Best Times

2007-04-15 02:16:59 am

Cpadolf:

32 at gunship means 41 min clear time. 30 min is ABSOLUTE MINIMUM that you need to have if aiming for sub 40.
Gate hater:
Freeze those floating things, take some speed from those and to a smooth fast mockball to the gate room.
Gravity suit shine (if you mean it):
Kill the enemies out of the way, wait until the water is low and start moving to the right, you press dash twice on the right moments when in the water room, and while the door transition is going on press dash down and keep it down. When in the "bridge" you load the shine and fly through that spike room.
Those jumping "plants" in PB room:
Take enemy boost from them. It's hella easy in comparison to some tricks in this game.

Lance Uppercut:

Hotarubi could not do 32 min SS on PAL-version, no way ever. It's not like "10 minutes from NTSC" but it's harder to speedrun, slower, etc. Doors open slower and there are some annoying version differences. Although many TASers have said otherwise, I have the feeling that the clock goes differently in PAL. I'm probably wrong.

Yes, my overall speed is not all that good but I can work on that. I'm sure that when trying a sub 40 segmented I have to keep on amazing overall speed. 8-)

And if I ever get my times on SDA, they will probably be "best any% on PAL" or something like that. NTSC would be nice to try, but it isn't my thing. I can promise to you that when I get my laptop back I might try a SS run on keyboard, although I'm not all that good with it. Rolling Eyes

My TAS is only average if even that, but I personally like it. Aiming for sub 30 there.

Lance, I've always written it Hotarubi, don't blame me. :P

Cpadolf:

32 at gunship means 41 min clear time. 30 min is ABSOLUTE MINIMUM that you need to have if aiming for sub 40. 
Gate hater:
Freeze those floating things, take some speed from those and to a smooth fast mockball to the gate room.
Gravity suit shine (if you mean it): 
Kill the enemies out of the way, wait until the water is low and start moving to the right, you press dash twice on the right moments when in the water room, and while the door transition is going on press dash down and keep it down. When in the "bridge" you load the shine and fly through that spike room.
Those jumping "plants" in PB room:
Take enemy boost from them. It's hella easy in comparison to some tricks in this game.

Lance Uppercut:

Hotarubi could not do 32 min SS on PAL-version, no way ever. It's not like "10 minutes from NTSC" but it's harder to speedrun, slower, etc. Doors open slower and there are some annoying version differences. Although many TASers have said otherwise, I have the feeling that the clock goes differently in PAL. I'm probably wrong.

Yes, my overall speed is not all that good but I can work on that. I'm sure that when trying a sub 40 segmented I [b]have[/b] to keep on amazing overall speed.  8-)

And if I ever get my times on SDA, they will probably be "best any% on PAL" or something like that. NTSC would be nice to try, but it isn't my thing. I can promise to you that when I get my laptop back I might try a SS run on keyboard, although I'm not all that good with it.  :roll:

My TAS is only average if even that, but I personally like it. Aiming for sub 30 there.

Lance, I've always written it Hotarubi, don't blame me. :P

Cpadolf

2007-04-15 05:32:05 am

Almost happy

Yea i take the blame for whriting Hotaburi, for some reason i have managed to missread his name about 150 times and therfore thought his name was Hotaburi aiwebs_016

And Tonski i don't mean those enemys, )and yes i take boost from them) i mean the flowers on the ground that hold you in for 5-10 seaconds... i usualy don't get stuck in them but when you do in a good segment you just want to smash things.

And about both the tricks i were having problem with, i know how to do the i just can't, well i can do gravitysuit charge but i fail often...

And yes of course i will be aiming for 30 at the ship sub 40 pal whould just be awsome but if i find it to hard i will 31 as an option 40 is also great, it's only the thig that sub 40 sounds so good 8-)

Yea i could imagine Hotarubi getting 35-36 on PAL, no lower.

Lance Uppercut

2007-04-15 07:49:18 am

Well yeah, maybe those PAL times are meant to be a little higher, but dont try to think it is the clock here that matters the most.

Setting that time thingie aside, I just wanted to help you get some ideas how to make your overall speed better, Tonski. It would be nice if everyone could help each other here. Well, I failed miserably because my gameplay sucks and I play the wrong version, so lets just forget that. Luckily, you seem to know precisely how to adjust your gameplay all the time. Maybe I was stupid to ask some sample of both of your gameplay too, I should also be more aggressive on my own when it comes to improving my overall playing.

