Idea complete game sub 50 minutes

Edit history:

Secretkey: 2007-11-24 05:13:45 am

2007-11-24 05:10:49 am

Nice to hear BioSpark!
By the way I have also started my run the day before yesterday and like you I just reached the savepoint before Serris - with a time of 0:12
You wanna battle ? Wink

No seriously: Your 12 is definitely lower than my. I think I have a time of 12:30-35, but I neither went for perfect eye door shots nor for 3-4 wasted jumps in the Zazabi battle. In fact I had 6 wasted jumps and two times the eye door shoot at me (one before Arachnus and one before eye core X). Wow...I hate this random stuff so much. Fortunately I pulled of the double core X shots in the Arachnus and Zazabi battle.

I guess, I have to practise now the underwater wall jump
Again, good luck BioSpark with your run!

edit: I looked again at your idea of the segments. Do you really think, the save right after the battle with serris is necessary?

BioSpark

2007-11-24 12:51:05 pm

Quote from Secretkey:

I looked again at your idea of the segments. Do you really think, the save right after the battle with serris is necessary?

Probably not, but I wouldn't be able to try the pixel perfect shinespark. I'll test and see if the slower method is faster than saving.

uNsane

Edit history:

uNsane: 2007-11-24 01:45:00 pm

2007-11-24 01:36:59 pm

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Hmm... I'm at 0:12 at the beginning of AQA... maybe I'm better than I thought. Either way, I'm going for getting Serris in two hits and getting the low height shinespark all in one segment. It's not as easy, but I'm also not going for a perfect eye door (which of had happen maybe twice in upwards of thirty attempts).

As for whether or not the slower method is better than saving, it really depends upon whether you can kill all the crabs while still running. It's not easy, but if you can build up a charge between each one, you won't even have to aim downwards. I think there shouldn't be too much of a problem, so long as you can press R as soon as you get the charge while running. Unfortunately, there is still the possibility of not having enough time (I would also have to test this, but I only will if I, say, miss the low height shinespark immediately after Serris), so maybe saving would be a better idea. I myself, in your position, would most likely save before Serris and go for a good eye door/Serris/Core/shinespark all in one segment, even if it would mean many, many more tries.

EDIT: It is quite possible and even fairly easy to build a charge between each crab, so long as you fire straight forwards about a second or so after you get it.

Hmm... I'm at 0:12 at the beginning of AQA... maybe I'm better than I thought. Either way, I'm going for getting Serris in two hits and getting the low height shinespark all in one segment. It's not as easy, but I'm also not going for a perfect eye door (which of had happen maybe twice in upwards of thirty attempts).

As for whether or not the slower method is better than saving, it really depends upon whether you can kill all the crabs while still running. It's not easy, but if you can build up a charge between each one, you won't even have to aim downwards. I think there shouldn't be too much of a problem, so long as you can press R as soon as you get the charge while running. Unfortunately, there is still the possibility of not having enough time (I would also have to test this, but I only will if I, say, miss the low height shinespark immediately after Serris), so maybe saving would be a better idea. I myself, in your position, would most likely save before Serris and go for a good eye door/Serris/Core/shinespark all in one segment, even if it would mean many, many more tries.

EDIT: It is quite possible and even fairly easy to build a charge between each crab, so long as you fire straight forwards about a second or so after you get it.

BioSpark

2007-11-24 01:53:21 pm

I tested the shinespark, it only saves around 2 seconds, so I'll want to skip the save and use the easier method.

BioSpark

2007-11-25 12:35:20 am

UPDATE
Serris fight was good, with everything perfect including the underwater walljump afterwards. Only mistake was a rather stupid one when I missed the last jump right before the recharge room. Saved in sector 4 with 0:14.

MASTER-88

Edit history:

MASTER-88: 2007-11-25 02:44:42 pm

2007-11-25 10:57:02 am

Speedrunner

Quote from BioSpark:

UPDATE
Serris fight was good, with everything perfect including the underwater walljump afterwards. Only mistake was a rather stupid one when I missed the last jump right before the recharge room. Saved in sector 4 with 0:14.

