Working on Suitless run for Super Metroid (not speed)

view all posts by ducknerd

2007-11-07 02:39:33 pm

yeah

I've decided it's about time I started my Suitless run for this game. I can't record it yet, but I just wanted to announce that I'll be starting it soon. I won't be a speed run, since whenever I try to do good I fuck up, and when I'm not trying to do good I do good. :-s I still need to get used to the SNES controller though. I've come to the conclusion that it's not old; it was just made that way and it takes some getting used to. Like I said, all my control pads (except DS and SP) feel just as "wobbly" as my SNES control pad. I'll probably be starting this during Thanksgiving vacation and will record it sometime in late December/January (that's when I get my DVD recorder). I don't know if this will be featured on Archive or not, since ducknerd is already working on one.

Thread title:

ducknerd:

registered on 2006-12-23 11:16:33 am.

Gender: male

Location: Not where you are

ducknerd

2007-11-07 11:25:14 pm

Eschews avatars

I've kinda put that run on hiatus, as the very early x-ray strategy I made has proven a bit much for my patience. With a couple weeks of spare time (not going to happen anytime soon thanks to courseloads this year) I might try to get past that segment and finish it up. Meanwhile, I wholeheartedly encourage you to give it a shot. If you'd like, I can supply what is probably an ideal route, complete with good save points, that is based on Saturn's 1:04 test run a couple months back. Good luck and don't let Lower Norfair get you down!

ING-X:

registered on 2005-11-19 05:27:17 pm.

Gender: male

Location: The Lylat System

view all posts by ducknerd

2007-11-08 02:05:05 pm

yeah

Quote from ducknerd:

If you'd like, I can supply what is probably an ideal route, complete with good save points, that is based on Saturn's 1:04 test run a couple months back.

Okay. Is it different than the route in your FAQ?

ducknerd:

registered on 2006-12-23 11:16:33 am.

Gender: male

Location: Not where you are

ducknerd

2007-11-08 06:39:29 pm

Eschews avatars

That's actually an RBO guide, and jeez I need to update that thing. The route:
1. Normal route up till Red Brinstar, except take the following items besides easy missile pickups: collect blue brinstar energy tank via damage boost as explained on the updated page,(BTW, was that actually my discovery, or did someone else find that a long time ago?) collect Spore Spawn's supers early w/ the scrolling glitch, get the reserve tank next to the mockball supers. At red brinstar, go up for both packs of power bombs, save.
2. Go through red brinstar, collect early x-ray (very difficult and my exact strategy is a little long for this post, but it saves a lengthy and boring backtrack), kill Kraid, collect hijump, save.
3. Do all of Upper Norfair naturally (Speed, Wave), then fight Crocomire and collect all items in his zone, grab ice beam, enter maridia clearing the first room using the gravity jump from the noob tube, get maridia supers, go normally to snail room, save.
4. Go normally (route-wise not room-strategy-wise, this is a short segment because nearly every room requires a special strat) to just before Draygon.
5. Fight Draygon using Saturn's strat (slightly slower and necessitates grapple and xray, but much more reliable and lets you get space jump; see his testrun), save where you were before.
6. Backtrack through Maridia (you can't go the normal way to plasma) to the post-Botwoon room, fall through sand to snail room, fall through whichever bottom sandpit you like but either way take the transport tube up, get plasma and exit via the far-east elevator, enter Wrecked Ship from behind, 2-round Phantoon (again see the testrun), do the Crateria/Brinstar cleanup 100%-run-style (it's still debatable what you do and don't need to get to survive Lower Norfair; this is probably the most disputed part of the run), cleanup should take you back to red brinstar, save in first Norfair save station. This segment is really long, but none of it is hard at all.
7. Do LN up to the KiHunter save station just like my RBO guide, but skip the Gold Torizo BS.
8. Fight Ridley. Save where you came from.
9. Escape Lower Norfair, refill at the ship(?), finish the game.

Exact x-ray collection times, Draygon strategies, and Brinstar cleanup routes are disputed, and this thread could be a great place to discuss them.