I got excited when I think about a sub 40 run where the "general gameplay" sucks. Would be a nice trick show. A 35 run would be even more enjoyable. Cant wait to see your runs Tonski and Cpadolf, keep up the good work.

Oh, and sorry if I sounded too strict on the hotaburi thing, I just feel bad for various reasons when someones name (be it nick or real) is spelled wrong, especially our great hero. :) [/end this offtopicness now]

Well yeah, maybe those PAL times are meant to be a little higher, but dont try to think it is the clock here that matters the most.

Setting that time thingie aside, I just wanted to help you get some ideas how to make your overall speed better, Tonski. It would be nice if everyone could help each other here. Well, I failed miserably because my gameplay sucks and I play the wrong version, so lets just forget that. Luckily, you seem to know precisely how to adjust your gameplay all the time. Maybe I was stupid to ask some sample of both of your gameplay too, I should also be more aggressive on my own when it comes to improving my overall playing.

I got excited when I think about a sub 40 run where the "general gameplay" sucks. Would be a nice trick show. A 35 run would be even more enjoyable. Cant wait to see your runs Tonski and Cpadolf, keep up the good work.

Oh, and sorry if I sounded too strict on the hotaburi thing, I just feel bad for various reasons when someones name (be it nick or real) is spelled wrong, especially our great hero.  :)  [/end this offtopicness now]

Tonski

2007-04-15 01:55:59 pm

Yeah Cpadolf those flowers can really ruin an excellent segment. There are many things that ruin your segment just like that, that's why I don't like extra long segments in this game. :) My sub 40 aim time run will have 5 saves:

Norfair after high jump
8 min
Wrecked Ship after Phantoon
15 or 16 min
Maridia before Botwoon
18 or 19
Lower Norfair before Ridley
24 or 25 min
Samus's gunship
ABSOLUTE MAX 30 min

Let's see how it all goes. I'm pretty sure getting an 8 min after high jump isn't all that hard in comparison. The next segment will be very hard when you think that you have to take care of Phantoon after a long long segment and succeed in many tricks. 2 round kill would be awesome, though very very hard... I started my run today, only played Ceres. Excellent speed, but runaway only had 43 secs left...

Lance you "can't wait for our runs"? I'm not recording mine. :P The clock isn't the main problem I know, and Lance I'm actually getting my overall speed better here, not that it totally sucks but anyway. :)

Yeah Cpadolf those flowers can really ruin an excellent segment. There are many things that ruin your segment just like that, that's why I don't like extra long segments in this game. :) My sub 40 aim time run will have 5 saves:

Norfair after high jump
8 min
Wrecked Ship after Phantoon
15 or 16 min
Maridia before Botwoon
18 or 19
Lower Norfair before Ridley
24 or 25 min
Samus's gunship
ABSOLUTE MAX 30 min

Let's see how it all goes. I'm pretty sure getting an 8 min after high jump isn't all that hard in comparison. The next segment will be very hard when you think that you have to take care of Phantoon after a long long segment and succeed in many tricks. 2 round kill would be awesome, though very very hard... I started my run today, only played Ceres. Excellent speed, but runaway only had 43 secs left...

Lance you "can't wait for our runs"? I'm not recording mine. :P The clock isn't the main problem I know, and Lance I'm actually getting my overall speed better here, not that it totally sucks but anyway. :)

Lance Uppercut

2007-04-15 03:07:14 pm

Yeah I know you are not recording your runs, thats why I said I would like to (or I am wishing) see some kind of gameplay from you guys. Although if you seriously are going to claim records you must have something to back it up with :)

Yeah, I guess the overall speed is just improvable with lots of repetition and perhaps trying some different solutions to things.

Tonski

2007-04-15 04:30:05 pm

If I'll get that 39 min I'll take a picture from my TV that shows 39 min and you can see the PAL-console and game. I think that's enough of proof. :) The main problem for now is actually getting that time.

I could always try to record some footage with my miniDV-recorder, but the quality would be crap and all. I'll just post smv some day if I'll make NTSC-version any% SS run. Note the if there.

Lance Uppercut

2007-04-15 06:10:51 pm

Sounds cool allright.

Still, dont the official records require a whole run somehow on video? We are not talking about some 90s Nintendo magazine here anymore :) Well, my point being it would be nice if you somehow manage to record your console run(s) as well. I know it is hard so maybe it is a no no at the end. Of course this recording stuff concerns everyone who want to prove their own gameplay (to the "authorities")...