Sounds nice. You have at least one minutes ahead my 52 minutes run. I got about 13.20-30 before Serris. Wassup time was definitely very high 12 minutes, because after AQA i was less than 45 seconds behind WR.

How much under water wall jump save time? It looks slow, but many TAS use still that. My opinion it is too hard make fast enought on console.

Mean you 2 round Box battle= You kill that after 1 bomb. I kill as well, but once i was very close kill him in one round but it really is too hard/frustrating trick on speedrun.

I see you use my idea skip save before NOC first visit. :)
I think save skip after Mega-X can good idea as well, but it require good manipulate luck with enemy locations after boss. But savepoint back of corner took more than 8 seconds. even 12-15 seconds if in game time run when you go in door.

[quote="BioSpark"]
UPDATE
Serris fight was good, with everything perfect including the underwater walljump afterwards. Only mistake was a rather stupid one when I missed the last jump right before the recharge room. Saved in sector 4 with 0:14.
[/quote]

Sounds nice. You have at least one minutes ahead my 52 minutes run. I got about 13.20-30 before Serris. Wassup time was definitely very high 12 minutes, because after AQA i was less than 45 seconds behind WR.

How much under water wall jump save time? It looks slow, but many TAS use still that. My opinion it is too hard make fast enought on console.

Mean you 2 round Box battle= You kill that after 1 bomb. I kill as well, but once i was very close kill him in one round but it really is too hard/frustrating trick on speedrun.

I see you use my idea skip save before NOC first visit.  :)
I think save skip after Mega-X can good idea as well, but it require good manipulate luck with enemy locations after boss. But savepoint back of corner took more than 8 seconds. even 12-15 seconds if in game time run when you go in door.

BioSpark

2007-11-25 03:08:01 pm

In-game time does not run during door transitions.

Basically for the box fight, after the first round I only need about 3 shots, so I fire those diagonally after it shoots out the bomb.

MASTER-88

2007-11-25 03:16:57 pm

Speedrunner

Quote from BioSpark:

In-game time does not run during door transitions.

Basically for the box fight, after the first round I only need about 3 shots, so I fire those diagonally after it shoots out the bomb.

This sounds like same as my battle my 52.xx run. But my best attempt ever is i need only one missile shot after first bomb come out. 0 bomb is possible but so hard IMO. There is no reason use save point before boss on any-% run. Probably save before robot is good idea 100% run only.

Secretkey

2007-11-25 10:14:07 pm

Like MASTER-88 I think it is a good idea to skip the save after Mega-X. I know, the positions of some enemies are really annoying, but imo it is worse to lose time by saving and loading than getting hit one time by an enemy. Even if you have to reset it is not that bad, since a perfect Mega-X is not that hard to reproduce- if you ask me.

MASTER-88

2007-11-26 07:20:41 am

Speedrunner

Quote from Secretkey:

Like MASTER-88 I think it is a good idea to skip the save after Mega-X. I know, the positions of some enemies are really annoying, but imo it is worse to lose time by saving and loading than getting hit one time by an enemy. Even if you have to reset it is not that bad, since a perfect Mega-X is not that hard to reproduce- if you ask me.

Yeah. I already test save point too but it was always bit slower than save less segment.
I think Biospark shot all double core-X shot, i not never good at this. I sometimes can hit one double core-X SM shot if i am luck enought. But still save point don,t save enought.

I decide got perfect eyedoor, fast 4-5 hits Mega-X and near perfect enemy locations after boss. i remember only 2 enemys was wrong place in my run. This not take enought time, i lose at most 2-3 seconds game time about this.

Save skip is definitely good idea IMO and it save alot time for me. But yeah it depend how good you are shot double core-X shots. Perfect eyedoor, perfect battle and all double shots and perfect enemys locations in one go can so big luck base. But if you miss something example double core-X shot or eye beam it is still faster skip save point IMO. That save took at least 10-11 seconds too much time.