That's actually an RBO guide, and jeez I need to update that thing. The route:
1. Normal route up till Red Brinstar, except take the following items besides easy missile pickups: collect blue brinstar energy tank via damage boost as explained on the updated page,(BTW, was that actually my discovery, or did someone else find that a long time ago?) collect Spore Spawn's supers early w/ the scrolling glitch, get the reserve tank next to the mockball supers. At red brinstar, go up for both packs of power bombs, save.
2. Go through red brinstar, collect early x-ray (very difficult and my exact strategy is a little long for this post, but it saves a lengthy and boring backtrack), kill Kraid, collect hijump, save.
3. Do all of Upper Norfair naturally (Speed, Wave), then fight Crocomire and collect all items in his zone, grab ice beam, enter maridia clearing the first room using the gravity jump from the noob tube, get maridia supers, go normally to snail room, save.
4. Go normally (route-wise not room-strategy-wise, this is a short segment because nearly every room requires a special strat) to just before Draygon.
5. Fight Draygon using Saturn's strat (slightly slower and necessitates grapple and xray, but much more reliable and lets you get space jump; see his testrun), save where you were before.
6. Backtrack through Maridia (you can't go the normal way to plasma) to the post-Botwoon room, fall through sand to snail room, fall through whichever bottom sandpit you like but either way take the transport tube up, get plasma and exit via the far-east elevator, enter Wrecked Ship from behind, 2-round Phantoon (again see the testrun), do the Crateria/Brinstar cleanup 100%-run-style (it's still debatable what you do and don't need to get to survive Lower Norfair; this is probably the most disputed part of the run), cleanup should take you back to red brinstar, save in first Norfair save station. This segment is really long, but none of it is hard at all.
7. Do LN up to the KiHunter save station just like my RBO guide, but skip the Gold Torizo BS. 
8. Fight Ridley. Save where you came from.
9. Escape Lower Norfair, refill at the ship(?), finish the game.

Exact x-ray collection times, Draygon strategies, and Brinstar cleanup routes are disputed, and this thread could be a great place to discuss them.

Fano7:

registered on 2007-09-01 09:26:53 am.

Gender: male

2007-11-08 06:53:23 pm

Every Bit Counts

Quote from ducknerd:

collect blue brinstar energy tank via damage boost as explained on the updated page,(BTW, was that actually my discovery, or did someone else find that a long time ago?)

I found it a few months ago, I just never said anything because I thought it was know. It was when I first tried to get that E-Tank without hi-jump, and at the time I sucked at bombjumping. I didn't even know how to do a damage boost. I just did it without thinking. And that FAQ does need updating.

ING-X:

registered on 2005-11-19 05:27:17 pm.

Gender: male

Location: The Lylat System

view all posts by Lance Uppercut

2007-11-08 07:06:36 pm

yeah

Quote from ducknerd:

That's actually an RBO guide, and jeez I need to update that thing. The route:
1. Normal route up till Red Brinstar, except take the following items besides easy missile pickups: collect blue brinstar energy tank via damage boost as explained on the updated page,(BTW, was that actually my discovery, or did someone else find that a long time ago?) collect Spore Spawn's supers early w/ the scrolling glitch, get the reserve tank next to the mockball supers. At red brinstar, go up for both packs of power bombs, save.
2. Go through red brinstar, collect early x-ray (very difficult and my exact strategy is a little long for this post, but it saves a lengthy and boring backtrack), kill Kraid, collect hijump, save.
3. Do all of Upper Norfair naturally (Speed, Wave), then fight Crocomire and collect all items in his zone, grab ice beam, enter maridia clearing the first room using the gravity jump from the noob tube, get maridia supers, go normally to snail room, save.
4. Go normally (route-wise not room-strategy-wise, this is a short segment because nearly every room requires a special strat) to just before Draygon.
5. Fight Draygon using Saturn's strat (slightly slower and necessitates grapple and xray, but much more reliable and lets you get space jump; see his testrun), save where you were before.
6. Backtrack through Maridia (you can't go the normal way to plasma) to the post-Botwoon room, fall through sand to snail room, fall through whichever bottom sandpit you like but either way take the transport tube up, get plasma and exit via the far-east elevator, enter Wrecked Ship from behind, 2-round Phantoon (again see the testrun), do the Crateria/Brinstar cleanup 100%-run-style (it's still debatable what you do and don't need to get to survive Lower Norfair; this is probably the most disputed part of the run), cleanup should take you back to red brinstar, save in first Norfair save station. This segment is really long, but none of it is hard at all.
7. Do LN up to the KiHunter save station just like my RBO guide, but skip the Gold Torizo BS.
8. Fight Ridley. Save where you came from.
9. Escape Lower Norfair, refill at the ship(?), finish the game.

Exact x-ray collection times, Draygon strategies, and Brinstar cleanup routes are disputed, and this thread could be a great place to discuss them.

