ask-the-obvious]
Has the route not been planned prior to starting?
[/ask-the-obvious]
Baby Sheegoth
2012-03-13 10:03:26 am
Segment 8, you fight back through Thardus, leave via the door you're supposed to come in, travel through Phendrana toward Magmoor (Monitor Station) & on the way to Magmoor you leave Phendrana Shorelines and grab Sun. Costs at the most 50 seconds in a proper run, you could probably bump that down to 35 or 30.
itsPersonnal
2012-03-13 03:47:27 pm
I was thinking something like
SJ
missile
ball bombs Icebeam
Varia
Wild 1
artifact in the rock in magmoor 2
plasma
Lifegiver 3
Other magmoor artifact 4
Sun 5
Wave
Boost
Spider
Phen artifacts/ Power Bomb exp 6 7
Main Power Bombs
Warrior/x-ray and artifact (idk which would come first) 8 7
World 10
Phazon + newborn 11
last artifact 12/ finish game


This clearly slow as fuck, but I think with a few adjustments it would be faster then miles' route if it were tool assisted 
itsPersonnal
2012-03-13 03:54:06 pm
I forgot charge <_<
itsPersonnal
2012-03-13 04:10:19 pm
and ice spreader <_______<

Speaking of which, someone should like map out the prime fight, I would like to know how many missiles are needed, iirc you do the same amount of damage each phase in phase one of the fight, iirc super missiles are skipped in a speedrun so wave and power beam don't need missiles and 1/4 of the damage to prime won't use missiles ether,

round 2 has ice beam in it so I assume we can manipulate Ice beam to come up at the start then use ice spreader twice which I think does more then 1/3 of the damage needed to finish off each floor/round of this fight, Then we can test whether Wave or Power does damage faster

round 3 has all 4 beams, we can manipulate this round to have just ice and plasma come up

Round 4 has random switches, I think we can keep ice beam on almost the whole round here

Phase 2 can most likely be done in 2 rounds and because of awesomeness will not need thermal to be fast
Baby Sheegoth
Baby Sheegoth
Edit history:
Baby Sheegoth: 2012-03-13 05:21:40 pm
Baby Sheegoth: 2012-03-13 05:17:16 pm
Baby Sheegoth: 2012-03-13 05:14:54 pm
Baby Sheegoth: 2012-03-13 05:14:51 pm
Baby Sheegoth: 2012-03-13 05:14:50 pm
Baby Sheegoth: 2012-03-13 05:14:45 pm
2012-03-13 05:11:01 pm
Single Segment right? (well, one save)

>Frigate
>SJF
>Main Plaza Missile
>Morphball
>Missile Expansion
>Charge
>Morph Ball Bomb
>Missile Expansion
>Ice Beam Before Flaahgra
>Chozo Ghost/Activate HOTE
>Climb Arboretum
>Flaahgra
>Early Wild
>Artifact of Nature
>Through Magmoor normally
>Quick Phendrana Shorelines
>Boost Ball
>Wave
>Down to Magmoor
>Plasma
>Phendrana's Edge Power Bomb
>Artifact of Spirit
>Pirate Labs
>Artifact of Elder
>Thardus/Spider Ball
>Phendrana Shorelines
>Artifact of Sun
>Down to Monitor Station
>Artifact of Strength
>Warrior Shrine Power Bomb (Maybe skip if its faster by a lot & you can manipulate enemies to give you drops quicker than it is to get this)
>Ice Spreader
>Tallon Elevator
>Chozo
>Artifact of Lifegiver
>Down to Tallon
>Fast Frigate Crash Site Climb
>HOTE & Artifact of World
>Down to Tallon
>Fast Great Tree Hall climb
>X-Ray Visor
>Artifact of Chozo
>DBJ over Great Tree Hall Bars
>Fast Waste Disposal dash
>Elite Pirate Skip
>Elite Pirate Skip
>Main Power Bomb
>MQA Normally
>Omega Pirate PowerBomb Strategy
>Artifact of Newborn
>Climb Phazon Processing Core
>Backwards Elite Pirate Skip
>Climb Spider Shafts
>Artifact of Warrior
>Finish Game