Same i think underwater area save. There is no good reason use that savepoint. Underwater area is one easiest level in the game. And now you can skip that crazy shinespark end of sector 4. You can use simple faster space jump method here. It is 1 seconds faster and 90% easier than shine spark jump what Wassup use.

[quote="Secretkey"]
Like MASTER-88 I think it is a good idea to skip the save after Mega-X. I know, the positions of some enemies are really annoying, but imo it is worse to lose time by saving and loading than getting hit one time by an enemy. Even if you have to reset it is not that bad, since a perfect Mega-X is not that hard to reproduce- if you ask me.
[/quote]

Yeah. I already test save point too but it was always bit slower than save less segment.
I think Biospark shot all double core-X shot,  i not never good at this. I sometimes can hit one double core-X SM shot if i am luck enought. But still save point don,t save enought.

I decide got perfect eyedoor, fast 4-5 hits Mega-X and near perfect enemy locations after boss. i remember only 2 enemys was wrong place in my run. This not take enought time, i lose at most 2-3 seconds game time about this.

Save skip is definitely good idea IMO and it save alot time for me. But yeah it depend how good you are shot double core-X shots. Perfect eyedoor, perfect battle and all double shots and perfect enemys locations in one go can so big luck base. But if you miss something example double core-X shot or eye beam it is still faster skip save point IMO. That save took at least 10-11 seconds too much time.

Same i think underwater area save. There is no good reason use that savepoint. Underwater area is one easiest level in the game. And now you can skip that crazy shinespark end of sector 4. You can use simple faster space jump method here. It is 1 seconds faster and 90% easier than shine spark jump what Wassup use.

Secretkey

2007-11-26 08:40:19 am

Quote from MASTER-88:

And now you can skip that crazy shinespark end of sector 4. You can use simple faster space jump method here. It is 1 seconds faster and 90% easier than shine spark jump what Wassup use.

Do you mean that upwords shinespark, where you leave the underwater area and enter normal sector 4?

MASTER-88

Edit history:

MASTER-88: 2007-11-26 08:58:18 am

2007-11-26 08:54:48 am

Speedrunner

Yes i mean. :)

You can use shine space jump through tentacle/room. Next room you can rise up with simply space jump. Actually it is faster than shine jump, but only one seconds faster when i timed it. But absolutely much easier way.

BioSpark

2007-11-26 11:36:50 am

I'll think about these during the week. I'll also test them myself because I'm sure my methods could be different. The only problem with them is that there is a tricky boss fight before each one.

MASTER-88

2007-12-09 09:53:01 am

Speedrunner

I don,t hear your run.

Any new segments done?

BioSpark

2007-12-09 11:38:18 am

I tried a segment last night (the one with box). The hardest part is the pixel-perfect speedtrick in the beginning of sector 3. I should have saved in sector 3 because I have to go through two long adam conversations and two long elevator rides every time I don't get the trick right.

MASTER-88

2007-12-09 11:44:56 am

Speedrunner

Yeah i use always save point in Sector 3 entrance after cutscenes/elevators. This save is only at most 2 seconds slower than Sector 4 save what Wassup use. Wink

Yeah pixel perfect shine is really hard. I not still use that my 52 run. It save bit time and it looks cool when you recorded this run.

Good luck. Wink

JaggerG

2007-12-10 04:40:24 am

Shifty Leader

That M2k2 guy

It's probably more like three seconds because she doesn't run very fast. Don't you need to at least be touching the ramp to the left of the save point? I forget.

I imagine that segment's also frustrating because of the Bob area shine-charge on the edge of the speed block. Both those tricks are probably harder than the BOX quick-kill. Then there are the birds and the side-hoppers that are pretty lethal. :^\

uNsane

2007-12-11 09:26:32 am

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

For the beginning shinespark, I have found that it's easiest when you're high enough on the ramp to the left of the save so that when you shoot the door open, the bottom part of your beam will just barely clear the ground. I've also found that the charge in the room below bob tends to be harder than the one at the very beginning, but that's most likely because I have terrible reactions and more practice with the falling shinecharge due to my having saved inside PYR.