Thanks. I think I might print this out. And just to emphasize the point that has been made throughout this entire thread, your FAQ really needs updating. :P

[quote="ducknerd"]
That's actually an RBO guide, and jeez I need to update that thing. The route:
1. Normal route up till Red Brinstar, except take the following items besides easy missile pickups: collect blue brinstar energy tank via damage boost as explained on the updated page,(BTW, was that actually my discovery, or did someone else find that a long time ago?) collect Spore Spawn's supers early w/ the scrolling glitch, get the reserve tank next to the mockball supers. At red brinstar, go up for both packs of power bombs, save.
2. Go through red brinstar, collect early x-ray (very difficult and my exact strategy is a little long for this post, but it saves a lengthy and boring backtrack), kill Kraid, collect hijump, save.
3. Do all of Upper Norfair naturally (Speed, Wave), then fight Crocomire and collect all items in his zone, grab ice beam, enter maridia clearing the first room using the gravity jump from the noob tube, get maridia supers, go normally to snail room, save.
4. Go normally (route-wise not room-strategy-wise, this is a short segment because nearly every room requires a special strat) to just before Draygon.
5. Fight Draygon using Saturn's strat (slightly slower and necessitates grapple and xray, but much more reliable and lets you get space jump; see his testrun), save where you were before.
6. Backtrack through Maridia (you can't go the normal way to plasma) to the post-Botwoon room, fall through sand to snail room, fall through whichever bottom sandpit you like but either way take the transport tube up, get plasma and exit via the far-east elevator, enter Wrecked Ship from behind, 2-round Phantoon (again see the testrun), do the Crateria/Brinstar cleanup 100%-run-style (it's still debatable what you do and don't need to get to survive Lower Norfair; this is probably the most disputed part of the run), cleanup should take you back to red brinstar, save in first Norfair save station. This segment is really long, but none of it is hard at all.
7. Do LN up to the KiHunter save station just like my RBO guide, but skip the Gold Torizo BS. 
8. Fight Ridley. Save where you came from.
9. Escape Lower Norfair, refill at the ship(?), finish the game.

Exact x-ray collection times, Draygon strategies, and Brinstar cleanup routes are disputed, and this thread could be a great place to discuss them. 
[/quote]

Thanks. I think I might print this out. And just to emphasize the point that has been made throughout this entire thread, your FAQ really needs updating. :P

Lance Uppercut:

registered on 2006-12-30 05:56:19 pm.

Lance Uppercut

Edit history:

Lance Uppercut: 2007-11-08 08:26:06 pm

2007-11-08 08:17:05 pm

Quote from Fano7:

Quote from ducknerd:

collect blue brinstar energy tank via damage boost as explained on the updated page,(BTW, was that actually my discovery, or did someone else find that a long time ago?)

I found it a few months ago, I just never said anything because I thought it was know. It was when I first tried to get that E-Tank without hi-jump, and at the time I sucked at bombjumping. I didn't even know how to do a damage boost. I just did it without thinking. And that FAQ does need updating.

Sorry boys, no winner here. The japanese community has know that trick probably for years. I posted it to the "I need help" -thread or similar some half a year ago.
(EDIT: found it http://forum.metroid2002.com/index.php/topic,3440.340.html )

Was it just added to the main page? I thought it was there before but I guess I am wrong.

Kejardon:

registered on 2004-12-07 07:21:36 pm.

Gender: male

view all posts by Kejardon

Kejardon

2007-11-09 12:23:30 am

Embarrasing Fact: Power suit made by lowest bidder

Me and dj_ also found that independently years ago. It's not a hard trick to figure out.

Saturn:

registered on 2005-09-01 03:34:43 pm.

view all posts by Saturn

Saturn

Edit history:

Saturn: 2007-11-09 09:32:44 am

2007-11-09 09:21:14 am

Same here. I used to get this tank on my console in the 90s already (to ease early Gauntlet, which I often tried for challenge :)).

Regarding the route, ducknerds suggestion is a good one, though I doubt early X-Ray is really worth in a console/unassisted run. It's 1st - very risky (and thus requires a unnecessary segment you can skip otherwise and save ~10 sec for that alone), and 2nd - you need to backtrack for the blue Brinstar E-Tank anyway, so it would be nearly same fast in the end, especially because of the double elevator ride that takes alot of unnecessary time. If you skip early X-Ray, you can skip the blue Brinsar Tank as well, which I did in my 1:04 Suitless run. Norfair items might get a bit hard with this missing Tank, but with good strategies you can still get them without any serious troubles.

Lance Uppercut:

registered on 2006-12-30 05:56:19 pm.

view all posts by Lance Uppercut

Lance Uppercut

2007-11-09 01:04:17 pm

Wow, now we had a small glimpse of information about how SMI was constructed in Saturns head =)

I agree with skipping the Blue Brinstar tank, those elevator rides and all that just eat up too much time and you will visit nearby again anyway, might as well pick it up then. Also the run gets more spiced up when you have a little extra danger with it (when collecting Norfair items).