Missed a few expansions but yeah you get the idea. I'm still curious at the possibility of skipping lower mines in favour of going Omega Research>Vent Shaft>Elite Research>PPC>Whatever this room is>OP room
itsPersonnal
2012-03-13 05:37:05 pm
Yeah the lower mines skip would be awesome, but we need newborn and afaik you need to wall crawl twice to get this artifact...
Jerry9
2012-03-13 06:20:48 pm
not evil,just hungry
ice spreader should be skipped in tas runs.
http://tasvideos.org/forum/viewtopic.php?p=289233#289233
Hazel
2012-03-13 06:37:50 pm
rocks, locks, and invisible blocks
Thats awesome, I guess that more missiles can be skipped in this TAS then I was thinking
Baby Sheegoth
2012-03-13 07:59:00 pm
So no missiles/ones that would take 2 seconds to get?
Baby Sheegoth
Baby Sheegoth
Edit history:
Baby Sheegoth: 2012-03-13 08:15:13 pm
Baby Sheegoth: 2012-03-13 08:10:50 pm
2012-03-13 08:10:10 pm
Confirmed Route
>Frigate
>Space Jump First
>Main Plaza Missile
>Morphball
>Missile Expansion in Alcove
>Charge
>Morph Ball Bomb
>Ice Beam Before Flaahgra
>Chozo Ghost/Activate HOTE
>Climb 'dark' Arboretum
>Flaahgra
>Early Wild
>Artifact of Nature
>Through Magmoor
>Quick Monitor Station and Phendrana Shorelines
>Boost Ball
>Wave
>Plasma
>Phendrana's Edge Power Bomb
>Artifact of Spirit
>Pirate Labs
>Artifact of Elder
>Thardus/Spider Ball
>Artifact of Sun
>Down to Monitor Station
>Artifact of Strength
>Tallon Elevator
>Artifact of Lifegiver
>Fast Frigate Crash Site Climb
>HOTE & Artifact of World
>Down to Tallon
>Fast Great Tree Hall climb
>X-Ray Visor
>Artifact of Chozo
>DBJ over Great Tree Hall Bars
>Fast Waste Disposal dash
>Elite Pirate Skip
>Elite Pirate Skip
>Main Power Bomb
>MQA Normally
>Omega Pirate PowerBomb Strategy
>Artifact of Newborn
>Climb Phazon Processing Core
>Backwards Elite Pirate Skip
>Climb Spider Shafts
>Artifact of Warrior
>Finish Game

_________________________________________________
Possibly Faster Route
>Frigate
>Space Jump First
>Main Plaza Missile
>Morphball
>Missile Expansion in Alcove
>Charge
>Morph Ball Bomb
>Ice Beam Before Flaahgra
>Chozo Ghost/Activate HOTE
>Climb 'dark' Arboretum
>Flaahgra
>Early Wild
>Artifact of Nature
>Through Magmoor
>Quick Monitor Station and Phendrana Shorelines
>Boost Ball
>Wave
>Plasma
>Phendrana's Edge Power Bomb
>Artifact of Spirit
>Pirate Labs
>Artifact of Elder
>Backtrack through Labs, Thardus Dash
>Artifact of Sun
>Down to Monitor Station
>Artifact of Strength
>Tallon Elevator
>Artifact of Lifegiver
>Fast Frigate Crash Site Climb
>HOTE & Artifact of World
>Down to Tallon
>Fast Great Tree Hall climb
>X-Ray Visor
>Artifact of Chozo
>DBJ over Great Tree Hall Bars
>Fast Waste Disposal dash
>Elite Pirate Skip
>Elite Pirate Skip
>Main Power Bomb
>Omega Research Secret World to Omega Pirate
>Newborn
>Secret World VIA Metroid Quarantine B
>Climb past Phazon Processing Core, Spider Ball Shafts
>Artifact of Warrior
>Finish Game
tate
2012-03-13 08:46:24 pm
wave boost plasma is likely faster there sheegoth, i don't fully remember the outcome of the timings of my tests but going through the thardus room to get to plasma was slightly faster and a tas will be able to pull the reverse thardus jump that was not part of my timing which will likely make it much much faster.
itsPersonnal
2012-03-14 12:05:18 am
Damn dail up not letting me log in <_<

ok so 25 (5) missiles seems to be the minimum

Phazon Elile: 24 missiles
Phazon Pirate: 10
Omega Pirate: ??
Metroid Prime: 0

So, the main plaza missile, the missile before charge beam ,the missile in the room beside the frigate crash site, the missile before life grove (via DBJ) and _______
itsPersonnal
2012-03-14 12:08:24 am
oh idea: we could kill a pirate beside the phazon elite and have it drop a missile refill then walk into it sometime between the 4th and 20th missile fired
Baby Sheegoth
2012-03-14 01:35:27 am
Quote from itsPersonnal:
So, the main plaza missile, the missile before charge beam ,the missile in the room beside the frigate crash site, the missile before life grove (via DBJ) and _______

One after Incinerator Drone
Baby Sheegoth
2012-03-14 01:18:35 pm
Subject line = post
But yes. That missile costs about 4 seconds if I recall correctly
itsPersonnal
2012-03-14 03:50:52 pm
Well the missile before charge beam and the missile in the room beside the frigate crash site both cost like under a second, I think there might be a faster missile then the one in gathering hall (and the one outside life grove is a little longer then I thought at first, so that's a maybe for now)
ptorflaxendrosis
2012-03-14 04:44:28 pm
What about getting both available expansions in Main Plaza? or the one in that room in Phazon Mines with the exploding box and the 2 wave pirates?

It seems to me like the Gathering Hall expansion is kinda slow.. We need to think of expansions that don't force you to deviate from the route too much. Preferably only a second or two
Hazel
Hazel
Edit history:
Hazel: 2012-03-14 05:18:16 pm
2012-03-14 05:16:23 pm
rocks, locks, and invisible blocks
Quality is ass, I will have a 1440p WIP with audio on my main channel once dolphin decides to stop being dumb and actually work the way emulators should.


Yay
Baby Sheegoth
Baby Sheegoth
Edit history:
Baby Sheegoth: 2012-03-14 05:19:56 pm
2012-03-14 05:18:19 pm
These are all assuming if you don't fuck it up
Main Plaza 1 (0 seconds)
Watery Hall Access (1 second)
Gathering Hall (5 seconds)
Fungal Hall B (3 seconds)