BioSpark

2007-12-11 11:44:27 am

I actually find the second shinespark quite easy. Also, I've decided that I'm not using the tricky shinespark in the beginning because it takes too many tries to get and I don't want to waste 289719874 hours recording.

MASTER-88

2007-12-11 12:28:56 pm

Speedrunner

Quote from BioSpark:

I actually find the second shinespark quite easy. Also, I've decided that I'm not using the tricky shinespark in the beginning because it takes too many tries to get and I don't want to waste 289719874 hours recording.

Yeah this is pretty uncessary trick. It save probably 3 seconds, but it looks cool.

This game includes second one tricky shine spark too. After Habitation deck segment. After Sector 5 entrance. You need pixel perfect shine spark too. Wassup use that. I not use, because i have as well much trouble make these sparks

I don,t know how much this save your time. This is very nasty one too if you skip sector 5 save.

BioSpark

2007-12-11 06:51:01 pm

I save right before that one, so it shouldn't be a problem.

JaggerG

2007-12-11 11:18:48 pm

Shifty Leader

That M2k2 guy

I dunno, man, that beginning shinespark is a really good one. If you plan to accept a segment that doesn't use it, IMO the rest of the segment should be amazing or better. Since this is the segment that reminds the audience that Bob has never been skipped on console, it's especially important to make it a good segment.

MASTER-88

Edit history:

MASTER-88: 2007-12-12 06:43:56 am

2007-12-12 06:13:44 am

Speedrunner

Quote from BioSpark:

I save right before that one, so it shouldn't be a problem.

'

Your orginal idea was skip save and go habitation deck and sector 5 in one go:
Segment 12
-tricky segment
-go through habitation deck
-go through sector 5 again
-save in ship

Is this faster use shine and use sector 5 save or skip save and skip shine? We know save took 8 seconds game time.

Wassup skip save and use shine. You come lose here 8 important seconds Wassup time. This not that good. I can say Escape sequence, habitation deck and Sector 5 PB segments are best Wassup run parts his run. This was only parts where i lose over 20 seconds Wassup total time.

Alternate: You can use my method too:
-Try go escape sequence and habitation deck in one go. Habitation deck don,t includes major luck bases, only expect is that first enemy room. There is easier and bit slower method completed that. I have too much trouble use WR method here, but how about you?

But i trust you. You know what you do in future run Wink

[quote="BioSpark"]
I save right before that one, so it shouldn't be a problem.
[/quote]'

Your orginal idea was skip save and go habitation deck and sector 5 in one go:
 Segment 12
-tricky segment
-go through habitation deck
-go through sector 5 again
-save in ship

Is this faster use shine and use sector 5 save or skip save and skip shine? We know save took 8 seconds game time.

Wassup skip save and use shine. You come lose here 8 important seconds Wassup time. This not that good. I can say Escape sequence, habitation deck and Sector 5 PB segments are best Wassup run parts his run. This was only parts where i lose over 20 seconds Wassup total time.

Alternate: You can use my method too:
-Try go escape sequence and habitation deck in one go. Habitation deck don,t includes major luck bases, only expect is that first enemy room. There is easier and bit slower method completed that. I have too much trouble use WR method here, but how about you?

But i trust you. You know what you do in future run :wink:

BioSpark

2007-12-14 11:08:31 pm

iirc the shinespark is in the first time I visit sector 5. You're talking about the second one.

MASTER-88

Edit history:

MASTER-88: 2007-12-15 10:13:40 am

2007-12-15 06:58:25 am

Speedrunner

Quote from BioSpark:

iirc the shinespark is in the first time I visit sector 5. You're talking about the second one.

Yeah i talking about second one. But what you mean with this?:

Segment 10
-do the tricky shinespark
-save at end of sector 5

Yellow security door is locked your first visit. What you mean with this shine spark?

E:
Wait mean you this?:

http://www.metroid2002.com/fusion/speed_tricks_arc.php

This looks incredible hard. Save only 3 seconds.