ING-X:

registered on 2005-11-19 05:27:17 pm.

Gender: male

Location: The Lylat System

view all posts by Bolognab

Edit history:

ING-X: 2007-11-09 02:43:12 pm

2007-11-09 02:15:03 pm

yeah

You guys are aware that this isn't a speed run, right?

Bolognab:

registered on 2007-06-25 09:25:06 am.

Bolognab

2007-11-09 03:15:55 pm

Is there something wrong with the sensor in the new forum?

ING-X:

registered on 2005-11-19 05:27:17 pm.

Gender: male

Location: The Lylat System

2007-11-09 03:20:49 pm

yeah

Quote from Bolognab:

Is there something wrong with the sensor in the new forum?

No, nate just got rid of it.

Fano7:

registered on 2007-09-01 09:26:53 am.

Gender: male

2007-11-09 03:27:19 pm

Every Bit Counts

What did that have to do with the topic?

ING-X:

registered on 2005-11-19 05:27:17 pm.

Gender: male

Location: The Lylat System

view all posts by ducknerd

2007-11-09 05:57:41 pm

yeah

Dunno. Shouldn't Saturn's strat for Draygon be put on the main site (in the "Skipping the Gravity Suit: Draygon" section)?

ducknerd:

registered on 2006-12-23 11:16:33 am.

Gender: male

Location: Not where you are

ducknerd

2007-11-09 06:21:58 pm

Eschews avatars

No, not really, since it's luck-dependent. Draygon has to do a swoop round, then a spew round--a 1/4 chance (I think it's equal chances between those two attacks?). Otherwise, he just runs into your crystal-flashing state and you die instantly. Also, not to be overly harsh, but if this isn't a speedrun, did this really warrant a topic? The old Suitless topic, Saturn's run, and my guide together should be plenty of info for you.

Fano7:

registered on 2007-09-01 09:26:53 am.

Gender: male

2007-11-09 06:33:04 pm

Every Bit Counts

where is that topic?

ING-X:

registered on 2005-11-19 05:27:17 pm.

Gender: male

Location: The Lylat System

view all posts by Bolognab

2007-11-09 06:52:18 pm

yeah

Quote from ducknerd:

Also, not to be overly harsh, but if this isn't a speedrun, did this really warrant a topic? The old Suitless topic, Saturn's run, and my guide together should be plenty of info for you.

I don't have the skill or patience necessary to speedrun this game. I wanted to make a run of the game much like Scarlet's NBMB where speed is not an issue, and the real purpose of the video is to just do the run without being pressured. But if something intense like this won't be of any value unless it's a speed run I might as well just not waste my time.

Bolognab:

registered on 2007-06-25 09:25:06 am.

Bolognab

2007-11-09 07:15:20 pm

Quote from Fano7:

What did that have to do with the topic?

Curse words used to be replaced with gunship/flickerbat/other junk. And I read a few curses and I thought the system was messed up...but, apparently not..

Lance Uppercut:

registered on 2006-12-30 05:56:19 pm.

view all posts by Lance Uppercut

Lance Uppercut

2007-11-09 07:39:10 pm

Some people are so eager to make new topics to announce their projects or intentions. How about finishing something for a change? It is also not a bad idea to work in secret and then surprise everyone here. More action, less talk :)

Do we really need a new topic every time someone starts on something and then the topic dies after few dozen posts if not earlier. There is no need for 10 topics for low% runs or suitless runs, I could manage with just one for each. You know, posting into an existing topic brings it "up in the chain" and everyone can see that there is something going on.

ING-X:

registered on 2005-11-19 05:27:17 pm.

Gender: male

Location: The Lylat System

Edit history:

ING-X: 2007-11-10 05:42:58 pm

2007-11-10 01:16:06 am

yeah

I didn't even know there was a topic for this. But now that this topic is here we might as well post in it. :) Like I said, I'll probably be starting this in late November (due to my addiction to Star Fox 64) and recording it after Christmas, so it'll probably be done in a few months.

EDIT: I have decided to make the recorded version of this a speedrun. Since this is a more casual speedrun, I won't be resetting after small mistakes. I will make a test run first, which will not be a speed run, but like I said the recorded version will be, so wish me luck! :)

Fano7:

registered on 2007-09-01 09:26:53 am.

Gender: male

2007-11-10 09:37:49 pm

Every Bit Counts

Good luck. :D

ING-X:

registered on 2005-11-19 05:27:17 pm.

Gender: male

Location: The Lylat System