Cpadolf

2007-04-16 07:41:33 am

Almost happy

I've got 19 before botwoon now but i'm not completley satisfied yet, i want to improve atleast 15 seaconds more beacuse even though it was my best so far i missed one essential damage boost and got stuck in one flower, the rest of the run was really good with only very minor screwups.

Even though i now realise that getting 18 will be impossible after my first save time witch i think i accepted a little to early, i will proceed and if im not capable of getting 39 in the end i will probably start a new run the instantly, trying to improove even more.

Tonski, new save route looks great, wish you all luck and would not be to surprised if you get 39 before me.

Tonski

2007-04-16 07:46:30 am

As said, I could record my segments but the quality would be crap and it would take a lot of time too. Besides the summer is coming and I'll be more outside in the sun. 8-) And if the photo I take isn't proof enough for someone (if i'll even get sub 40) then it's his problem. I can record my first segment just for kicks if I have the time and I'm dedicated enough. If it all works well and the quality isn't killing bad I could record all the segments and upload them to youtube. aiwebs_016

I'm only practicing on the moment. 9 min is so damn easy to get to the first save point, but getting it down to 8 minutes will be small challenge. :P I'll possibly try to record it, but you have to understand that I would be using my miniDV-recorder that doesn't have AV in. That meaning I would have to record it by aiming the camera to television on some table and start the recording, then start playing and the screen would look like a small light show. grin new

I'll do some more testing on the evening.

AND as much as I would love to record my SS runs that is a big no. The real time is over 60 minutes and that's the limit one miniDV-cassette has, so the run would be cut off in the middle of everything.

Guitar playing and ZM low% also takes my time a lot. I should probably play that low%-run quickly so that I could return to my sub 40 attempt. Also I'm badly trying to learn a killer solo on guitar that I somehow feel impossible in some places, though I can play many parts in it.

EDIT:
Cpadolf that's awesome! Getting 19 before Botwoon isn't all that run killer, but you have to save that one minute later in the game. I'm only testing my run on the moment, trying to get that 8 min after first segment and trying to record it. Also Phantoon 2 round would be very good time saver though hard.

As said, I could record my segments but the quality would be crap and it would take a lot of time too. Besides the summer is coming and I'll be more outside in the sun.  8-) And if the photo I take isn't proof enough for someone (if i'll even get sub 40) then it's his problem. I can record my first segment just for kicks if I have the time and I'm dedicated enough. If it all works well and the quality isn't killing bad I could record all the segments and upload them to youtube.  [aiwebs_016]

I'm only practicing on the moment. 9 min is so damn easy to get to the first save point, but getting it down to 8 minutes will be small challenge.  :P  I'll possibly try to record it, but you have to understand that I would be using my miniDV-recorder that doesn't have AV in. That meaning I would have to record it by aiming the camera to television on some table and start the recording, then start playing and the screen would look like a small light show.  :grinnew: I'll do some more testing on the evening.

AND as much as I would love to record my SS runs that is a big no. The real time is over 60 minutes and that's the limit one miniDV-cassette has, so the run would be cut off in the middle of everything.

Guitar playing and ZM low% also takes my time a lot. I should probably play that low%-run quickly so that I could return to my sub 40 attempt. Also I'm badly trying to learn a killer solo on guitar that I somehow feel impossible in some places, though I can play many parts in it. http://youtube.com/watch?v=VEESPSMxafA

EDIT:
Cpadolf that's awesome! Getting 19 before Botwoon isn't all that run killer, but you have to save that one minute later in the game. I'm only testing my run on the moment, trying to get that 8 min after first segment and trying to record it. Also Phantoon 2 round would be very good time saver though hard.

Cpadolf

2007-04-16 08:02:18 am

Almost happy

Yes phantoon 2 round whould indeed be a great timesaver, i imagine that the time saved from charging and shoting your beam 4-5 times plus the time he normaly takes to disapear, reaperar, and become voulnarable whould be about 30 seconds, but timing the wave/powerbomb combo with hiw ought to be realy hard.(never tried but still it sounds crazy) This will be something i will learn to do if i fail at getting 39 this time through.

Tonski

2007-04-16 02:36:37 pm

As I said in the "i need help" -topic I will not be using the Phantoon 2 round tactique. It's just simply crazy and even from Hotarubi it took some savestates to succeed. 3 rounding that ghost with fast opening eyes is enough for me, that is of course if I manage to get a 15 at WS save room. If not, 2 rounding will probably be my only chance...

