Discussing the rules

KennyMan666

2008-11-22 11:08:33 am

Viking

Precursor

Did it just the other day in the hacks forum.

Folkskygg

(user is banned)

Folkskygg

Edit history:

Folkskygg: 2008-11-27 10:16:25 pm

2008-11-27 09:55:05 pm

I see now that the drug thread is locked(no problem with that) but admins continuing the discussion about what is right and what is wrong to discuss in the forum. This is the place to discuss such things not only because this thread regards rules but let us have an opinion also. I tthink discussing illicit activities in context should be no problem.

edit: and please don't have private chats in locked threads(that were so bad). Do it in social topic or start new ones
edit2: the Obama thread is a good example

Phazar

2008-11-27 11:13:58 pm

...

Usually around here, threads becoming locked is a sign of a topic getting out of hand. I agree that discussing illegal activities such as drugs, however, is asking for an immediate lock. I have stopped posting in the Boardwalk for the time being, due to the nature of some of its threads and the number of warnings I receive there. There are at least six locked topics there on the first page!

BioSpark

2008-11-27 11:22:56 pm

If you guys would stop screwing it up we wouldn't have to lock them. :o

Folkskygg

(user is banned)

Folkskygg

Edit history:

Folkskygg: 2008-11-27 11:42:03 pm

2008-11-27 11:26:24 pm

Quote from Phazar:

Usually around here, threads becoming locked is a sign of a topic getting out of hand. I agree that discussing illegal activities such as drugs, however, is asking for an immediate lock. I have stopped posting in the Boardwalk for the time being, due to the nature of some of its threads and the number of warnings I receive there. There are at least six locked topics there on the first page!

Yes I agree with you but my point is that these locked thread should not be a private chat place for admins after they're locked. There are other threads for that. Or if they have something to add regarding the subject the thread should be unlocked.

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Folkskygg

(user is banned)

2008-11-27 11:27:23 pm

Quote from BioSpark:

If you guys would stop screwing it up we wouldn't have to lock them. :o

Can't you see my point instead?

Phazar

2008-11-27 11:32:01 pm

...

Quote from Folkskygg:

these locked thread should not be a private chat place for admins after they're locked

I don't see anything unfair about that. Mods/admins have the power they have, and are free to use it however they want, within good reason.

Folkskygg

(user is banned)

2008-11-27 11:33:49 pm

Quote from Phazar:

Quote from Folkskygg:

these locked thread should not be a private chat place for admins after they're locked

I don't see anything unfair about that. Mods/admins have the power they have, and are free to use it however they want, within good reason.

I think the admins should set a good example. Don't you?

Opium

2008-11-27 11:41:26 pm

It is kinda bad when they continue talking in a locked thread.

Folkskygg

(user is banned)

Folkskygg

Edit history:

Folkskygg: 2008-11-27 11:59:18 pm

2008-11-27 11:45:52 pm

Quote from Opium:

It is kinda bad when they continue talking in a locked thread.

Yes read the last posts in the Obama thread for agood example. Tneir chit-chat shall be in the social topic like they refer to other users

tomatobob

2008-11-28 12:22:53 am

One shall stand, one shall ball.

The posts at the end of the Obama thread wouldn't have made any sense in the social topic and you can't honestly expect the mods to be serious business all the time, a little post lock mod joking never hurt anyone.

And Ark's comment at the end of the drugs thread was pretty relevant as it was pertaining to the reason for the thread being locked. Lighten up people.

Folkskygg

(user is banned)

2008-11-28 12:41:51 am

Quote from tomatobob:

The posts at the end of the Obama thread wouldn't have made any sense in the social topic and you can't honestly expect the mods to be serious business all the time, a little post lock mod joking never hurt anyone.

And Ark's comment at the end of the drugs thread was pretty relevant as it was pertaining to the reason for the thread being locked. Lighten up people.

What makes sense in social topic?? It's a bullshit-thread(not means the thread is bad only that bullshit talk is allowed).
And about Arks comment it's here it would have been posted concernig how they move OUR posts to different threads so they fit their subject. And sometime confuse us

tomatobob

2008-11-28 01:08:26 am

One shall stand, one shall ball.

Quote from Folkskygg:

What makes sense in social topic?? It's a bullshit-thread(not means the thread is bad only that bullshit talk is allowed).

Their posts would be completely out of context in the social topic, it may be a topic mostly consisting of bullshitting, but there is a context to it. Bring up points from a different topic doesn't make much sense. If you suggested the content of the posts be reserved for the chat or staff forum you might have had a point.