...but who said you have to hit him with pb shield for 2 round match? ;)

EDIT:
I decided not to record my run. First I tried to record it the way I said, and it looks very bad... I mean the quality just is so bad you can barely see what's happening on the screen.

Second, I'm not that good player after all, and playing with camera just makes me more nervous. With my first record attempt I only managed to get 10 min at the first save point.. 10 minutes!! That's like the worst segment you can get at that point.

Third, you can hear all the buttons for example if you're arm punping it sounds like someone's clapping his hands loud.

072

2007-04-17 12:36:17 am

coral to complement blue

Here's some advice for getting those four shots in:

If you start charging your beam as Phantoon is passing through the wall to the right, he should circle around and be on the exact left side of the room when the combo kicks in. If you get in 2 Wave+Spazer shots as quickly as you can (While on Power Bombs, to save you the trouble later) , and then pause to turn off spazer, the timing should be precise anyway. Just remember to be as left in the room as you can.

Keep in mind, I've never actually two-rounded Phantoon yet. I've just come very close, as I wasn't the whole way to the left, he just passed me a few frames before the combo went off.

I've never seen it done either, so to clarify, this is the process, correct?:

Round 1: Charged Ice+Wave x2, Missile, Charged Ice+Wave+Spazer.
Round 2: Charged Wave+Spazer x2, Wave Beam combo.

Cpadolf

2007-04-17 04:36:24 am

Almost happy

...but who said you have to hit him with pb shield for 2 round match?

And what do you mean by that? can you do it in some other way?(not on Emu)

BlueGlass

2007-04-17 01:07:37 pm

Quote from 072:

I've never seen it done either, so to clarify, this is the process, correct?:

Round 1: Charged Ice+Wave x2, Missile, Charged Ice+Wave+Spazer.
Round 2: Charged Wave+Spazer x2, Wave Beam combo.

No.

round 1: 2 charged wave/spazer (420 damage), wave beam shield (1620 damage)
round 2: charged wave/spazer (1820 damage), missile (1920 damage), super mssile (2520 damage).

Tonski

2007-04-17 02:28:20 pm

You can 2 round Phantoon by using strutted walking and shooting missiles at the same time. It's very hard but possible, and less manipulation is needed. This way is more based on skill, but there's a lot of it needed IMO.

072

2007-04-17 04:53:58 pm

coral to complement blue

Oh, I'm quite aware of the missile method, but I don't think it's an option. For me, anyway.

Since I will almost certainly have 1 Power Bomb at the phantoon fight, I need to make sure I get refills from Phantoon. If I am on a low missile supply, and a low health supply from the spark getting to the wrecked ship, AND a low super missile supply, there is no way that I'm going to get enough Power Bombs for the top of the ship and the maridia tube...

Plus, it's difficult to pull off. =P Even if you can do it, it should probably be left for the 100% runs.

Quote:

round 1: 2 charged wave/spazer (420 damage), wave beam shield (1620 damage)
round 2: charged wave/spazer (1820 damage), missile (1920 damage), super mssile (2520 damage).

Okay, thanks. I didn't know whether or not the wave beam combo would put Phantoon into his "top of the room" phase, like a super missile does.

BlueGlass

2007-04-18 01:07:46 am

I'm pretty sure even two-rounding Phantoon with missiles is undoable without tool-assistance. The preciseness of pressing the shoot button every ten frames for even one second is probabl byond human capabilities let alone 1.5 (approximately the amount of time you have to keep shooting missiles in each round for a two-round missile kill, with a super at the end of the second round).

Cpadolf

2007-04-20 12:06:38 pm

Almost happy

whould it even be possible to do phantoon quick kill on PAL version even if it was tool assisted? With the frame differenses and all that.

BTW i was sick for 3 days and werent in school, therefore i had much time to play and decided to start over aiming for 18 before botwoon and finaly got it today :P. Suddenly i feel very confident in getting 39 grin new

Tonski

2007-04-20 12:46:30 pm

I'm sure it's possible Cpadolf. With tool-assistance almost everything is possible. Rolling Eyes

I in the other hand am not going to start with my sub 40 attempt any% yet. I might try the first segment some day, but I'm getting Metroid Fusion any day soon, and I'm pretty much interested in my low% ZM run on the moment. I'm losing only 1 minute to the known WR time which is done by MASTER-88. I think I could possibly get sub 44, which would possibly be the second best time on M2K2 from all the information I've been given by him. aiwebs_016

Now you see why my speedruns take such a while, I have so many of them going on at the same time. Besides I'm really trying to get my grades up at school and try to learn how to play guitar in advanced level. It's all excuses I know, but still.