Quote:

And about Arks comment it's here it would have been posted concernig how they move OUR posts to different threads so they fit their subject. And sometime confuse us

As for that, it again comes down to context, Jagger states why the topic is being locked and Ark comments on the fact that he is unsure of that reason. It would be on topic here but it seems a valid comment where it is so there's no reason to move anything. Posts get moved to the appropriate spot if it is needed, and in this particular case it doesn't seem terribly necessary to move any posts from that topic.

I think this topic is more for the normal users rather than the staff anyway, so if one of us wanted clarification on Jagger's point it could be brought up here. The mods tend discuss specifics of rules elsewhere unless it is brought up here by someone else, where it can become an issue for the community to contribute their thoughts as well.

That said, the discussion of illegal activities is not specifically covered in the rules, posting links to warez is outlawed but talking ROMs is (or has been) allowed, so I'm not entire sure of Jagger's reasoning there myself. Though, I can see other reasons for ending it so it isn't a big deal.

[quote="Folkskygg"]
What makes sense in social topic?? It's a bullshit-thread(not means the thread is bad only that bullshit talk is allowed).[/quote]

Their posts would be completely out of context in the social topic, it may be a topic mostly consisting of bullshitting, but there is a context to it. Bring up points from a different topic doesn't make much sense. If you suggested the content of the posts be reserved for the chat or staff forum you might have had a point.

[quote]And about Arks comment it's here it would have been posted concernig how they move OUR posts to different threads so they fit their subject. And sometime confuse us
[/quote]

As for that, it again comes down to context, Jagger states why the topic is being locked and Ark comments on the fact that he is unsure of that reason. It would be on topic here but it seems a valid comment where it is so there's no reason to move anything. Posts get moved to the appropriate spot if it is needed, and in this particular case it doesn't seem terribly necessary to move any posts from that topic.

I think this topic is more for the normal users rather than the staff anyway, so if one of us wanted clarification on Jagger's point it could be brought up here. The mods tend discuss specifics of rules elsewhere unless it is brought up here by someone else, where it can become an issue for the community to contribute their thoughts as well.

That said, the discussion of illegal activities is not specifically covered in the rules, posting links to warez is outlawed but talking ROMs is (or has been) allowed, so I'm not entire sure of Jagger's reasoning there myself. Though, I can see other reasons for ending it so it isn't a big deal.

Folkskygg

(user is banned)

2008-11-28 01:49:34 am

Quote from tomatobob:

Quote from Folkskygg:

What makes sense in social topic?? It's a bullshit-thread(not means the thread is bad only that bullshit talk is allowed).

Their posts would be completely out of context in the social topic, it may be a topic mostly consisting of bullshitting, but there is a context to it. Bring up points from a different topic doesn't make much sense. If you suggested the content of the posts be reserved for the chat or staff forum you might have had a point.

Quote:

And about Arks comment it's here it would have been posted concernig how they move OUR posts to different threads so they fit their subject. And sometime confuse us

As for that, it again comes down to context, Jagger states why the topic is being locked and Ark comments on the fact that he is unsure of that reason. It would be on topic here but it seems a valid comment where it is so there's no reason to move anything. Posts get moved to the appropriate spot if it is needed, and in this particular case it doesn't seem terribly necessary to move any posts from that topic.

I think this topic is more for the normal users rather than the staff anyway, so if one of us wanted clarification on Jagger's point it could be brought up here. The mods tend discuss specifics of rules elsewhere unless it is brought up here by someone else, where it can become an issue for the community to contribute their thoughts as well.

That said, the discussion of illegal activities is not specifically covered in the rules, posting links to warez is outlawed but talking ROMs is (or has been) allowed, so I'm not entire sure of Jagger's reasoning there myself. Though, I can see other reasons for ending it so it isn't a big deal.

First: Have you read the last posts in the Obama thread? Second: Regarding context it's irrelevant due to specific subjects if it's a discussion between regular users. I WANT to have have diskussions in any subject though some contain illicit activities etc. But if you discuss it in context it shall be no problem. Users who can't will get a warning or a ban if necessary. Some few people shall not ruin for others who wants to have a serious talk and make their point of view.

[quote="tomatobob"]
[quote="Folkskygg"]
What makes sense in social topic?? It's a bullshit-thread(not means the thread is bad only that bullshit talk is allowed).[/quote]

Their posts would be completely out of context in the social topic, it may be a topic mostly consisting of bullshitting, but there is a context to it. Bring up points from a different topic doesn't make much sense. If you suggested the content of the posts be reserved for the chat or staff forum you might have had a point.

[quote]And about Arks comment it's here it would have been posted concernig how they move OUR posts to different threads so they fit their subject. And sometime confuse us
[/quote]

As for that, it again comes down to context, Jagger states why the topic is being locked and Ark comments on the fact that he is unsure of that reason. It would be on topic here but it seems a valid comment where it is so there's no reason to move anything. Posts get moved to the appropriate spot if it is needed, and in this particular case it doesn't seem terribly necessary to move any posts from that topic.

I think this topic is more for the normal users rather than the staff anyway, so if one of us wanted clarification on Jagger's point it could be brought up here. The mods tend discuss specifics of rules elsewhere unless it is brought up here by someone else, where it can become an issue for the community to contribute their thoughts as well.

That said, the discussion of illegal activities is not specifically covered in the rules, posting links to warez is outlawed but talking ROMs is (or has been) allowed, so I'm not entire sure of Jagger's reasoning there myself. Though, I can see other reasons for ending it so it isn't a big deal.
[/quote]First: Have you read the last posts in the Obama thread? Second: Regarding context it's irrelevant due to specific subjects if it's a discussion between regular users. I WANT to have have diskussions in any subject though some contain illicit activities etc. But if you discuss it in context it shall be no problem. Users who can't will get a warning or a ban if necessary. Some few people shall not ruin for others who wants to have a serious talk and make their point of view.

arkarian

2008-11-28 02:09:57 am

red chamber dream

There's no rule against discussing illegal stuff, only against posting links to ROMs or other warez. I posted there to clarify because it made the most sense to post it there. I agree that in general mods shouldn't post in locked topics, but if they have a good reason, it's perfectly fine.

Is it unfair that normal users can't post in locked topics while mods can? Possibly, but that's just the way it goes. If the topic were never locked in the first place, it wouldn't be an issue.

Folkskygg

(user is banned)

Folkskygg

Edit history:

Folkskygg: 2008-11-28 02:28:24 am

2008-11-28 02:19:08 am

Quote from Arkarian:

There's no rule against discussing illegal stuff, only against posting links to ROMs or other warez. I posted there to clarify because it made the most sense to post it there. I agree that in general mods shouldn't post in locked topics, but if they have a good reason, it's perfectly fine.

Is it unfair that normal users can't post in locked topics while mods can? Possibly, but that's just the way it goes. If the topic were never locked in the first place, it wouldn't be an issue.

The thing is if we have a opinion about it. PM isn't the same thing. Luckily it was about forum rules this time so there was one thread for it and the questins could be ansewered. But in the Obama thread the last 5 posts is totally bullshit and you know it. quotation: "I was actually going to say that it was pretty funny telling someone they'll go to hell when they don't believe in it, but you locked this and nate said it anyway" and "Hey guys can I post here too lolol".....what sense does this make??

edit: The funny thing is that 4 admins take part in the last 5 posts that have no value at all not even for themselves

[quote="Arkarian"]
There's no rule against discussing illegal stuff, only against posting links to ROMs or other warez. I posted there to clarify because it made the most sense to post it there. I agree that in general mods shouldn't post in locked topics, but if they have a good reason, it's perfectly fine.

Is it unfair that normal users can't post in locked topics while mods can? Possibly, but that's just the way it goes. If the topic were never locked in the first place, it wouldn't be an issue.
[/quote]The thing is if we have a opinion about it. PM isn't the same thing. Luckily it was about forum rules this time so there was one thread for it and the questins could be ansewered. But in the Obama thread the last 5 posts is totally bullshit and you know it. quotation: "I was actually going to say that it was pretty funny telling someone they'll go to hell when they don't believe in it, but you locked this and nate said it anyway" and "Hey guys can I post here too lolol".....what sense does this make??

edit: The funny thing is that 4 admins take part in the last 5 posts that have no value at all not even for themselves

tomatobob

2008-11-28 02:38:08 am

One shall stand, one shall ball.

Two admins, and both actually made reasonable posts.

Seriously, I think you're making a bigger deal about this than is needed, if it was a bunch of pointless fluff after every locked topic, sure, but only one to my knowledge was anywhere near bad.

Quote from Folkskygg:

First: Have you read the last posts in the Obama thread?

One, I would not have addressed that point if I had not. Two:

Quote from tomatobob:

The posts at the end of the Obama thread wouldn't have made any sense in the social topic and you can't honestly expect the mods to be serious business all the time, a little post lock mod joking never hurt anyone. [...]
Lighten up people.

JaggerG

2008-11-28 10:12:00 am

Shifty Leader

That M2k2 guy

If that last post had been mine, I actually meant that to mock other mods that had continued discussion in the locked thread. Oddly enough, I posted nonsense in that locked thread BECAUSE I agree that locked threads should not get useless posts, so that they see that they're being so ridiculous.