Your overall speed is amazing Cpadolf, you'll get 39 if not 38 before me no doubt there. You're already leading my 43 min by 3 minutes, which means it's dead sure you're gonna get that sub 40! Good luck with that man. Go go go! ;)

And last but not least: I'm finally getting Metroid Fusion!! extra_smug

(yea I know I said it already but I'm excited) 0% tries here I come! (note word "tries")

I'm sure it's possible Cpadolf. With tool-assistance almost everything is possible.  :roll:

I in the other hand am not going to start with my sub 40 attempt any% yet. I might try the first segment some day, but I'm getting Metroid Fusion any day soon, and I'm pretty much interested in my low% ZM run on the moment. I'm losing only 1 minute to the known WR time which is done by MASTER-88. I think I could possibly get sub 44, which would possibly be the second best time on M2K2 from all the information I've been given by him.  [aiwebs_016]  Now you see why my speedruns take such a while, I have so many of them going on at the same time. Besides I'm really trying to get my grades up at school and try to learn how to play guitar in advanced level. It's all excuses I know, but still.

Your overall speed is amazing Cpadolf, you'll get 39 if not 38 before me no doubt there. You're already leading my 43 min by 3 minutes, which means it's dead sure you're gonna get that sub 40! Good luck with that man. Go go go! ;)

And last but not least: [b]I'm finally getting Metroid Fusion!![/b]  :extra_smug: (yea I know I said it already but I'm excited) 0% tries here I come! (note word "tries")

nate

2007-04-20 01:19:23 pm

go go go!

JaggerG

2007-04-20 08:57:16 pm

Shifty Leader

That M2k2 guy

Quote from Tonski:

0% tries here I come!

I almost said something if not for that note. Good thing I didn't say anything.

Saturn

2007-04-30 02:49:24 pm

New personal record for me again!

Any% in 0:42 with 27% - Single Segmented

The tradition is continuing: Since 2005 (started with 0:44) I could improve my any% time by 1 min every new year. :)

This run is once again somewhat improved in skill-based techniques, and maybe slightly in boss fights. However it also has some flaws, like the need to repeat Zebetite skip trick 3 times in order to get it to work. But nevertheless it's a overall faster run to still hold 0:42 despite of that, and played with more knowledge and skill than the previous ones.

Enjoy!

PS:
Only 10 min left till WR! Hotarubi, I come for you! :-P
(joke)

Tonski

2007-04-30 04:44:01 pm

Just finished watching it. Pretty nicely done, but I think you have a couple of things to work on and sub 40 shouldn't be a problem:
-More speedtricks (gravity shine, pillar room shine)
-Faster boss fights. No offence or anything but those were really slow in my opinion.

Still I have to thank you. Watching this got my mind back on Super Metroid and probably I could try my PAL-version sub 40 min attempt tomorrow, the first segment of course. :P

EDIT:
I tried this on emulator too, there's .smv attachement in this post. This was played on a crappy Microsoft controller that has the d-pad twisted so when you push left, you actually almost kneel down. Needing a better controller. I beg of you guys, give me one of those things that let me hook up my SNES controller with my computer...

...please? grin new

attachment:

Tonski - testing the beginning.smv

Lance Uppercut

2007-04-30 06:23:45 pm

Congrats on the new record Saturn! Now we shall race who reaches sub-40 first!! With your pace this means I have....2 or 3 years to make my time 2min in-game time better (to reach 00:39) :P

That short-charge sure is a GUNSHIP/KRAID to me Shocked

Tonski, I can see you want to show us what a bad controller can do to your gameplay. Must be enraging. I really hope to see you play on a good controller on an emulator some day. Cant you buy some kind of usb-adapter or something for your regular controller? (I dont know about these things, simple yes or no from anyone will do without getting mad at me about this, its just a simple question)

(look, I can censor my own post already) extra_smug

moozooh

2007-04-30 06:54:07 pm

Quote from Tonski:

I beg of you guys, give me one of those things that let me hook up my SNES controller with my computer...

Quote from Lance Uppercut:

Cant you buy some kind of usb-adapter or something for your regular controller?

Nice reading skills, Lance! :P