As for my reasoning on locking the drugs thread, I'm basing it very roughly off of this rule:

Quote from Toozin:

No Explicit Material/Content – This is primarily a Metroid forum, and the possibility exists that many of our viewers may be under 18 years of age–– the legal adult age classification in America. As Metroid HQ is based out of the USA, we will adhere to the laws of this country and strictly forbid any material such as pornography, hentai, or erotic writing. Any user posting such things will be Banned.

It's not illegal to talk about such things, but to promote illegal activities on a forum that has several young teenagers seems to go against the spirit of the rule, though not the letter. Others have argued that it's the parents' role to protect their children, but that doesn't mean there should be an Anything Goes policy and their parents are responsible for not letting them read a specific thread.

Users could randomly come across the subject every so often and probably nobody's gonna holler at them, I just personally felt that thread shouldn't pop up in a forum of this nature. If I randomly noticed it some other random day and I happened to feel rather lazy, and that thread didn't really have so much heat, I might just inquire on the staff board if it is or is not against the rules, instead of taking charge and locking it on sight. It's just a very grey area for the time being.

If that last post had been mine, I actually meant that to mock other mods that had continued discussion in the locked thread. Oddly enough, I posted nonsense in that locked thread BECAUSE I agree that locked threads should not get useless posts, so that they see that they're being so ridiculous.

As for my reasoning on locking the drugs thread, I'm basing it very roughly off of this rule:
[quote="Toozin"]
No Explicit Material/Content – This is primarily a Metroid forum, and the possibility exists that many of our viewers may be under 18 years of age–– the legal adult age classification in America. As Metroid HQ is based out of the USA, we will adhere to the laws of this country and strictly forbid any material such as pornography, hentai, or erotic writing. Any user posting such things will be Banned.
[/quote]

It's not illegal to talk about such things, but to promote illegal activities on a forum that has several young teenagers seems to go against the spirit of the rule, though not the letter. Others have argued that it's the parents' role to protect their children, but that doesn't mean there should be an Anything Goes policy and their parents are responsible for not letting them read a specific thread.

Users could randomly come across the subject every so often and probably nobody's gonna holler at them, I just personally felt that thread shouldn't pop up in a forum of this nature. If I randomly noticed it some other random day and I happened to feel rather lazy, and that thread didn't really have so much heat, I might just inquire on the staff board if it is or is not against the rules, instead of taking charge and locking it on sight. It's just a very grey area for the time being.

Phazar

2008-11-28 10:38:22 am

...

Quote from JaggerG:

to promote illegal activities on a forum that has several young teenagers seems to go against the spirit of the rule, though not the letter.

Considering that, topics like that should start getting deleted. If they're only locked, they can still be read.

JaggerG

2008-11-28 11:18:29 am

Shifty Leader

That M2k2 guy

At this time, I doubt that's going to happen, considering our guidelines as moderators only make rare exceptions for removing posts from the public eye. At least if they do happen upon the threads, they're clearly locked, and they can often times understand the reasons for the lock. Most of the time, if it's ambiguous, a mod may explain the reason it's locked.

Also, as ark and kenny have mentioned, it isn't explicitly against the current forum rules. Discussion of ROMs isn't deleted currently, so there's a moral dilemma that doesn't let us go so far. Do our values go against our morals? Do they directly go against our morals? Are immoral values causing us to try to make excuses? The solutions are probably either really simply or very complex.

Phazar

2008-11-28 12:30:22 pm

...

Well, IMO, ROMs are perfectly legal as long as you already own the game yourself. Now, if you are downloading ROMs of games you don't own--then that's illegal.

KennyMan666

2008-11-28 12:47:22 pm

Viking

Precursor

Quote from Phazar:

Well, IMO, ROMs are perfectly legal as long as you already own the game yourself.

Common misbelief.

You're allowed to have a backup of software you yourself own, however - you have to have created it yourself, so for a ROM to be actually legal, you have to dump it yourself directly from the cartridge. And you're not allowed to actually USE it unless your original ceases functioning, if I recall correctly.

Phazar

2008-11-28 05:52:18 pm

...

Solution: find a way to import games from the cartridge or disk to the computer.

JaggerG

2008-11-29 05:27:52 am

Shifty Leader

That M2k2 guy

That's generally called "dumping it yourself directly from the cartridge."

Also, legality is not simply a matter of opinion. You can have an opinion about the morality of an action, but that doesn't make it legal.

Folkskygg

(user is banned)

2008-11-29 12:16:57 pm

I want to thank the admins for very good replies. Made a lot of things more clearly. But I hope the Hack/fangames thread will not be locked because it's the best on the forum just know(my opinion). Better than anyone(read locked threads) before also actually. If you close that one I'm outta here because that's the best that happend to me lately regarding games. Cliffhanger especially.